Rescued or Stolen? Right or Wrong?

[RuselBro]

So back in October I went to Visit and Spend the Weekend with my Best Friend and his Girlfriend in Woodstock Georgia. They had gotten a Baby Ball Python and a Jungle Carpet Python and were just getting into Reptile's. As they knew my love for Reptile's and with their deep love for all Animal's they wanted to take me to all the Pet Shop's in the 4 Surrounding Cities xD So we went on our Trip, some Shop's were Better than other's. So the Last Shop we went to was the Worst of all, all Animal's and Reptile's were in Horrible Condition, Horrible Housing, ect. We were looking at the Reptile's and I noticed the Shop had over 70 Baby Beardie's in a 20 Gallon Octagon Tank, being feed Ice Berg Lettuce and No Heat Source of UVB Source, Just a Simple Florescent Tube Light. Pretty much all the Babies were Malnourished and there was a few Dead Babies " I have been wanting a new Gecko or Beardie for a few Month's at that time" There was 1 Beardie that was looking at me "The only 1 looking at me" as I walked around the Tank to check them all out, and I couldn't Stand seeing them in such Horrible Condition's, Dying. So I decided I had to help at least just 1 of them, but I didn't have any Cash on me at the Time. So I reached my Hand Down in the Tank and Scooped Up the Baby Beardie that had been Watching me the Whole Time, the look in his Eye's just Screamed "Help Me Please!". He was Roughly 4 Inches Long, Almost 2 Week's Old!!! So after we all left to the Car Outside I told them and Showed them what I had done and gotten, and they Completely Backed me Up on it. So ever since he has been So Happy and Healthy, He's a little over 10 Inches Now, eat's his Veggies and Cricket's, has a 36L x 12W x 17H Home, proper Heating and Lighting, and Has the Most Beautiful Orange Color's like a CitrusxRed Morph would have. And I love him to Death, watching him grow and Be Happy. So I want to know from everyone who Read's this...Do you think what I did was Right or Wrong? Would You say I Rescued Him or Stole Him? What would YOU have done in my Situation? Please Speak your Mind's on this matter. And His name is "Shenron" by the way. And I got him October 16th.

 

[snazzyglasses]

I'm not sure about the morally right vs wrong part, that sounds like a possibly gray area type situation. But I did have a few thoughts
1. I highly doubt that horrible pet store even noticed a dragon was missing. From the way those poor dears were treated, it sounds like the store couldn't care less about them
2. If you get an attack of conscience sometime down the road, you can always mail the pet store some cash equivalent to what the dragon would've cost (don't put a return address though, just in case )
3. I bet Shenron thinks you're an angel for rescuing him!
4. Reporting all the pet stores you saw with abused animals might be a good idea. Hopefully they'll get busted or even shut down for their animal neglect/abuse.

So! That's my $.02. I know it wasn't an actual answer lol, but just my thoughts on the matter

 

[WolfMama]

That is SUCH a difficult spot to be in! I’m a firm believer that the eyes speak. You look into another’s eyes with your heart and it says SO much. He clearly spoke to you and you connected

I certainly would not recommend you do that again, though Wouldn’t want to see someone with such a kind heart get arrested

Snazzyglasses really said what I was thinking.

It’s tugging at you. So, my suggestion would be: while I hate to see someone like that get any money – send them the money they would have charged for a beardie. He’s well worth it, and I think you will feel better

If you are up to it take as much action as you can against the pet shop. Contact animal advocacy organizations, as well as the ASPCA. You needn’t tell them what happened.

I’m glad you and Shenron found each other!

 

[RuselBro]

Yeah....Gray area. Lol. My Best Friend and His Girl Friend that I mentioned, well his Girlfriend was a HUGE Animal Right's Activist, so She was Completely all for it. But yeah.
And there is NO WAY that they would Notice 1 of them Missing, they didn't Care about them at all, I even pointed out to an Employee working there that 4 of the Baby Beardies were Dead, I mean Skin And Bones,, not Breathing of course not moving DEAD! And He just took a quick look and said "Nahh, they're just sleeping" and walked off! I was like WTF, they are Dead! But He didn't care, it's like a "Mom & Pop" Small Pet Shop. But Myself and my 2 Friend's talked about Reporting for Animal Neglect and Cruelty, but they wanted to wait so they Could get a few More Snake's and Accessories from them. If I could have I would have took every Poor Baby Beardie and Animal in that shop! Lol.
I feel like I did the right thing, personally. I Saved a Beardie from Starvation and Neglect and Gave Him a Great Life, I doubt I would ever pay that Pet Store tho. Just because I know the Money wouldn't be going toward's helping those poor Animal's and reptile's in there. But 1-2 Year's from now, if that Shop is still Open and My Disgust for the People who work there has Diminished Some, I may end up Sending them the Money for him, They wanted $75 for the Beardies, but in My Eye's Shenron is Worth much much much More than that, to me.
And Yes, Shenron seem's to Be Pretty Happy with the outcome and Pretty Found of me as well.

