Please help, she's not moving her legs

[doomerang]

Just to give a bit of a back story, I posted on here earlier this year regarding my (supposedly) 6 year-old female beardie Peach laying unorthodox clutches of eggs. (viewtopic.php?f=6&t=233418) She followed the egg-laying with a month-long shed that was rather a heavy one.

Towards the final stages of the shed I noticed that she stopped eating her greens and started exhibiting unusual head shaking and grinding sounds coming from around the jaw area. In addition to that she has not defecated, but remained eating for about 3-4 weeks. (viewtopic.php?f=6&t=234891) Since then I visited a reptile vet who ended up giving her an enema and an xray. The problem seemed to be dehydration (according to the vet) as the source of the impaction was a dehydrated urate. The enama was given to Peach over a week ago and ever since she has been fed Critical Care and soaked for 25 min daily.

Slightly before she was given the enema, she seemed quite weak and she seemed to have problems walking around and climbing. She continued to have this issue after the enema, particularly her right-front arm giving her a hard time. Since we also ran blood work and everything came back within norm, and based on the X-ray the vet concluded that she does not have MBD. Hence the vet suggested to give her oral pain medications and see if she begins to attempt being mobile once again as some sort of strain / muscle pain(?) could be causing aversion to walking around. 3 days have passed with the pain meds and nothing has really changed. She remains rather lethargic, and will not move unless I move her.

Today when I was feeding her I noticed wheezing / gulping sounds. She has been doing it particularly during handling and then shortly after feeding in the viv for a little bit. It seems to have calmed a bit, but I managed to snap a vid to show on here. https://youtu.be/RS_MK9phuX8

Quite honestly I am not sure where to go from here, she seems to have many problems compiling at once. What could I do to promote her mobility? What do you think about the wheezing?

Here are a few pics of her from 2 min ago:

 

[AHBD]

Poor Peaches, having a very rough time these past couple of months. First of all, did she produce much poo after the enema or had any more bowel movement since ? I wonder if the impaction had pressed on her spine causing partial paralysis, although a food impaction hardly ever has that affect on larger beardies, it's usually with smaller ones.

I think that this is calcium related though since it all happened after egg laying. It might also be a vit. B deficiency along with it.

What exact type/brand of lights do you use ? It's very important to their health. Can you post pics of her set up + showing the placements of the lights ? If you can set with her out in the sun on your lap or in the grass that might help.

I think the coughing is likely from aspirating the meds. and/or the Critical care. You might start giving her some baby food squash and sweet potato along with a few drops of olive oil to help her poo for now. I'd cut out the pain meds, and definitely cut the baths out to a 10 minute every other day. Baths can help them poo but 25 minutes is excessive, especially now that she has a breathing problem.
But please list the type of lights you have + show pics of the set up.

 

[doomerang]

Hey! It's good to hear from you again, and thank you for helping once again. She's been through eventful three months

The Enema was actually very successful, and she only needed one to actually go. When it comes to having a bowel movement since, it has been about a week but she has not have had a movement as of yet. The vet pretty much said that if she doesn't have one by Thursday / Friday then she would need another enema, but I am quite hesitant; I cannot afford to and neither is it feasible to continue giving her enemas on a bi-weekly basis. I am not sure how to proceed if this does happen... :?

When it comes to the potential calcium deficiency, the vet ran many biomarkers in the blood testing and concluded that everything is within norm, and I made sure to specifically ask about calcium as well. She has been receiving doses of oral calcium in the morning and in the evening for over a week prior to the blood testing so it could certainly elevate blood Calcium levels. As I mentioned previously, there is no signs of Metabolic Bone Disease either according to the x-ray. Hence, the vet instructed me to decrease the dose of calcium to 3 times per week with food.

I will make sure to ask about vitamin B when I call the office tomorrow morning, once it opens and get back to you. However, I have a feeling it will be within norm since she hasn't mentioned it.

