Extremely Ill Beardie

Hi there...looking for any tips or advice..trying to keep my beardie alive...I've taken her to the vet a couple of times now...her X-rays and calcium look great...her blood work was awful...her white counts is sky high...red and iron was almost non-existent...the vet seems surprised she's still breathing...she's a fighter, I love her so very much...any tips, she won't eat so I've been trying to syringe feed her repti-boost and a greens mixture with a touch of probiotics (she also shows signs of yellow fungus)...the vet recommended trying baby food for extra iron...she said what she needs is a transfusion but she doesn't have the capability or donor blood to do it...she's on antibiotics for a week now...she seems to just want to sleep most of the day and night, I check on her and wake her for short times to get her warmed up and nutrition...she's never brunated, will be 2 in August...I know all about temps and lighting...new bulbs, all good...she just won't stay in them and she won't eat

Poor girl. It sounds like you're doing the right things to try and help. Trying the baby food or some oxbow critical care may help. You'll want to keep her as well hydrated as possible too. Did the vet run an atadenovirus test?

Sorry that you're dealing with this, maybe some more information about what the vet actually diagnosed would be helpful to us. Besides the Yellow Fungus (did the vet do a skin scraping test to confirm Yellow Fungus, or are they just guessing based on visible findings?) did the vet do a culture and sensitivity to actually diagnose what infection your beardie has? I mean, he put him on most likely a broad-spectrum antibiotic based on his high white cell count, which is obviously indicative of a major Infection of some kind, but did he actually diagnose the bacteria causing the infection, the kind of infection, and where it's located? Without doing cultures of his mouth, sinuses, throat, etc., diagnosing the exact bacteria or fungus that is causing the Infection, locating where the infection is originating from, and doing a sensitivity test to determine the correct and specific antibiotic/antifungal to treat that specific bug and the location of the bug, he's just blindly taking a shot in the dark that a broad spectrum (probably oral) antibiotic will get rid of the infection, while in reality you may be giving him an antibiotic that is doing nothing and the infection in the meantime is spreading. He seemed to be aggressive in doing an x-ray and blood work, but it's odd if that's all that he did.

Is this vet a certified Reptile/Herp Vet, or an "exotics" vet that sees reptiles? There is a huge difference between the two when treating something like this, so that's why I'm asking. If he's not a certified Reptile vet you probably want to think seriously about finding the closest vet that is a certified Reptile vet with lots of bearded dragon experience to you and getting him there ASAP along with the blood work results. Did they give you a copy of his test results, x-ray, etc.? If so, can you post the results? There is a moderator here named Tracie that can decipher the results for you and give her opinion. What antibiotic is he on? Baytril? I'm just guessing...Did he do a fecal?

You need to keep getting fluids and nutrition in him because without them he will not be able to fight off the Infection with or without antibiotics. Reptiles heal very slowly and recovery times are long, even after finishing a round of antibiotics. That's why it's so important that the exact bug is cultured and diagnosed, and the correct antibiotic is used the first time, because if it's not and time is wasted, it makes it all the more difficult to treat the infection even with the appropriate medications.

Thank you for the responses, I didn't know how to reply, my first time on here...I've found it through google searches and read some info but never been active until today....
Yes, Baytril...I think she's not the certified vet... I found the one in my state who is and she's agreed to consult with the other one and even do the transfusion "experimentally" if need be and I can find the blood...now I have to wait for Monday to get here...she didn't do a scrape, just visual...I think with her being so ill she was trying not to irritate her more...I don't think the vet thinks she will make it
The vet advised I keep her really hot but she seems to hate it and stays black beard...if I let her be cool and rest she calms down...I've soaked her with mild betadine solution today and she finally ate a dusted hornworm for me today...a really big one, too (hubby brought it home for her)...I've offered raspberries and greens but she won't eat them, roach either...so feeling grateful she had something today...at least the worm was big and juicy and I had dusted it with reptiboost and calcium mix...she seems a little bit more alert today, she's been awake almost 5 hours so feeling hopeful...yesterday she only stayed up for maybe 2

