leather back compatability???

[geckoejon]

hello,
just wondering about italian and american leather backs being compatable? as in if i mated one of each what would the babies most likely turn out to be?
thanks...
jonathan

 

[midmichicer]

Leather to leather would be: 25% Normals, 25% Silkbacks, and 50% Leatherbacks.

 

[lizzywoodwardBD]

Yes the italian and american leathers are comparable. A lot of people recommend that you do that to out cross them as much as possible.

 

[geckoejon]

Thanks for the info! I will keep it in mind. I will probably just go with another Italian and keep it pure, so to speak. Besides, I think the silk backs look kinda ugly like a uro. Lol IMO
Jonathan

 

[lizzywoodwardBD]

If you breed two leatherbacks together you will get silkbacks for sure just to let you know.

 

[geckoejon]

Oooohhhhh.... I missunderstood. I thought I would get them if I crossed American and Italian. Thanks for the clarity "lizzy" :idea:

Jonathan

 

[geckoejon]

P.s. I see you have a "smoothy" I've seen those mentioned. T
What kind of morph is that? Mind posting a pic? I kept colubrids and Pitts for a couple decades, but beardies I'm a newby at
Jonathan

 

[lizzywoodwardBD]

No problem but yes if you breed two leathers or a leather and an american smoothie both will result in silkbacks. If you just want leathers you can just breed a leather to a normal.

 

[Nimbus]

I have a question about this that hopefully the more experienced breeders can clarify. From what I've read, the Italian leatherback acts as a dominant (need only one copy of the leatherback gene variation to express) while the American leatherback acts as a recessive (need two copies of the gene to express). Are the Italian and American leatherbacks actually the same gene? Has anyone crossed the two, and what were the results? It's not clear from the following genetics pages: http://www.mbdragons.eu/en/genetica.html, http://www.dachiu.com/beardeddragoncare/codominant.html . The resulting phenotype (what it looks like) is the same (reduced scales and tubercles), but not sure if it's the same gene?

Edit: Looks like I found the answer on the forum elsewhere, and a few other sites: http://www.beardeddragon.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=148546, http://www.hadesdragons.co.uk/leatherback.html, http://www.alphadragonz.com/alpha-cms/Gallery/?g2_itemId=1790. Other sites point to these being variants of the same gene, and that a cross of the two will produce some silkbacks.

 

[phantomdragons]

Italian and American leathers are both codominant and are compatible. The difference is the Italian leathers are more smooth and uniform, the american leathers can be variable. You get some that are definately leathers, others that are questionable, and normal scaled. The italian leathers are either smooth, or normal scaled, no in-between. The structure of the two lines are different. Italian leathers are shorter/stockier, american leathers are longer/leaner.

When crossing the two lines(leather to leather), you will get a combo of the two lines(silkbacks), american leathers,italian leathers, and normal scaled. It is hard to distinguish between the american and italian leathers, that's why I don't reccoment crossing the two.

Josh