Butterworms and Pheonixworms

[mobseed]

Hi there,
I was just trying to figure that out: it is ok to feed my beardie phoeonixworms and butterworms ( she is 27cm long)
thank for reponses

 

[diamc]

Yes, it's fine. Did you find a place to order them from?

 

[mobseed]

Hi ,
Ye I finally do...They are from UK they also have silkworms, phoenix, butter :d
It is graet the shipping it's about 3 days it is not much...

 

[LJean]

Butters and phoenix worms are my staples for now.

 

[Embee]

I've read that butters are too high in fat to be fed as a staple... but can be used as a treat... ??? Other than that, they share a lot of qualities with the phoenix, I believe.

We're feeding phoenix to our little guy right now (7 inches or so), and they have become his staple by default because he won't touch the crickets since we introduced the worms. Fine by me, it's nice to have a break from crickets!

Best of luck with the worms!

Em

 

[Beardys Rock]

You have it wrong, Wax Worms are the worms high in fat.

 

[NegativeCreep]

Butter worms are high in calories from fat - so yes, they can still be very fattening. On the other hand, I feed them as a 'staple', sort of. I feed mainly crickets and I supplement butter worms and vegetables.
Just don't overdo the butters and be sure to offer a variety - this way, you can be sure your babies are getting a balanced diet!

 

[GoFast]

Butter worms are high in calories from fat - so yes, they can still be very fattening. On the other hand, I feed them as a 'staple', sort of. I feed mainly crickets and I supplement butter worms and vegetables.
Just don't overdo the butters and be sure to offer a variety - this way, you can be sure your babies are getting a balanced diet!

actually, crickets have a higher fat ration that butterworms.
crickets=6.0%
butterworms=5.2%

Source:
http://www.beautifuldragons.503xtreme.com/Nutritionframeset.html

 

[NegativeCreep]

Butter worms are high in calories from fat - so yes, they can still be very fattening. On the other hand, I feed them as a 'staple', sort of. I feed mainly crickets and I supplement butter worms and vegetables.
Just don't overdo the butters and be sure to offer a variety - this way, you can be sure your babies are getting a balanced diet!

actually, crickets have a higher fat ration that butterworms.
crickets=6.0%
butterworms=5.2%

Source:
http://www.beautifuldragons.503xtreme.com/Nutritionframeset.html

Yes, they aren't high in "FAT" but, like I said, they are high in CALORIES from FAT - Calories/Fat 87.73
http://www.premiumcrickets.com/Butter-Worms_32.html

ETA: this is the only reason they aren't considered a regular feeder - even this chart says to use them occasionally.

 

[Embee]

You have it wrong, Wax Worms are the worms high in fat.

To be clear, my post was simply reiterating what I'd read previously (here on forum, actually), not what I knew for sure. Hence, the ???? I too, am trying to figure this one out. So in effect, what you're saying is, that the information I've read previously with regard to butters was incorrect? (I wasn't confusing with wax btw, because I'm aware that they are quite the fattening treat. :mrgreen: ) I'm encouraged by this "correction" however, because my initial understanding was that I wouldn't be able to move on to butters as a staple once the phoenix became too small for beardie. I know they are similar, yet bigger, and she loves PWs so very much. Perhaps then, it would be ok to use them, if not as a full staple, as a "partial staple?" Or do you maintain that they can be used as a full staple?

Butter worms are high in calories from fat - so yes, they can still be very fattening. On the other hand, I feed them as a 'staple', sort of. I feed mainly crickets and I supplement butter worms and vegetables.
Just don't overdo the butters and be sure to offer a variety - this way, you can be sure your babies are getting a balanced diet!

Yes, I've read this in several places, the fat calories... this would be my concern in using butters as a full staple. Here are a couple of threads I read previously... that lead me to wonder about butters:

http://www.beardeddragon.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=97258&p=757521&hilit=butters+staple#p757521

http://www.beardeddragon.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=98003&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&hilit=butters+staple

Em

 

[GoFast]

yes, the chart that I posted also said to use them occasionally but it also said the same for crickets so I am not sure what your point is with that. I looked at the link you posted as well with that cal from fat statistic, but I couldnt find the same info for crickets. Am i just missing it?? :?:

 

[NegativeCreep]

yes, the chart that I posted also said to use them occasionally but it also said the same for crickets so I am not sure what your point is with that. I looked at the link you posted as well with that cal from fat statistic, but I couldnt find the same info for crickets. Am i just missing it?? :?:

No, most charts don't post the cal/fat info because it's irrelevant. The butters are just incredibly high.
Don't get me wrong, I use butters on an almost-daily basis - I just don't want anyone fattening up their beardies without knowing the facts.

 

[Embee]

Hee, hee... I just realized that you were referring to Negative Creeps link, not mine. Man, I'm just about as confused as they get today. *sigh*

 

[GoFast]

yes, the chart that I posted also said to use them occasionally but it also said the same for crickets so I am not sure what your point is with that. I looked at the link you posted as well with that cal from fat statistic, but I couldnt find the same info for crickets. Am i just missing it?? :?:

No, most charts don't post the cal/fat info because it's irrelevant. The butters are just incredibly high.
Don't get me wrong, I use butters on an almost-daily basis - I just don't want anyone fattening up their beardies without knowing the facts.

yes, I too am trying to find the "facts" here. You are saying crickets are better and I am trying to figure out if that is fact or just an overall opinion. If it is fact, then let me see some facts supporting it.

How is cal/fat info irrelevant when asked about for crickets but you used it as a "relevant" point against butterworms? According the "bible" here(the link i posted) crickets have a higher percentage of fat than butters.

 

[GoFast]

yes, the chart that I posted also said to use them occasionally but it also said the same for crickets so I am not sure what your point is with that. I looked at the link you posted as well with that cal from fat statistic, but I couldnt find the same info for crickets. Am i just missing it?? :?:

Yikes, I thought my last post was clear as to my ignorance. Apologies. I'm not trying to make a point, I'm just trying to figure this out, just camping on with the OP in this question, as it were. I'm fairly new to all this you see, and it seems there is a difference of opinion on butters, and I was just trying to get some definitive information. I linked the posts, in effect, to explain my confusion on the matter, not because I was attempting to initiate a debate. My only point being, that I'm confused. :?

Interesting that beautifuldragons has crickets as an occasional as well. I've overlooked the chart a few times, but it was mainly to check out the veggie/fruit information. Think I'll go back and take it in again, and educate myself further. This site, and the chart have both been a wealth of information, for which I'm very grateful.

The best,
Em

:lol: Em, I think we were just posting at the same time. I was actually talking to "negativecreep"