She was much more alert today and for almost 10 hours!!! She pooed good, I snuck some reptiboost and greens in when she was gaping...she was pretty mad but calmed down ok. Offered foood she refused but when bathing her in the betadine she kept trying to drink the water so I dumped it out quick and made fresh with pedialyte in it and sure enough she drank it...so relieved she drank quite a lot, too and then she sat outside in the sun with me for an hour and still sat under her lights another few after that! Her mouth is still really pale, the vet said it's because she has no iron, I'm hoping if I can keep getting the reptiboost in her it will help! I can't tell you how great it feels to see some of her normal mannerisms reappear, I know she's still very sick but I feel like she's winning the fight! She did get some of the betadine water so another worry...I lifted her head up but idk how much she got....I made it pretty mild and lifted her up but I still worry...man these guys can cause a lot of worry but relieved overall...I'll stop posting here since I feel like she's on her way, we see the vet again Friday...but I wanted to update you guys!

Oh noooooo!!! You keep posting, we like to her about successes! Posting here every/or every other day would be great to hear. It will also help others that might come across this thread that need encouragement. It will also serve as a record of your dragon's journey.

Hello,

Sorry your girl is having so many issues right now, poor thing!
If you have a copy of the blood test, that would be great to look over it if possible. `
That's great the Baytril seems to be helping her out. Be sure to keep her warm overnight, around 80 or so for helping boost her immune system. It sounds like she enjoyed being outside, too.
We definitely want to hear of her progress so please update us daily!

Tracie

Yes, don't stop posting, it's nice to hear good things for a change! The hornworms are a good idea if she'll eat them, any nutrition you can get in her is going to help her fight the Infection. You did the right thing in dusting the hornworm, repeat if you can. I wish I had a pet store locally that sold them or Phoenix/Reptiworms, all I have within 2 hours of me is a Petco and 2 private pet shops and between all of them I can get crickets, mealworms, wax worms, and superworms. I asked someone at Petco a month ago if they would ever carry hornworms, because I know PetSmart does, and he told me no because they sell "frozen pinky mice" for Beardies as a treat, and they're better than hornworms for them. He was the general manager of the entire Petco. Uhg.

Anyway, I'm assuming she's feeling better due to a combo of the food and fluids and the Baytril finally kicking in, it's a good choice as a broad-spectrum antibiotic. Reptiles heal slowly so it often takes weeks to actually see the effects of the antibiotics. I'd keep trying to feed her what she'll eat, if it's a big hornworm a day then so be it, they're nutritious, if it's a few wax worms a day then so be it, it's nutrition. As you feed her and keep giving her the Pedialyte you should see her gums slowly pink up because of the nutrition from the food. You may not even need to pursue the transfusion if she keeps eating. Others here may disagree with me recommending hornworms, wax worms, etc. but if she's malnourished enough that she needs a blood transfusion due to anemia, then I believe it doesn't matter if what she's eating is fatty. It's a short-term thing and the alternative is, well, you know what the alternative is.

And don't worry about her drinking a little watered-down Betadine, it's just Iodine, like the kind added to table salt, we all need a little of it in our diets. The small amount she drank was not poisonous, she'd have to drink quite a bit to be seriously harmful. You did the right thing, if she starts drinking the Betadine water during her soaks just stop her and give her fresh, clean water. Using unflavored Pedialyte is a great idea as well, electrolytes and hydration are going to help just as much as the nutrition is.

I've stated on here before that in my studies of Animal Health Science throughout college and grad school, and then working at the Animal Diagnostics Lab at Penn State University afterwards, often people are so concerned with "treating" their pets for whatever illness or injury it is they have, they often times forget to force nutrition and hydration, and then the medical treatments they are giving their pets doesn't work because the animal is too weak, too anemic, too dehydrated, too malnourished for the medical treatments to have a chance to work. And this doesn't just apply to the pet owners, but their veterinarians as well. How often do you see veterinarians giving a sick dog IV fluids or nutrition before sending them home? Sick or injured pets don't often stay overnight in animal hospitals, either due to financial reasons or just because it's deemed unnecessary. Sick or injured people however are very often admitted into the hospital, either overnight or at least into the ER for a number of hours. And the very first thing that is done in the ER is an IV is put in and a fluid solution like Lactated Ringers is administered. It's just the protocol. So why don't we treat sick or injured animals the same way? I've often told people on here to "Force Feed" or "Force Fluids" to their Beardies and I've had others tell me I'm wrong because it will stress the beardie out, and it's okay if they lose a little weight. Well I'm not telling them to force nutrition and fluids because of weight loss, but because if a bearded dragon is seriously ill and hasn't eaten in days and is dehydrated, how are their bodies supposed to fight off an infection?

