He's wasting away

[Gail]

I know spurlee, you didn't offend me

 

[MissT]

Gail, I hope you manage to get someone to do a fecal- to put your mind at rest!

How is Jupiter today? At least he is still taking solid foods to some extent!

 

[Gail]

Its early still, he's only been awake a couple hours. He is basking and looking alert, hoping he will willing try some dubia today. I'm off to the store in a bit to pick up some baby food and a squash.

 

[Drache613]

Hello Gail,

I am sorry you are having trouble with Jupiter.
I think that he has just had some stress due to the cedar, etc which have suppressed his immune system somewhat. Stress really affects them negatively.
Are you giving any probiotics or bee pollen to help?
Sorry if I missed that somewhere in the thread. That could help, or maybe try some colloidal silver also, which helps with antimicrobial issues.

I think that he looks good overall.


Tracie

 

[Gail]

I have given him probiotics but only a couple times, he is on bee pollen daily atm. Any idea how long the cedar could take to clear out? Should I keep up with the Baytril just in case it caused a secondary infection?

 

[SoleSky]

How is he doing lately Gail?

 

[Gail]

A bit better. He was awake and active yesterday, ate a couple supers on his own but I've since tossed them out. I'm now making him eat dubia even though he doesn't want them.

 

[SoleSky]

That's progress . Hopefully he'll eat dubia. Just a question, have you tried reptiworms for him yet?

 

[Gail]

No, I haven't tried reptis and I won't. They are nasty little bugs and way over priced for being so small. I would like to try buttesr though but I was waiting until pig gets big enough to eat them just in case Jupiter doesn't like them.

Jup showed a little interest in dubia today but changed him mine. As soon as I got it in his mouth he ate it willingly so at least he is getting food now. If I have too, I'm ok with using supers I just need a different source for them.

 

[MissT]

I think you can get butters in different sizes (at least, we can over here and generally we don't have as much available to us ). Plus, you can go a little bigger than the space between the eyes because they are all soft bodied. I think I was feeding Kazi medium butterworms when he was about 3 months old. I usually but tubs of 25 mixed sizes- there are usually about 5 that are about the same size as wax worms.

 

[Sherri]

Its early still, he's only been awake a couple hours. He is basking and looking alert, hoping he will willing try some dubia today. I'm off to the store in a bit to pick up some baby food and a squash.

Oh, Gail, I am so sorry this is happening!
Jupiters pics really do look pretty good to me though...a lot better than Razz was looking a couple of weeks ago...remember I posted about all the meds and he would not eat? I know Razz was on meds and Jupiter has only been on baytril, but baytril will add to his not feeling well for sure.

Try the largest freshly molted dubias you can find...that was the only thing Razz would eat for almost 2 months..I was syringe feeding baby food and...ok, sounds gross, but blended up dubia. He would not eat them and the large nymphs were perfect to blend...you could go to a thrift store and get a cheap cheap blender for that and maybe blend up his greens in it as well.

I was digging through the dubia bin every hour when I could looking for the freshly molted ones, so I know it is very hands on to do.

I always mixed the bee pollen with the acidopholiz. I don't know if it made a difference, but 4 or 5 days after baytril and using the acidopholiz and pollen his appetite increased. And the sun...got him out twice per day, 40 minutes each time is all b/c it is toooooo dang hot here. Just mentioning this b/c every day......his appetite was there a little just minutes after coming back in. It was the only time he would eat a little for weeks.

Sorry I am rambling on, just trying to think of things you could try. I agree that I bet Tracie can help with the fecal sample!

Does he still want to come out and run around?

He really does look good and bright to us though, so have a lot of hope that he will bounce back. I read a very interesting article that I wish I could find...about reptiles needing to heal when they don't feel well and sometimes trying to feed them too much will get in the way of their recovery. I think they know this, although I agree syringe feeding definately has its place, especially to get the calcium and vitamins into them.

I am going to see if you posted those new pond pics and please try to relax; easier said than done!
~Sherri

 

[izz]

Hope he gets better very soon Gail .

What colour phase is he?? Its so pretty! :mrgreen:



Sparks sends his very best beardie wishes to Jupiter and you! :mrgreen:

Izzy + Sparks :mrgreen:

 

[Gail]

My dubia colony is pretty skimpy, but I will keep a eye out for molted ones. He used to eat those pretty well, I think he would eat supers now but I froze all I had left. I'll have to pick some up from the pet store on Mon.

I give acidophiles every 2-3 days, I remember reading some where that if they get it too often then they become dependent. I wish I could feed him a slurry but the syringe really stresses him out. I think some teeth have actually broke from forcing his mouth open. I may try having hubby dump straight pollen in his mouth while I pull down on his beard. I don't know if I could make a thick pollen paste and inject it in the dubia. They are actually pretty easy to get him to eat, maybe I'll try that tomorrow.

He hasn't had much time outside the last few days but I'm going to let him in his big outdoor cage tomorrow, at least for a couple hours. I hope he doesn't rub his chin wound any more, its healing really well.

He did want out today, so I let him sit in the window and look outside. He doesn't do much more then sit but thats all he has ever done. He never has been a overly active dragon. I did get the pond pics up, green water and all :shock:

Thanks Izz, he is a blood red leatherback. He is a lot more of a rusty orange then he looks in the pics. I just can't capture orange very well.

 

[Drache613]

Hello Gail,

How is Jupiter doing?
The Baytril really can cause them to feel sick & lethargic. You can give the probiotics though for a couple of weeks after you stop giving the Baytril though to make sure his tummy is better.
I am not sure how long it would for the toxicity of cedar to completely clear out of his system, it could take weeks or possibly months.
Is he becoming a little more active?
That is too bad he doesn't like the syringe though but what about a dropper? Be careful if you pull down on the beard down so the beard doesn't get injured.

I hope Jupiter is feeling better.

Tracie

 

[marxxx]

A couple things, cedar is really bad for lizards so that may have stressed him. He doesn't look bad in the photos so I don't think it built up to a point of being toxic.

Second, if you are going to force feed there are a couple really good things to try. Look for high calorie vitamin paste at your feed store. You mentioned being in the country, they almost all have it for livestock. Get a nice teaspoon full in his mouth twice a week and that will keep him going for quite a while. It's cheap and works wonders. If for some you reason you can't find that, try baby food twice a week (just put in the mouth and see if he will swallow - the baby food can pushed through a syringe without needle to the back of the mouth and see if he will swallow without forcing down the throat).

He may just need some time to get over it. If not for being sick recently I would say to let him brumate, but due to his history I would say to make sure his cage is warm to keep his immune system up.

Please note this is from my experience in reptiles (20 years now). I am relatively new to beardies and won't claim otherwise, but this has helped many sick animals over the years. It is not intended to replace vet care as I always recommend that, but rather to be used when no care is available.

Best of luck, at this point it looks like he should pull through.