Swollen Leg and Foot

[Drache613]

Hello,

Keep us posted on your boy, I hope he is feeling better soon.

Tracie

 

[mygirlz]

Hello,

At least his appetite hasn't diminished any, that's great to hear.
I hope you get the Black cherry quickly. You can also get some alfalfa meal, which is purine free, to help supplement protein to help out the kidneys.
I agree, improper UVB likely has caused these symptoms.
That is a mini fluorescent which is essential a compact/coil type of light. Definitely upgrade to the Reptisun 10 tube, or you could even consider an upgrade to the T5 high output tube which emits even better UVB.
How is he doing today?

Tracie

He seems to be getting worse. I took him off crickets and gave him only fruits and veggies. He's not moving around much and it looks like his upper limbs are beginning to swell as well. I'm going to have to take him to the vet. I can't let him suffer. I will get the black cherry juice tomorrow and I felt so bad about not feeding him, that I gave him a few crickets this evening. He only ate 4. I actually have the Reptisun 10.0. I had misspoken in the previous post. It came with his habitat in February. He can get as close as 6" from it on his basking tree and limbs. It is above the screen and in a reflective dome. You seem to have helped a lot of people with their dragons. I could use anything u can give me.

 

[mygirlz]

Hey Jenny,
I'm glad you have the tart cherry juice coming!

I'm unsure if this plays a direct impact on his gout situation (I have to imagine it does), but his uvb exposure is much too low. Those compact/coil bulbs are already pretty weak, but that 13w uvb light is not doing much for him. I'd recommend getting a 26w coil right away, or if you have the means/money to upgrade to a reptisun 10.0 t5 and fixture, I'd do that sooner than later.

The coil bulbs at a 26w above screen only put off rays about 6" from the source, meaning he'd need to stay 6" from that light at all time to benefit. With yours being a 13w I'd have to imagine that he'd need to be half that distance, or 3", to get any use from the bulb. Even a reptisun 10.0 t8 mounted above screen is 6-8" for benefits, where a t5 tube brings that to about 12" to benefit, huge difference. It's also worth noting those coil bulbs and t8 bulbs need to be replaced every 6 months as the uvb it puts off diminishes, whereas a t5 bulb is once a year. Food for thought.

It's possible his weak uvb exposure is making it difficult to process his nutrients correctly, resulting in gout.

Ok. I actually think I may have misspoken. My other dragon actually has the coil light. Elliot does have the 10.0 Reptisun as it came with the aquarium, which I bought in February. I will add a picture of it so you can see... I will also purchase a stronger ubv bulb asap. If you can give me any more info I'd appreciate it.

<<< is the reptisun 10.0 a T8 or a T5 tube , and is it in a reflector hood ? and is it mounted ontop or under the mesh lid ?
<<< how long each day are the lights on ?

Jenny

I'm not sure if it's a T8 ot T5 tube. I tried to look on the package, but I couldn't figure it out. His lights remain on usually 15-18 hours a day. It is a dome that sits on top of the mesh lid.And I believe it is a reflector hood. I checked into the other hoods you spoke of, but I think I should take him in the vet, his front legs seem to be swelling as well. He's not moving around much and I'm definitely worried.

 

[mygirlz]

Hello,

Keep us posted on your boy, I hope he is feeling better soon.

Tracie

I didn't realize I had to click on the 2nd page. I've been checking and checking for your response. Anyway, get to me when you can. Elliot seems to be getting worse.

Jenny

 

[Drache613]

Hello Jenny,

Just to confirm, you are using a Reptisun 10 in a dome light fixture, correct? If so, you will
definitely need to upgrade to a long fluorescent tube bulb instead for a better UVB exposure for him. That is one of the issues, he isn't getting near enough UVB exposure & his body is out of balance.
I would get a blood test done on him to determine calcium & phosphorus levels, along with uric acid levels & AST (liver enzymes) levels. If he is swelling more it is most likely going to be full blown gout known as visceral gout or pseudogout caused by nutritional & husbandry issues. Either way, he would need to be started on Allopurinol initially to begin helping Elliot.
Are you getting him to the vets tomorrow?

