Wobbly, weak, beardy...need help

[doombunny]

Me and my friends each have a beaded dragon and today i went over to one of their houses...I noticed that her beardy seemed a little off. He is maybe 7 - 8 months old, not really sure. Anyways for the past few weeks he has been very wobbly and weak, like when he is sitting on his stick/log like thing he would fall to the side every once in a while but try to get back up on it. His head sort of lolls to the side and he doesn't walk straight, like he's disoriented or something. I am very concerned for her beardy... she feeds him a mix of live and freeze dried crix, some banana every once in a while, and a little bit of greens, but has been lacking those for a while. She did just recently switched to a new tank but the wobbly-ness started at a later time than that. He also has trouble catching the live crix, if they get close enough he may be able to get them otherwise he is to weak to chase after them. I picked him up and he barely moved at all, his limbs were very limp, and his head just sort of flopped on my hand. I thought for a while today that it may have been calcium deficiency, but the symptoms didn't quite match up, so i really don't know what's going on...I'm really concerned for him...any thought...?
If you need more info that i may have forgotten then just ask...ok?

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

No you are most likely correct. Just because they supplement calcium doesn't mean he isn't suffering from a calcium deficiency. If they do not provide good UVB lighting, he can't absorb his calcium & vitamins.
Hypocalemia does cause balance issues such as that in early stages.
So do you know if they use a UVB light?

Tracie

 

[doombunny]

Her tank is a forty gallon that is maybe a foot and a half tall, so the lights are a bit higher than i would think they should be, they do have a regular UVB light and then a second UVB light that is like a spotlight so it is more concentrated in one area, she got the tank and the more concentrated light from a friend who had used it with their own reptile(s) and they said it worked fine... I'm not sure what kind of reptile they had so maybe the lighting is not sufficient enough for her beardy?
I'm not really sure about the effectiveness of the regular UVB light, but the second more concentrated one seemed to be fine, I would like to add that I observed that her beardy mainly stayed under the concentrated one throughout the day. She turns off the lights at night, and her moves about to find a place to sleep, but other than that the only other times i had seen him move from that spot was to try to catch a few crix(which was quite unsuccessful).
hmmm...
I can't think of anything else to suggest, but I hope that helped a little more...?

 

[jortiz9758]

If they got the tank and lights from someone else who used it on a different lizard....I have to ask how old the lights are? I usually replace mine once a year beacause they do wear out( UV source) even though they dont blow out.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

I do need the type & brand of UVB. If the UVB light is older than 5 or 6 months then it needs to be replaced. The UVB emissions fall off after that.
The best UVB light is the Reptisun 10 flourescent tube bulb. Steer away from the Reptiglo 10 tube bulb & compact & coil light, the ESU or Zilla lights too.
She is exhibiting signs of metabolic bone disease so they need to check their UVB lights as soon as possible.
She could be dehydrated if the tank is too hot, which could cause loss of balance, as well.


Tracie

 

[brkfstclb]

Hello,

I do need the type & brand of UVB. If the UVB light is older than 5 or 6 months then it needs to be replaced. The UVB emissions fall off after that.
The best UVB light is the Reptisun 10 flourescent tube bulb. Steer away from the Reptiglo 10 tube bulb & compact & coil light, the ESU or Zilla lights too.
She is exhibiting signs of metabolic bone disease so they need to check their UVB lights as soon as possible.
She could be dehydrated if the tank is too hot, which could cause loss of balance, as well.


Tracie

I was going to say that it was MBD right away. Any time I hear these things it feels terrible to hear. Well I wouldn't go that far as to say steer away from Reptiglo or Zilla bulbs. I have never personally had Reptiglo, but I do have used Zilla's desert 50 bulbs for my beardie about a year now. I like them. My baby never had MBD or any other freaky problems (thank goodness). So its just a matter of choice I guess. Using them correctly is important, too! Don't forget to read up on d3. Wait, did you say you gave your beardie d3?

