Lethargy and feeble attempts at eating. Vet is no help.

[tarantulahawk]

Now that I'm a part of a reputable community I have a question I would like to pose. The vet I mentioned throughout the thread ruled out brumation (it seems as if he's correct) because he's captive raised. Is this hogwash or legitimate?

 

[tarantulahawk]

That's good to hear , him doing better. You have the Powersun bulb now, correct ? You can feed him dusted crickets, but without D3 now because of the new bulb. Offer greens if he'll take them, and lower the amount of crickets to just a few a day to hopefully spark interest in the greens. As he becomes more hydrated he may want less of the smoothie, but try to get some in him at least 2-3X a week .

Hey so I took Ziggy outside today for some sun and he defecated. It was really watery and I just wanna make sure this isn't another health issue. Below you can see his dropping as the dark, bumpy lump surrounded by the liquid that also came out. Is this normal? Also I asked some questions that nobody answered and I was wondering if you could provide some input to those as well.

 

[AHBD]

I can't make out much from the picture, it all blends in and also my computer screen is dark and I can't make things out as well I would like to.

Brumation happens ALL the time in captive dragons, the great majority do so , esp. in states that have a cooler/colder season. For 25 years owning beardies most of my adults sleep from 1-3 months.

 

[kyleena29]

Can you make a list of the questions that were left unanswered? I tried looking back but not sure what you're referring to.

In regards to his stool, if you took away the puddle of water would you think it looked normal? If they are extra hydrated they can have a little puddle.

 

[kingofnobbys]

Now that I'm a part of a reputable community I have a question I would like to pose. The vet I mentioned throughout the thread ruled out brumation (it seems as if he's correct) because he's captive raised. Is this hogwash or legitimate?

Breeders will induce their captive bred breeders to brumate for several weeks over winter, the thought behind it is that it givens them a chance to rest up and it improves their breeding performance and fertility.
However, if the home the lizard is living in is warm year round and the photoperiod is kept constant and the food keeps comings , while the lizards might slow down a bit, they will stay awake over winter. None of my skinks or beardie have ever shown any desire or inclination to go down for the count over winter .... note I live in subtropical coastal northern NSW (lat = 33S) and our winters are very mild cf the winters most in this community experience (never freezing or frosty here) and my home is climate controlled 24/7 in winter to keep us warmer than 24degC.

 

[tarantulahawk]

Can you make a list of the questions that were left unanswered? I tried looking back but not sure what you're referring to.

In regards to his stool, if you took away the puddle of water would you think it looked normal? If they are extra hydrated they can have a little puddle.

1.Just exactly what are the ideal dimensions for a Bearded Dragon enclosure?

2.Is giving him calcium with D3 harmful to him now that he has the MVB? I still have some left and I wouldn't want it to go to waste.

I think that's it for the questions. To answer yours: His stool looked normal other than the lack of urate in this morning and evening stools.

 

[kyleena29]

I think they recommend 4x2x2 but you can always go bigger if you have the room. I personally have the 4x2x2. If I move to a place with more room I would build 6x2x2. I don't feel it needs to be any taller though.

I have mine on a 3x week calcium with no D3 and 2 days a week calcium with D3 and the other 2 days with vitamins. You could do that and be fine. There is a lot of debate whether they need D3 at all. A little won't hurt.

 

[AHBD]

Adult beardies do not need calcium every day, growing beardies do. But in all honesty you will hear different viewpoints. Too much calcium can cause hard urates and too much D3 can be toxic, although it's ard to say how much is too much.

As for forcing brumation, most owners actually TRY to keep their dragons from brumating but find that the dragon naturally wants to do so. So in the U.S where many states have a winter and the house is naturally cooler, the beardies try to brumate.....so it is very natural and has nothing at all to do with being captive bred. In many cases it's actually the opposite, beardies WANT to brumate but their owners keep them from doing it.

 

[kyleena29]

Yes you're right. My beardies are a year or less right now and was not realizing ziggy's age. What would you suggest for him on the calcium? 2 days without and 1 with d3 per week? Once or twice a week for vitamins?

 

[AHBD]

Yes, that's about the way I do except sometimes it's 2 days WITH D3 and 1 day without. All bugs are lightly coated but I don't coat the salads. I also recently bought the Repashy calcium plus which contains everything including vitamins and I use that lightly on the bugs 2-3 X a week now instead of straight calcium supplements..

 

[tarantulahawk]

Alright, so I should be giving him calcium 3 times a week. Twice with D3 the last without. How often should I give him vitamins? Twice a week? Should I give him crickets every day? How about greens/smoothie? Still 2-3 times a week? How about when he gets better? Still 20% Crickets and 80% Greens? How often would I give him calcium and vitamins then? Sorry if I'm making your repeat yourself, I just got confused with Kyleena's last post and I just want to make sure I have the correct info. Also he's been laying around all day. He's awake but he hasn't moved much at all today, gaping his mouth at times. The current temp under the bulb is 97.5 degrees F. He's just laying under the MVB. Is he basking or is it more serious? I introduced a hide today and he hasn't even moved toward it.

While I'm here: what are other good feeders? Perhaps I can get him interested in eating some worms.

 

[kyleena29]

Sorry, my last post was in reference to juveniles and not adults.

Calcium 3x week on 1 meal. You can just alternate between with d3 and without. Vitamins 2 days a week.

I would feed him bugs when you do calcium, so 3 days a week. I would stick with this schedule. He can have greens/smoothies daily.

He sounds pretty lethargic. Have you found a vet yet?

Other feeders are dubia roaches, silkworms, horn worms, butterworms, super worms.

 

[tarantulahawk]

Alright. And that all is what I should be doing now, correct? I have yet to find a vet, but I plan on doing that soon. This lethargy is curious because he's been as active this week as he has been for a while now. I hope he doesn't go back to being lethargic like this.

 

[kyleena29]

Yes that is what I would do. Something is causing him not to feel well. He really needs a good vet.

 

[tarantulahawk]

Excuse me, I meant to say that he's been more active this week than I've seen him in a while. Regardless I agree that he needs a good vet.