So aggressive and I am so distraught

[PudgysMom]

Doc came to me on June 2nd. He was with a family who had no time for him. All I know is he got crickets and lettuce, had never been soaked and the mom was afraid of him. I *think* he hissed at her once or nipped her - she alluded to something like that, but didn't get into it because she probably didn't want to scare me off. No idea about his enclosure. She didn't know if it was a fish tank or a terrarium. I asked her on the phone how old he is and she said one, but then her kids were in the background yelling, "No. He's two!" So I honestly don't know.

He is now on a balanced diet...worms (silk/repti/horn), greens (dandelion, collards, mustard), veggies (squash, peppers, etc.), dusting with calcium, etc..

Reptisun 10.0 24" for UVB/UVA and 75W Zoomed for basking.

So I took him in and he has been extremely aggressive-except for the first day I got him. He hates being in his terrarium (temps are fine). He glass dances and there are even scratch marks in the glass from it. Sometimes I take him out just because he jumps so much and jams his nose into the glass so much I think he's going to hurt himself!

He flares at me often. He hisses at me anytime I touch him. Once I pick him up, he is fine except he usually doesn't want to be held. He just wants to run around the place.

So I got him a leash and took him out today. He did pretty well on it. We were out in the sun for an hour. He ran all over the place and I thought, "Okay, good. He's used some energy. He'll be tired now."

Got him back inside, rinsed him off just to be safe and put him in his terrarium. He was flipping out again.

Now here is what just happened and I freaking out. :shock:

I took him out of his tank because he was jumping so much and I just kept hearing him jump over and over. I was holding him and he ran onto my laptop on the sofa. I went to grab him because I didn't want him to fall since he looked like he was about to jump. He flared, hissed at me and literally with his mouth wide open JUMPED toward my hand to bite it! He didn't get me, but I have never seen him do this before. I don't think he could have mistaken my fingers for worms.

I feel like he hates me. And I feel like such a failure. I have a soft towel for him and I take him out every night to try to bond with him. Turn off the lights and let him try to fall asleep on me. Sometimes it works and sometimes he fights me.

Is there anything else I can do? I know this sounds really dumb, but even his eyes have expressions like he doesn't want me around him.

Any suggestions are soooo appreciated because I am feeling so discouraged right now.

THANK YOU.

 

[Majora]

I don't really have any advice, but I just wanted to show a little support for you. I know how it is to adopt an animal from less-than-perfect conditions, give them a nice new shot at life, and have them seemingly hate your guts. Besides my beardie, I raise rats, and I adopted a hairless rat from someone who kept him in awful conditions and never held him (she was getting rid of him so she could get a guinea pig, and she had too many pets as it was). He's super skittish even after two months of being with me, the only big improvement being that he will now take ever so cautiously take food out of my hand. Other than that, he will hiss and puff up at me if I put my hand near the cage, and if he feels backed into a corner, will bite and draw blood. It kills me because I know he should really be handled every day, and I just can't. It's very disheartening. I just try to think that at least his life is much better than it was before, and even if he is making some improvement, little by little, it's worth it. When I see him content taking a nap in his hammock or playing with his toys it kind of makes up for it, lol. You just have to take baby steps.

It's probably the same with Doc, I should think. If he was never held, it might take him months or even longer to get used to it. I would just try and take him out for short sessions as much as you can, and even if he shows a little improvement over time, that's something. Over time he might learn to like it. My baby beardie isn't aggressive, but he hated coming out for baths and stuff at first. After a few forced outings, he's only happy outside his tank. I'm no expert though, so hopefully someone can chime in with something more concrete.

Good luck with Doc. I think you have a good chance at turning him into well behaved little beardie. Lol

 

[PudgysMom]

Thank you so much.

Pudgy was a rescue, too, but I got her when she was really small so we bonded quickly. She was so loving.

I wish you the best of luck with your little guy. He is so lucky to have you!

 

[angelpaws]

I am a new beardie owner but have had similar occurrances with a bird and a guinea pig that came from folks who either didnt have the time or didnt care enough. I am also a vet tech.

In both instances, you need to have patience. He is in a new home with new smells and sounds and is likely acting out of whats called fear aggression. When animals come from households with kids, oftentimes those households are 1) very loud and 2) kids tend to be rough handlers (of course I refer to kids that arent taught how to handle with respect and care).

Personally, I dont recommend forced handling at this time. My guess is you havent owned him too long. I suggest moving him to a quiet, low traffic location and reduce the handling for a bit. He needs to learn to trust you first. Consider giving him a spot (cave like) that he can feel safe in. ALWAYS talk to him when working around him and speak in soft tones. Move slowly when you deposit food in his cage. (Of course, be attentive so you dont get bit!) If he looks angry - retract yourself. It may take weeks or months but you should slowly see less aggressive tendencies after a while.