I recently (about a month ago) replaced my UVB (I try to do so every 5-6 months) to a reptisun 10.0 T8 as I have heard good things about them. It crossed my mind that perhaps (and its a stretch imo) the bulb is somehow defective and has been causing these issues. I was considering going to a pet store, getting another one and trying it out for a duration of a week and see if any changes take place. The heat lamp is a regular, non-frosted 60watt house bulb.

Here is a photo of the setup with some more information:

A few things to keep in mind:
The tank is bare bones as I have removed the shelf liner I used as the bottom / substrate and switched to paper towel as it was worn. This causes the temperatures around peach to be slightly lower (high 80s) however when the bottom was grey the flooring was at about 97F. Should I throw a higher bulb in? I find that the next higher bulb (100w) might get her to 107-110F.

Since peach does not move around, I have been moving the heating bulb from above peach and to the side when possible. Its over her probably for 70% of the day as I am not at home.

Lights used:
-Reptisun 10.0 UVB
- 60 watt household bulb non-frosted

I will make sure to incorporate some of the baby food and vegetable oil drops in her diet alongside with the Critical Care. I am trying to avoid giving her supers or any hard food for now.

 

[AHBD]

The baby food + drops of oil are to help her poo, so no, another enema should not be given, she will eventually poo. If she hasn't poo'd in a few more days, give her a warmer than usual bath just for 5-10 minutes.


As for the lights, the uvb is too far and she will not get any usable uvb.....it needs to be mounted in the tank so it's about 8" from her. Blood tests don't always show the calcium that is actually being absorbed + utilized from day to day, neither do xrays always clearly show true bone density of a small animal. And even if her bones had developed properly, a long time without enough uvb along with the demands for extra calcium placed on the body by all the eggs she laid could definitely put it out of balance.

Have you been able to get her out in the sun ?

And to heat her a bit better, just go up to a 70-75 att bulb from Lowe's or Walmart.

 

[doomerang]

Yes, I will definitely try and give her a few syringes with the Critical Care and hope for the best. Is there a temp. range that you have in mind when it comes to giving her a bath? I usually go for 85-90F based on other posts on here. If I was to go higher would I go towards the low 100sF?

****, really? I was never sure about the UVB but never asked on here, because I went off what Reptisun has on their site. It addresses the range of this bulb in the following statement: "Emits UVB a full 20″/51cm from the surface of the lamp to prevent or reverse Metabolic Bone Disease. (Compared to 12″/30cm on the ReptiSun® 5.0). Optimal for use with larger terrariums where greater than 12″ of UVB penetration is needed. The ReptiSun® 10.0 is also recommended for use above screen covers which can filter out up to 50% of the UVB wavelengths." Therefore I thought I was safe, especially when she was still climbing higher on the various platforms she had in the viv. :shock:

I will think about my options when it comes to hanging it on the inside, especially that I envision her not having any climbing planks in there for a few weeks while she recovers it will have to be quite low in there and attached securely.

She has a session scheduled in about an hour just after I finish up with something. 8)

I will make sure to look for a slightly higher wattage bulb tomorrow!

 

[AHBD]

I had the 16" distance in my head when I replied, which is much too far away, at 8-10" it should have been good though when her elevated basking area was still in the tank. But she has some type of deficiency, whether from not basking enough, producing a lot of eggs or other factors.

 

[doomerang]

Yea for sure I definitely see where you are coming from and I'll try to make the adjustments necessary to meet her needs. I'm baffled by the fact that the bulb manufacturer claims up to 22 inches of penetration. Just because I'm a curious mind, where are you getting the 8 inch value from?

She's been basking for about 30 min now and she seems to be loving it. Gonna let her bask for a while

 

[AHBD]

I hope Peaches is feeling comfortable. It's a big worry to have a sick pet and just waiting to see improvement.

The reason I mention 8-10" is because of the manufacturer recommendation that it be no closer than 6". Some people take that to mean it should be at 6......better to have it at 8-10" which is a good distance because it's right above the 6" mark and is the strongest at that point without possible negative effects. Twenty inches away would be very weak uvb, esp. if through a screen.

 

[doomerang]

Yea I am making sure she is as comfortable as possible. I have never had a pet as an independent adult before, and I must admit that it is very unsettling.