I hand feed him everyday, except his Bowl of Green's. He sleep's on my Chest for 2 - 4 at Night time before I go to bed, and is Seem's to like being Handled alot. Except right now "He's going through Shed time" Lol. His tail has the Most Amazing Peach/Orange on it, Waiting on his Body to shed, so I can see if he will be Completely Orange like a Tangerine or something!

 

[WolfMama]

That's horrible that they had dead beardies I hope you can report them.

I hope it didn't come across that I was putting a price tag on your beardie I certainly did not mean that at all. Years ago, we were in a pet shop buying guinea pig food. We had already adopted 2 guinea pigs. A woman was in there asking about the guinea pig she got from the store for her child as the guinea pig was showing signs of being sick, and she was wondering if she needed to take the gp to the vet. The store owner told her to just return the gp and said, "How much do you really want to spend on a $15 animal anyway?"

The poor woman stood there STUNNED (as was I). Words couldn't come to her. My son at my side, I brought him forward and said, "You see this face? You can't put a price tag on that! He LOVES our guinea pigs - they are NOT $15 animals. They are part of our families." The woman smiled and expressed her agreement, then turned and left the store. I followed. Then HE stood there speachless ... That pet shop has long since gone out of business

Shenron sounds very cute, and pretty. Do share some pics

 

[RuselBro]

I'm going to talk to my friend's sometime next month and see about going to stay the weekend with them again, and we'll go to the Shop and figure how to go about the situation. But No no, Not at all Lol. I meant it as The Shop was asking $75 for the Baby Beardies, but to me He is worth more than that, so If I were to send them Money, I would probably end up Sending more than Their asking Price was. Haha.

I mean I could Understand the Shop saying you can Return the Guinea for a Refund or for another Guinea, but saying How much do you really want to Spend on a $15 Animal is just uncalled and IMO very Unprofessional!
But if you have an Animal or Reptile of any kind and You Love it, the of Course you're going to want to Take it to the Vet. Money doesn't mean as Much as Love does.

But I will for sure be putting some Picture's up of Shenron and His Viv in the Next Week or 2. I'm going to wait for his Shed to be done, So far he has Shed his Head last week, and just Finished his Tail tonight,, and with his Tail being So Peach/Tangerine..I can not Wait to see what his Body will look like! xD Hopefully my Netbook or Cell Phone will be able to Capture his Coloration's.

Also, usually everytime I go to a Pet Shop I end up Correcting the Employee on thing's even if he's trying to Help a different Customer, I still step in and Correct them xD

 

[randommonks]

Honestly, I think it's stealing. There's really no way around it in my opinion. You might feel that you rescued him, but a better scenario would have been for you to ask the pet store workers to hold that one for you and come back later that day with money. I'm so glad that he's in a great home with you, but I don't think that makes it 100% right.

Maybe you could go back to that pet store and try to educate them on beardie needs. Since there's really no way of telling them what you did without them taking it the wrong way, maybe you can buy $75 worth of goodies for Shenron so you can give that money back to the pet store and clear your conscience.

 

[WolfMama]

I'm going to talk to my friend's sometime next month and see about going to stay the weekend with them again, and we'll go to the Shop and figure how to go about the situation. But No no, Not at all Lol. I meant it as The Shop was asking $75 for the Baby Beardies, but to me He is worth more than that, so If I were to send them Money, I would probably end up Sending more than Their asking Price was. Haha.

Aw! I could tell you felt that way ($) It's so nice to hear that from people! Glad to hear that you'll see what you can do about reporting the shop It might help if you can, discretely, get get pics of a video.