You all are the best!!! I'm so glad to have found this forum!!!
She seems worse today...I had to run out to the store and she pooed while I was out, I didn't expect it bcz she hadn't eaten much and had gone yesterday but must be the fluids are working through her..it stresses her out and I clean it and bathe her immediately, so my daughter had a hard time calming her down...I came home and cleaned her up and sat her in the sun a bit while her antibiotic thawed and gave her that, she feels very weak and is staying black beard today...it's so sad and such a helpless feeling...I'm going to go re-read all of these and am so grateful for the tip, help, and support here...she seems mad when I keep her heated up so I was allowing her to cool down...I thought maybe it's like brumation a little and they use the rest to heal...the humidity is almost 50% today so I didn't want to bring her out much but I think a little real sun might help and I bought another hornworm and I was trying to coat it in chicken baby food to get her that, too since the vet suggested it might help her iron and I killed the worm so I'll go grab another...very grateful we have a great pet store close by
Going to take her outside and read again, thank you all so very much!!!

Natural sunlight is very good as long as she likes it outside, my 8 month old girl is harness trained and does well if we're in a store like Petco or Home Depot and she's riding around in the cart, but if we're sitting out in the yard she totally freaks out at birds flying overhead, cars driving by, etc.

I'm sure the extra poop is due to the fluids, that will happen and usually it's very runny. I'm sure she is very weak if she's that anemic, she's malnourished and as I said if she eats the hornworms or whatever it is she'll eat, feed it to her. She needs the nutrition.

Where are you at with the vet and her treatment? Obviously she's still on the antibiotics, but what is the overall diagnosis? Like, what is the general consensus as to what her major issue is that is making her sick? The malnourishment and the anemia is a result of her loss of appetite, which is a symptom of whatever it is that is causing the problem to begin with. I guess what I'm saying is that sometimes we get so wrapped up in treating the symptoms that we don't properly treat the actual disease or infection that is causing the symptoms. The Baytril is obviously being given for a suspected bacterial infection, but what Infection are they treating?

I hope she pulls through for you. It's so hard when they are sick. Sounds like you are doing everything you can. Please keep us updated.

Another bad day, I took her back to the vet today...she says there's nothing more she can do for her and if I think she's suffering she can euthanize her...I lost it...she presented with a heart murmur sound today that the vet said could also be because her blood is so thin..she wanted to run other labs but I don't want to give any more of her blood, she needs it! She said then she could determine if it were her kidneys failing so I asked then what and she said, well...nothing, she'd need a transplant to survive and there aren't donors...she's also doing this weird like gasping for air when I try to take her out in the sun...she also peed on me on the way home from the vet, it's just a little odd...she's always been potty once a day...the air gasping is scary so I keep checking to be sure she's breathing...she's never done this before she almost threw herself back off my chest and full on beard gaping and was like gasping...so I wasn't able to get anything in her today, I tried but she left it just sitting there and won't eat it away, it's inside by her teeth but she won't eat it...I asked the vet if they could feed her while I was there and she said if she didn't eat that she likely wouldn't eat and then there's a chance she'd aspirate it and die so I left feeling quite distraught...Stella is sleeping and appears to be comfortable...I don't know...it's crazy because I thought she was on the mend...I don't want to let her suffer but I don't want to let her go if she can beat this either...feeling helpless and exhausted...defeated feeling...hope tomorrow is better...everyone is closed now but I'm thinking tomorrow I'll call the specialist and see if we can get in there...

Hi Stella, I'm so sorry that your girl is so ill. I hope that there may be something that by even a slim chance could give a little bit of hope. It does sound like she may not make it though, and I truly feel for you.

I'm sooo sorry to hear she is not doing well. My Evee had been ill from the time I got her as a rescue, til I lost her (she passed in her sleep) in February. It rips your heart to see them like that.

I really hope that you get a miracle and she pulls through, she doesn't sound well though

I don't envy your horrible situation - I know you are trying hard to help her .

It's a terrible choice to have to make , but you need to consider if she's in pain or suffering , and if she'll have any quality of life at all if she manages to survive this crisis , only you and your vet can make that decision (jointly).