The bird I had would always try to bite me. Every day I would talk abit and I would just rest my hand in the cage, but NOT try to touch him. Just let him see my hand and recognize my scent and sound. The same with the Guinea pig. They both did come around. I owned a 6 ft snake who was very passive but when I adopted her to my friend, he called me next day to ask if she ever displayed aggressive behavior - she was ready to strike him! I told him what to do and eventually things smoothed over. The ordeal is very frustrating but the reward in the end is much greater!
Please post again and let us know how things are working out! I truly wish you the best.

 

[PudgysMom]

Thank you, angel paws. Yes, as mentioned, he came to me on June 2nd. I have had him two weeks. I have had another rescue who was very opposite, but our babies all have their own personalities.

I am doing most everything you've written already. He has two hides. I am extremely careful when approaching his terrarium. Bearded dragons don't have very good hearing, and I don't have children, my home is extremely peaceful and quiet. We don't yell and scream here, and TV watching is rare.

He does have to have soaks, so unfortunately, I do have to handle him when he doesn't want to be handled. I also have to take him out of his terrarium when he goes to the bathroom so I can clean it. So again, he does have to be handled sometimes.

I am extremely loving and patient with him. I know it isn't his fault. Just wish there was more I could do for him.

 

[Majora]

As far as backing down from aggressive behavior - I have heard that it isn't good to back away because they are trying to show dominance and if you retract your hand you're letting them establish dominance over you. Is this true?

One thing that has worked for all of my skittish/aggressive animals (after getting them used to your hand/smells/etc for a while, when they're "ready" to be handled) was picking them up inside their cage/tank/etc and just putting them down again. Doing this a few times throughout the day, and supplementing with a little treat if possible, seems to help. It kind of gets them thinking that being picked up doesn't always mean going somewhere scary. This worked for my beardie too. Although once he was taken out to eat a few times (I feed him his live food outside of his tank) he started banging on the glass to come out. Food is the best motivator, lol.

But yeah, I didn't mean to sound like I meant you should use an overly forceful approach. It's up to your judgement on whether or not he's ready to progress with handling etc. If you really feel like you're going to get bit, it's probably a better idea to get him used to your hands being in the tank first. On the other hand, he does have to come out for cleaning/baths so you want him to feel better about being handled. It's so discouraging sometimes.

 

[angelpaws]

Hi guys,
Seeing how you've owned a beardie before, Id say, you could recognize "normal" behavior. Im only speaking with experience from assimilating other animals. Its clear the soaks hes just gonna have to deal with.

In response to Majora, I dont mean backing down persay...if you have to handle them then do, but in my experience, I like to give each animal what I call its "individual respect". I've been very sucessful using these methods when re-adjusting these guys to normal-happy homes. My beardie now is quite young and Ive had her only maybe 1 week. Shes incredibly curious and still alittle scared of me. She hasnt tried to bite me and has even allowed me to feed her but she will run if I try to pick her up. In this case, I dont force the issue, I just retreat from the cage - thats kinda what I mean, I want her to be ok with me reaching for her. I dont know if reptiles experience "dominance" like dogs do. I cant say Ive seen it with my snake or my chameleon. The Anole's Ive had Ive never been able to befriend and the frogs Ive had could give a heck..LOL. I will say that the beardie has already impressed upon me as being much more intelligent than the other reptiles Ive owned thus far!

Anyhoo...Pudgy's mom is an experience beardie owner so thats a huge benefit for Doc. TIme will tell I guess. Good Luck Pudgy's Mom!

 

[ShannyBeard]

You just got him June 2nd and it hasn't even been a month yet, I think that's a big factor. Relocation stress can take weeks to clear up. It is very obvious that he is frightened and he is on high alert. All of his defenses are being used. Take it very slow with him and give him plenty of time to adjust. Do you think he had a little kid that may have tormented him? You may be surprised at how cruel even nice children can be. It really sounds like he was hassled very badly and he reacts to people negatively. When I was in 2nd grade I watched classmates torment a captive mole to death while the teacher was out. You just never know what Doc has endured. I am so sorry for him.

 

[PudgysMom]

You just got him June 2nd and it hasn't even been a month yet, I think that's a big factor. Relocation stress can take weeks to clear up. It is very obvious that he is frightened and he is on high alert. All of his defenses are being used. Take it very slow with him and give him plenty of time to adjust. Do you think he had a little kid that may have tormented him? You may be surprised at how cruel even nice children can be. It really sounds like he was hassled very badly and he reacts to people negatively. When I was in 2nd grade I watched classmates torment a captive mole to death while the teacher was out. You just never know what Doc has endured. I am so sorry for him.

Thanks so much. I guess I have high expectations of myself and Pudgy didn't seem to have relocation stress, so I expect Doc to trust me automatically. Kind of hard not to take it personally.

I am not sure if they tormented him, but I do know there were two kids in the household and one is younger.

Poor little guy.

Thank you, SO MUCH, for the encouragement!