I mean I could Understand the Shop saying you can Return the Guinea for a Refund or for another Guinea,

Right. It's not for us, as we would rather do what we could, but, yes, they are supposed to allow for that.

but saying How much do you really want to Spend on a $15 Animal is just uncalled and IMO very Unprofessional!

Absolutely. And insensitive, too. Sad how people can run such a "business" and not care about animals.

But if you have an Animal or Reptile of any kind and You Love it, the of Course you're going to want to Take it to the Vet. Money doesn't mean as Much as Love does.

Agreed Love is priceless

But I will for sure be putting some Picture's up of Shenron and His Viv in the Next Week or 2. I'm going to wait for his Shed to be done, So far he has Shed his Head last week, and just Finished his Tail tonight,, and with his Tail being So Peach/Tangerine..I can not Wait to see what his Body will look like! xD Hopefully my Netbook or Cell Phone will be able to Capture his Coloration's.

Looking forward to seeing the pics! He sounds very pretty and sweet

Also, usually everytime I go to a Pet Shop I end up Correcting the Employee on thing's even if he's trying to Help a different Customer, I still step in and Correct them xD

Bravo! Good for you! Been there At the shop where we adopted our beardie, I saw a family looking at guinea pigs. Suffice it to say, they were given VERY wrong information on guinea pigs. I won't even go into the misinformation on their tags for guinea pigs - and now I know for beardies as well. We told the family. They considered what we had told them, and I heard them question the acting manager on duty (who was talking with them to wrap up the sale). The acting manager dismissed what I'd told them, and gave even WORSE advice. I was upset for the GP's sake, and concerned. But, then the acting manager mishandled the guinea pig, and their child freaked out - long story short, the family realized we knew what we were talking about and knew far more about guinea pigs then the manager, and the manager blew the sale as the family left behind a cart full of stuff (and it is sad to see some of what they sell for guinea pigs). Sad for the guinea pig And, while I do feel they would have given the guinea pig a fine home, the situation would have not ended well had they taken the acting manager's advice. I informed the store manager the next day, and called the main office.

 

[esn]

Better it to be stolen and cared for rather dying in the shop or under uninformed care. It's stealing, yes. It's also a rescue. I personally would have bought it, but given the fact that you hadn't the money for it. I do have a question, though. If you didn't have the money for a $75 beardie, did you have the money for a setup? Though to be honest, I'd say the amount of days without UVB with proper diet is a great improvement over without UVB and cardboard, especially considering that there are many breeders that raise dragons without UVB. Putting it in a tub with a heat lamp over it and good food sounds infinitely better than the setup described from the store. It sounds like you know enough to have the supplies, anyway.

I doubt the shop is really hurt by the loss, given the fact that they buy wholesale. If they're not concerned enough over the dead ones in the tank, then one missing isn't going to be noticed. If they are hurt, well, the better. A shop that runs like that deserves to be put out of business. It's essentially the same as leaving a nasty Yelp review, to me.

It's the morally ambiguous grey area. I think, for your circumstances and you as a person, that was a right thing to do. Not that I agree with going all PETA and stealing chimps from lab cages and causing 28 Days Later, but I do agree given the circumstances.

To be honest, I wouldn't tell the shop. You may get a lawsuit on yours hands with or without giving them compensation. The law won't care whether it was based on animal abuse. Stealing is worse than animal abuse, in the viewing of law. If you feel obligated to send money, which I wouldn't (it's more money to spend on the poor animal), do it anonymously. Don't get yourself into trouble because of an impulsive but good-hearted mistake.

 

[Zeusmybeardie]

You totally did the right thing if they didn't notice they didn't care don't give that store I damn Pennie cause that is just gonna go towards new and more pets that will get injured and/or killed

 

[showard]

You did the wrong thing but for the right reasons. Send them a couple of 20 dollar bills to clear your conscience (anonymously!). It will make you feel better, it's the right thing, and it's more than they would have gotten if you didn't take the beardie, since it would have surely died. I'm glad he's living the life of Riley now!

 

[RuselBro]

@randommonks - I might just do that, that is if I can actually find anything in the Shop worth Buying, they really had nothing for Reptile's, No UVB Bulb's of any Kind, No Tank's, No Decoration's, literally nothing at all to buy for your Reptile, after you get it.

