Do YOU think Beardies Can Love You?

[Fuzzyviper]

Everyone using dogs and cats as examples of animals capable of love must realize that these animals have purposely been bred to react to human emotions. Also, while they do indeed have the capacity to form bonds with humans, they do not have the complex set of emotions we consider love in humans. I don't think I would be way off base to assume that by breeding for companionship, the ability to form these bonds and show these emotions has grown as they became more and more domesticated. I am not claiming that these animals are not capable of "love" but as a previous poster already said, there are many types and levels of love. As an example, cats are capable of showing us companionship and affection but the wild cats they are most close to genetically are solitary hunters that do not get along with other individuals (While the genetic origin of cats is currently debated, most agree that they developed from the African wildcat, which is a solitary creature). The only cat that does this in the wild is the lion. Yet our cats show not only humans but other species and even other cats affection and form tight bonds.

I think the ability to form a bond with another creature is at least the precursor of "love" since it usually involves familiarity, trust, and even some enjoyment (since some reptiles will seek out their owner for reasons other than protection or food). Intelligence also plays a role in the emotional capacity of an animal and beardies are intelligent lizards. While I cannot say they love us in a human way from a scientific standpoint, they do show the ability to bond with individuals and might develop this ability even more as they are further domesticated. I would be interested in seeing how breeding beardies for their temperament would affect this over several generations, which is an experiment they have done in Russia with the red fox. Within a few generations, the foxes have gone from fearful of humans to seeking them out for companionship and have become quite doglike in temperament, simply by breeding the least aggressive and fearful animals together. There is an article in National Geographic about it from a year or so ago and it is quite interesting.

 

[Germ]

I merely bought his lighting set up, with him the same day, even though it wasn't right, it still temporarily saved me £40, and as dragon PLUS lighting was only £40, I'd say I picked up a real bargain.

Dragon Plus is a LED lighting system, is it not? I am unfamiliar with this lighting system, I'm curious, do LEDs actually radiate the necessary heat.

Thanks in advance,
Germain

 

[Cnochur]

"Love" and empathy for us as humans is an evolutionary thing we developed as a pack animal- meaning that since our species survives and propagates itself best when we cooperate, it's in our interest to feel for each other. Beardies don't have that issue. They can see us as providers, protectors, and sources of good things, but they're not capable of the kind of emotional connections that say, a dog, or some other pack mammal is. Personally, I'm content to love my dragon, if he can't ever really return the favor.

 

[Explora]

I absolutely agree that beardies don't have the capacity to love in the traditional sense, but I like to think Atlas is at least a little fond of me; what I mean is that he recognizes who feeds him and handles him every day. There is a marked difference in his behavior when I hold him versus when my roommate does. He lets her hold him without a problem, but he reacts to the sound of my voice and laughter, which puzzled our vet haha!

Perhaps with beardies it's an issue of comfort. Atlas hates car rides with a passion, but if I put him under my shirt and sing along with the radio while driving he turns bright white because he likes the sound/feel of my voice vibrating through my chest. Speaking of, he also puts his best colors on when we play and go on trips to PetSmart. At the store he sits on my shoulder and rarely moves, although he won't sit with me for long at home.

A final anecdote that makes me smile: Atlas has a wonderful temperament and has never threatened me in the least. The only time he's ever bitten me was completely by accident. I was hand-feeding him on his rock, and he lost his balance and fell forward, biting down on my finger out of instinct. I washed the tiny bite, and when I returned to feeding him he was extremely slow and gentle, as if he recognized that he had hurt me and was sorry! I'm sure there's a more scientific explanation, but it's nice to tell myself it was because he's fond of me haha

 

[Jess]

A final anecdote that makes me smile: Atlas has a wonderful temperament and has never threatened me in the least. The only time he's ever bitten me was completely by accident. I was hand-feeding him on his rock, and he lost his balance and fell forward, biting down on my finger out of instinct. I washed the tiny bite, and when I returned to feeding him he was extremely slow and gentle, as if he recognized that he had hurt me and was sorry! I'm sure there's a more scientific explanation, but it's nice to tell myself it was because he's fond of me haha

Dudley did that too once! I was hand feeding him blueberries, and he got a little over excited and chomped down on my finger. He seemed to be extra slow and gentle afterwards when I was hand feeding him, so it makes me wonder exactly what they know.

Dud will also start blackbearding and body-slamming the doors to his viv if he sees me feeding my leo geckos before him. :roll: I don't think they love either, but they really are smart little guys.

 

[Valerie]

Yeah, I have been having to hand /force feed Sizzle again. This time I am forcing dubias into her in hopes she gets her protein and baby veggie food or fresh veggies. Anyway, when I take out the towel and lay it on my bed to feed her she tries to run. I am now ready for her but when I take out her blanket and lay it on the bed to wrap her up she just sits there. I have the lights on at all times so it is not that the lights are out. Sometimes I feed her again late in the evening as I keep hoping she will eat on her own and when she does not I feed her in a towel. So the time of day is not the reason she sits nicley in her blanket. I think she knows the difference.
PS I always leave enough time after I feed her to turn of her lights so her food is digested.