 

[ShannyBeard]

You just got him June 2nd and it hasn't even been a month yet, I think that's a big factor. Relocation stress can take weeks to clear up. It is very obvious that he is frightened and he is on high alert. All of his defenses are being used. Take it very slow with him and give him plenty of time to adjust. Do you think he had a little kid that may have tormented him? You may be surprised at how cruel even nice children can be. It really sounds like he was hassled very badly and he reacts to people negatively. When I was in 2nd grade I watched classmates torment a captive mole to death while the teacher was out. You just never know what Doc has endured. I am so sorry for him.

Thanks so much. I guess I have high expectations of myself and Pudgy didn't seem to have relocation stress, so I expect Doc to trust me automatically. Kind of hard not to take it personally.

I am not sure if they tormented him, but I do know there were two kids in the household and one is younger.

Poor little guy.

Thank you, SO MUCH, for the encouragement!

I've rescued two extremely aggressive cats that were going to be euthanized. The second one I took was a biter and she would go for the meatiest part of your body to sink her teeth in. People were terrified of her. She took years to tame. Y-E-A-R-S. DO you know how many people told me what a waste it was that I took that cat in because I couldn't touch her? When she did finally let me touch her, I was glowing. :mrgreen: Slowly I was able to pick her up, and I can't tell you what a huge trust issue that was for her. It was a big deal.

I hope it doesn't take you 6 years to tame this dragon, but when he does start to trust you it's going to be special. You're going to have a bond with him. I would limit other people's interaction with him and control all of his interactions, really. It would be easier for him to settle down if one person were to take care of him and handle him. I don't see any reason you can't gain his trust.

 

[PudgysMom]

Awww that must have been so great! Your cats were lucky to have you, too!

I think it'll be quicker than 6 years. LOL I hope!

He just jumped up so high that his nose hit his Reptisun bulb! :shock: I am wondering if I should get a taller tank?

 

[PudgysMom]

It finally happened. He bit me. I don't mean a nip. I mean full-on bit me. Lots of blood. Good times.

I have a cancer history, so I had to go to the urgent-care clinic. I have a pretty large hole in the back of my finger and several bite gashes in the front. It is so odd. I have never seen a bearded dragon bite cause such a large hole. Even the nurse and doctor were like :shock: .

Anyway, I feel so bad. He pooped in his terrarium, so I went to move him -very slowly-to clean it out and I guess despite me thinking I was moving slowly, it was too fast for him and BAM! He bit me.

I know it won't take years, and I know we're seeing progress in the two weeks I've had him. It just honestly makes me wonder what happened to this poor little guy before he came here.

 

[Irwinshealth]

OMG, I'm sorry to hear you did actually get bit. Palmer is still getting bucky with me as well. I'm trying to be patient but it is hard as you stated not to take it personal. He has come a long way but I still have a hard time not looking scared when I have to feed, bath, clean tank, or bath him. I try to be boss while being nice. To be honest I don't know if I sang to my kids as much as his spoiled butt!! :wink:

So how did you actually get him to release? Just in case this happens to me I will be prepared :? Did they stitch the hole? You state you have a cancer "History" Glad to hear it is history verses now. Good for you!!

How does he seem now? Did you let out a yelp? Did he seem to understand this was a big deal? Or was he more like, yeah I protected myself? AWW this is so sad. The poor little thing to be so scared of someone trying to love him. Although I have to remind myself often of this while my kids are saying Palmers nothing but mean. lol

What we won't do for our spoiled beardies. Glad to hear you were able to keep some humor about it when you say,

Good times.

I have to admit I did laugh at that. Again luck to both of us dragon tamers! :lol:

 

[PudgysMom]

Awww sorry you are going through your own ordeal with Palmer.

He bit into the finger (my thumb, actually) and ripped by turning his head a little, then let go and I did let out a little, "OUCH!" He doesn't seem to realize it was a big deal. I think all he cared about was getting away.

They didn't have to stitch the hole, but they did give me a special bandage to keep the wound togther and covered. If anything changes, I have to go back in. Yes, I am very lucky-I am a three-time cancer survivor , but I do have a compromised immune system because of it, so because their mouths aren't exactly clean, I did have to go into the doc.

Right now, he's a little black, he as some stress marks and he is giving me the stink eye while laying on his log (the top of his hide). I put a shirt in his tank (of mine so that he gets used to my smell) and he hissed, of course.

I am just going to leave him alone the rest of the day/night, except to turn off his lights and start fresh in the morning.

Good luck with your Palmer!

Yes, spoiled beardies indeed!

 

[ShannyBeard]

that stinks for both of you. Their bites really do hurt - I almost had the tip of my finger removed by one of our beardies: it was a feeding accident. You've got a long way to go with him. :shock: Chief bit my pants a few days ago when I was holding Papa Smurf. He just went up and BIT my pants in anger. :?