@WolfMama - Like my Dream is too Honestly Work at a Pet Shop and Eventually be able to Own my own Shop, like I'm 21 now and that has been my Dream since I was like 5 Year's old. Lol. I love to be around pretty much all Animal's and I enjoy taking Care of them. And I would be able to give people the PROPER Info on the Animal or Reptile the buy, Haha.

@esn - My friend's house is 2 Hour's away from where I live, and I didn't have Cash on me, and the day I got him is also the day I went Home. But Yes, I had the Money for the Few Supplies I needed for him at Home, I already had the Tank "36L x 12W x 17H", Reptile Hammock, Food & Water Bowl's, Zoomed Double Dome Fixture, 100w Black Night Heat Lamp, Tank Hood, Light's. The only thing I had to buy was a Zoomed Powersun MVB 100w, and Cricket's and Veggies. And I got all that the next day after I was home. And they had the Baby Beardies on Pick Colored Sand!!! And Just threw the Ice Berg Lettuce on the Sand?! It was horrible. And the Tank stunk soooo bad! And my Friend's G/f would be the one to Steal Animal's from a Test a Lab or something, she is seriously Crazy into Animal's Right's. lol.

And of Course I would Give them the Money Anonymously! Haha. And I could deff Take Picture's of everything going on in there with Animal's and Video's of the Employee's say about thing's. They had over 50 Beautiful Bird's " Parrot's, Big Parrot's, You name it, it was there" And they were in even worse Condition then anything.

Thank's for the Replies! I know what I'm going to do about everything. I might Buy another Baby Beardie if I see One that look's Strong enough to be able to make it with my Help, take some Picture's and Video's and talk to my Friend's about how we should go about the Whole thing, Which my Bro's G/F should know how to, since she has been through stuff like that already.

 

[RuselBro]

Sorry it's so Blurry and Bright. :/ I took it with my NetBook. Haha.
I'll use my Mom's Cell Tomorrow and get a Better Picture of the Viv and Get a Picture of Shenron, Hopefully her Cell will be able to Capture his Nice New Color's.

 

[bunnyrut]

Stolen.

here's why:

-you said nothing to the employee about the bad care of the animals.

-you did not try to bargain for the life of the animal or threaten to call animal control.

-you did not call animal control.


I was visiting family in Fl the same time my step-dad's family was visiting from England. we took his mom and brother to a pet store in a mall and saw the baby cockatiels. they were only a few weeks old, still with their baby feathers, and rocking back and forth crying to be fed. they could not reach the water dish that was at the top of the perch that they could not climb.
simply: they were going to die.

we had the opportunity to grab one and walk out.

instead we called the manager, complained and told them WHY it was wrong, bartered with them and walked out with the smallest bird at a discount. then reported them.

my mom loves that bird (my nephew actually got attached to it and named it Toodles), and when we brought it home the parrotlet they have (female) climbed out to the baby bird's cage and started feeding it.

we still consider it a rescue.

if you do not report them about the horrid care then you are doing NOTHING to help any of the other animals there. and all you did was steal one.

now if you do something to save all of them you can consider yours a rescue.

*EDIT*
FYI - if the reporting is going to PETA all of the animals will be killed.
PETA does not "rescue" animals. they do not believe any animal should be 'owned' as a pet and would rather see them dead than in the hands of humans.

 

[RuselBro]

@bunnyrut - I did say something about the Bad Care of the Baby Beardies, when I told them there were a few dead, I also said a few more thing's. Just didn't think I should have Wrote, thought it would be obvious I said other thing's to them about it. They just Flat Out didn't care at all.

And if you Read in My comment's to everyone, I said I was going to talk to my Friend's about going up there to Stay the Weekend again soon and talk to them about how we should go about Reporting them and No, Not to Peta Lmao. To either the Aspca"sp?" or someone else. As I said in my Comment's We have to figure out the right way to go about it. Also I stated I had no Money at my Friend's house, and I live 2 Hour's from them and had no way to get Money that day, which is why I didn't try and Barter with the Owner for a Discount. Also The Owner of the Shop work's there So I couldn't go to someone Above him that he work's for. Most everything you said, has already been Stated in the Comment;s from myself and other's. I wanted to know what to do, which is why I posted this. And I know mostly know what to do about it. But Thank you for your Comment. "If I sound like I'm being a A$$ Wh*l3, I don't mean to be, just in a Pissy mood today. Lol"