Tracie

 

[mygirlz]

Hello Jenny,

Just to confirm, you are using a Reptisun 10 in a dome light fixture, correct? If so, you will
definitely need to upgrade to a long fluorescent tube bulb instead for a better UVB exposure for him. That is one of the issues, he isn't getting near enough UVB exposure & his body is out of balance.
I would get a blood test done on him to determine calcium & phosphorus levels, along with uric acid levels & AST (liver enzymes) levels. If he is swelling more it is most likely going to be full blown gout known as visceral gout or pseudogout caused by nutritional & husbandry issues. Either way, he would need to be started on Allopurinol initially to begin helping Elliot.
Are you getting him to the vets tomorrow?

Tracie

Yes. I am taking him in this morning. I will let you know!

 

[mygirlz]

So , we're here at the vet. They don't suspect uvb as an issue.... I'm just not sure who to believe...lol. It's $231 just for blood work, $95 for the initial visit and another $101 for an x-ray.... What would you suggest? Financially this is a bit much for me. I want to do what I can for Elliot, but $434 is really pushing it.

Jenny

 

[mygirlz]

He looks so much like my boy Richter, hits close to home.

Black cherry juice is a great start to help break down the crystals, but I'd still recommend he be seen by a vet when you can. Gout can be very serious, and the fact he's dragging his foot says he's very uncomfortable and likely in pain. It doesn't look too severe, but as mentioned it's best to get confirmation on what you're dealing with

Hi there! Did Richter have gout?

 

[traildrifterphalanx]

He never has, but the coloration and markings were like looking at his back. Seeing the face they are super different. Here's him in a hat to cheer you up!

$430 is steep, but your dragon's health and comfort is totally dependent on getting some medication quick, especially if it's spreading. Is there a way to wave the xray? I'm unsure if this would help much regarding gout, the bloodwork should be most necessary

 

[mygirlz]

He never has, but the coloration and markings were like looking at his back. Seeing the face they are super different. Here's him in a hat to cheer you up!

$430 is steep, but your dragon's health and comfort is totally dependent on getting some medication quick, especially if it's spreading. Is there a way to wave the xray? I'm unsure if this would help much regarding gout, the bloodwork should be most necessary

I just went with the blood work for now. Your baby is so cute!!!

 

[traildrifterphalanx]

Thanks! He's a big baby

Hoping the blood work gets some answers for you. Keep us posted

 

[mygirlz]

Preliminary Results. Any thoughts???

 

[AHBD]

Is there more to it than that ? The glucose seems fine + other values but the UA might be a bit high, but Tracie would know better.

And I agree that his uvb bulb should be a stronger one, lack of uvb + calcium might be causing problems as well.

 

[mygirlz]

Is there more to it than that ? The glucose seems fine + other values but the UA might be a bit high, but Tracie would know better.

And I agree that his uvb bulb should be a stronger one, lack of uvb + calcium might be causing problems as well.

More to come tomorrow. This is just the initial panel. Doc seems to think the Reptisun 10.0 is plenty capable of giving Elliot the uvb he needs. So I'm just not sure what to believe ... I hope Tracie gets back to me soon as well.

Jenny

 

[Drache613]

Hello Jenny,

Sorry I didn't get on sooner & am glad you went with just the bloodwork.
I agree, the fluorescent compact/coil you are using needs to be changed out to a long tube bulb, mounted underneath of the screen for maximum exposure.
The values look pretty good, the glucose is normal & the calcium to phosphorus ratio is good as well.
I hate to tell you but the uric acid is too high, unfortunately. That is the primary reason why he has this marked swelling. Most of the time, swelling begins at or around an 8-10mg/dl level.
I highly recommend getting them to prescribe him allopurinol. Will your vet be willing to do so?
Luckily, the AST (liver enzymes) are good, so his liver is in good shape. If you get him started on treatment immediately he will have a very good chance of becoming healthy again.

Let us know how Elliot is doing.

Tracie