Oh okay so just based on your own experience you recommend that I put it at around 8-10? Why does Reptisun state 22" as the acceptable distance. It frustrates me that there is so much misunderstanding and lack of concrete information about these lights. Everywhere I look and everyone I talk to has something else to say

 

[EllenD]

I would absolutely put the Reptisun 10.0 T8 INSIDE her tank rather than on the mesh lid, it's blocks very good portion of the UVB light from her, as the T8 is not strong enough to penetrate the mesh enough to give her an adequate amount of UVB. If you had the 10.0 T5 High-Output UVB tube it could certainly be placed on top of a mesh lid, as it's strong enough that the 35%-50% of the UVB that it blocks is negligible. The T8 just isn't strong enough to be obstructed by anything, there should be nothing between the T8 tube and your beardie on her basking spot, at a distance of 8" maximum.

She needs all the UVB light and calcium she can get right now, I think based on what her body has been through recently she's very deficient in not only Calcium, but nutrition in general, which is also dependent on enough UVB light in order to be absorbed and processed. So please, seriously consider either mounting that T8 tube inside her tank at a distance of 8" max away from her basking spot, or upgrade to a Reptisun 10.0 T5 High-Output UVB tube that can sit on top of the lid, and make sure it's at a distance of 11" away max.

IMO the 10.0 T5 High-Output UVB tube is one of the best if not the best UVB light available for a beardie, so I'd upgrade anyway, regardless of her health issues, they just make her need for a stronger UVB light all that more desperate.

 

[doomerang]

Hi EllenD and thank you for the interest you have showed in the issues with peach, the more the merrier I have not updated on the thread since my last post, but I can now say that the T8 has been lowered into the tank, and is precisely 8 inches away from the ground (as peach is not climbing for now) to ensure that she gets enough UVB as AHBD and you have recommended. (It is her temporary setup until I move back into my dorm in September.

Yes that is definitely the case. I am continuing to feed her the greens Critical Care as well as baby squash and sweet potato food with a drop of oil. For now I will keep live feed out of her diet, and will start reintroducing slowly as she gets healthier and becomes stronger.

I was planning on upgrading to the T5 before and certainly will once October comes around (get 3-4 months out the T8). The reason why I did not is because the bulbs and the hoods are not as readily available here in Canada (t8s are for some reason) and were sold out on Amazon when her old T8 went out. I wanted to provide her with a UVB asap so I went to PetSmart and got that for her.

I noticed something in her mouth today while feeding her, but did not get a chance to get better photos than these. Is this normal? I heard of mouth rot before but I could not find any pictures of mouth rotthat look like this. (Disclaimer: I am pretty paranoid at this point)

Other than that do you have any other suggestions?

Thank you both for all your help! I could not be more grateful!

 

[AHBD]

I'm not sure , can't really see enough, but if it's cheesy looking pus then it would be mouth rot.

 

[doomerang]

I will try and take a better picture later! It really is hard to see on this one :/

 

[doomerang]

Sorry I have never posted a better picture of the inside of her mouth, I had quite the difficulty getting her to keep the mouth open while I multitask and take a snapshot of the mouth cavity. I will make sure to take it this weekend with a friend of mine who will help me.

I am a little conflicted and worried about the fact that she still has not pooped. I have been feeding her daily with butternut squash baby food with a little bit of vegetable oil in it. She was also getting some critical care with a decent proportion of water mixed in with it. Aside from that she is also getting calcium supplements 3-4 times a week and her tank is fixed.

What can I do? Does she need another enema? I am not sure how to feel out for impaction but i do feel a hard bit in her abdomen (as previously i could be the urate "stuck" in her).

 

[AHBD]

Poor Peach, how does her temperament seem otherwise ? Is she very sulky and does she take the mixture without any trouble ? I don't think she needs another enema, her system is just very sluggish because of her condition plus she's not getting a real dragon diet but a very reduced one.

Can you put her in about 2" of warmer than usual [ but not hot ] water ? That can stimulate a b.m
I think she will eventually go on her own, try this , and be sure that you are right there with her to supervise.