 

[PumpkinJelly]

Once I was giving Fiz a mixture of applesauce and squash at a baby food consistency by letting him lick it off of my finger, and he got really excited because he liked the taste of it. So he started out licking, then biting, and then chomping, whereas he accidentally bit my finger. (I didn't bleed or anything, so I didn't really mind) So i got a spoon and started feeding it to him that way and he licked it off all nice and gentle! Lol! (Just to relate to your previous post)

Are Beardies emotionless drones that can't have any positive outward feelings toward anyone? No, I do not believe that.

I believe they can either like or dislike us. They know that we're the reason they get food everyday, so that makes them like us.

When Fiz sees me, logic kicks into his little brain and says "Okay, She has food" and he enjoys my presence because I give him food, so he is kind toward me.

Those are just my thoughs

 

[Jess]

I always use tweezers to feed my reptiles, so I think they associate that with food more than me LOL. When Dudley sees my bug tweezers, he gets really excited and tries to eat the tweezers before I even pick up the bugs. They all freak out when I open the dubia bin too, because they hear them crawling aorund.

Maybe this is why my lizards are never that excited to see me? :lol:

 

[PumpkinJelly]

Jess: LOL! When my two are big enough to eat worms, I'm going to use tweezers so one day a piece of metal will be more exciting than me! LOL

You without tweezers - Dudley: "Oh, it's just Jess".
You with tweezers - Dudley: "OMGOMGOMGOMGOMG THE TWEEZERS OMG THE MOST BEAUTIFUL THING I'VE EVER SEEN YAYAY THE TWEEZERS ARE HERE! STANLEY! STELLA! IT'S THE TWEEZERS!"

 

[Valerie]

Once I was giving Fiz a mixture of applesauce and squash at a baby food consistency by letting him lick it off of my finger, and he got really excited because he liked the taste of it. So he started out licking, then biting, and then chomping, whereas he accidentally bit my finger. (I didn't bleed or anything, so I didn't really mind) So i got a spoon and started feeding it to him that way and he licked it off all nice and gentle! Lol! (Just to relate to your previous post)

I was doing the babay food and apple sauce thing too. And still do some but I worry about her getting what she needs. So I am feeding her insects and baby foods. When I do feed baby food and applesauce she licks it off her nose, she really likes it.
Valerie

 

[PumpkinJelly]

The squash and applesauce mixture was because Fiz likes applesauce and KD likes squash so i figured If I combine the two then i can feed that to them both. Fiz doesn't care for squash and KD doesn't care for applesauce. LOL, they're opposites and I found a solution for it! That's just one of their salad topper treats. If there's applesauce or squash spread on their salad, they'll gobble up every bite! I also just feed it to them via spoon for a treat in between salads and bug meals.

When I give it to them as a treat, I put it in a syringe so they just bite the syringe and I depress a little bit into their mouth, then they pull away, swallow, and then bite it again. They try to eat the syringe it's hysterical! They love it more than I do! And it's so funny when I wash out all the applesauce and refill it with water, and then they bite the syringe expecting some delicious applesauce/squash mixture and they get a mouthful of water, and they're like "WHAT? WHERE'S THE YUMMY STUFF? THIS NO YUMMY!" hahaha

 

[Jess]

Jess: LOL! When my two are big enough to eat worms, I'm going to use tweezers so one day a piece of metal will be more exciting than me! LOL

You without tweezers - Dudley: "Oh, it's just Jess".
You with tweezers - Dudley: "OMGOMGOMGOMGOMG THE TWEEZERS OMG THE MOST BEAUTIFUL THING I'VE EVER SEEN YAYAY THE TWEEZERS ARE HERE! STANLEY! STELLA! IT'S THE TWEEZERS!"

Yup, that's basically what happens! Without my magical tweezers, I'm just some boring human who bugs them too much. Haha!

 

[PumpkinJelly]

LOL!

My Beardies really love the black cricket tube. It's this plastic black tube that goes into my cricket container for easy cricket dispensing. Well, they have figured out that their favorite little buggies come from this magical black thing. So now, when KD sees this, he literally stands on his back two legs as long as he can, flailing the two front ones in front of him, looking up, mouth open, tongue out, and wobbling, ready to catch any crickets that fall! And when he falls over, he's quick to pick himself back up and repeat! Fiz is starting to do the same thing, except when he sees the plastic baggy I use to dust the crickets, he gets all excited!

Fiz is usually happy to see me. Sometimes he'll give me this look like "Leave me alone, I'm basking". LOL. Or when I take him out to let him go to sleep in the blankets on my bed, he'll look up at me before sleeping as if he's saying "Good night, giant!". But when I wake him up to take him from his sleeping spot in the blankets to his tank, he gives me this sleepy-eyed look like "hey i was comfy!" and he's all droopy and sleepy and as soon as he's in his bed in his tank he's like "ah, sleep time!" and goes to sleep! hahah!

 

[Valerie]

I want to see pictures of them standing on their back legs, Please oh please

 

[PumpkinJelly]

Hahaah! Ill have to upload a pic or two of KD in action! Ill try to take a few pics tomorrow morning if i have time!