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

I highly recommend staying away from the Reptiglo 10 flourescent tube lights, as well as the Zilla T50 tropical series despite what the previous poster implied.
The Zilla lights are extremely hazardous light & have been linked to deaths when used improperly.
Here is a link stating a special report on the Zilla lights:

http://www.uvguide.co.uk/phototherapyphosphor.htm

To Brkfstclb, your dragon is very lucky thus far, that he has not had any problems with metabolic bone disease as of yet. The Zilla bulbs are not very good lights, at all. They were used with the incorrect phosphor coating when they were manufactured which allows UVC to penetrate through the glass. Since there are no long term studies done on reptiles with exposure to radiation done, I prefer NOT to recommend them as they are very hazardous lights.
Unfortunately, MBD does not always set in quickly to where we can see it immediately which oftentimes makes it difficult to catch until it has already begun doing damage. It can creep up on them very slowly & then one day you will notice a bone deviation such as the jaw protruding, etc. They can technically go awhile without UVB while some suffer a worse fate.
The Reptiglo 10 flourescent tube bulb is a horrible light. It emits low wavelength frequency of UVB which is close to UVC. That is not a safe wavelength for reptiles. It also does not favor D3 synthesis, either. So, when using lights like that, they cannot properly absorb calcium very well so supplementing the calcium may not be helping with absorption.
Eventually, he will most likely show some type of symptoms. We have had numbers of people on here that have used that both bulbs & have had problems with Metabolic Bone Disease among other problems especially eye swellings & poor appetite.
So, do your dragon a favor & get a better & safer light. Sure it is a matter of choice, but once you are educated on lighting, you will never go back to using cruddy bulbs.

Tracie

 

[doombunny]

to Drache613, I'll see if i can get that information...I'm not sure if she knows exactly, but i should be able to find it out...

I could also try to get some video of her beardy to help show exactly what he does...and i could get some pictures of the tank and lights too maybe...

...one other thing that has been on my mind lately is this question: She has this large stick/skinny log that is a dark brown colour...since her beardy spends most of it's time laying on it, his colour has changed to a dark brown. Do they normally change colour due to their surroundings?

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

Thank you, the brand & type of the light will help. The brand should be stamped on the base of the bulb.
Pictures of the tank & lighting would be great if you can get that.
They don't normally morph to the color of their surroundings so much no, but they do turn darker or lighter depending on their temperatures at the time.
If he is dark quite a bit, he probably is not warm enough so he darkens up to try & absorb as much heat as he can.

Thanks.
Tracie

 

[brkfstclb]

Hello,

I highly recommend staying away from the Reptiglo 10 flourescent tube lights, as well as the Zilla T50 tropical series despite what the previous poster implied.
The Zilla lights are extremely hazardous light & have been linked to deaths when used improperly.
Here is a link stating a special report on the Zilla lights:

http://www.uvguide.co.uk/phototherapyphosphor.htm

To Brkfstclb, your dragon is very lucky thus far, that he has not had any problems with metabolic bone disease as of yet. The Zilla bulbs are not very good lights, at all. They were used with the incorrect phosphor coating when they were manufactured which allows UVC to penetrate through the glass. Since there are no long term studies done on reptiles with exposure to radiation done, I prefer NOT to recommend them as they are very hazardous lights.
Unfortunately, MBD does not always set in quickly to where we can see it immediately which oftentimes makes it difficult to catch until it has already begun doing damage. It can creep up on them very slowly & then one day you will notice a bone deviation such as the jaw protruding, etc. They can technically go awhile without UVB while some suffer a worse fate.
The Reptiglo 10 flourescent tube bulb is a horrible light. It emits low wavelength frequency of UVB which is close to UVC. That is not a safe wavelength for reptiles. It also does not favor D3 synthesis, either. So, when using lights like that, they cannot properly absorb calcium very well so supplementing the calcium may not be helping with absorption.
Eventually, he will most likely show some type of symptoms. We have had numbers of people on here that have used that both bulbs & have had problems with Metabolic Bone Disease among other problems especially eye swellings & poor appetite.
So, do your dragon a favor & get a better & safer light. Sure it is a matter of choice, but once you are educated on lighting, you will never go back to using cruddy bulbs.

Tracie

Well the tropicals wouldn't be enough for a beardie though. And yes I was puzzled as to why I was having no problems when you said that, but I recently contacted the company and found out they did a recall and actually redid the phosphor or something inside the tube. That made me feel somewhat better, although I would have had problems by now. I know this thread is getting old but I thought I'd post the update. And as for the reptiglo's, weren't the ones with problems the coils?

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

No, the Reptiglo 10 had or has problems with BOTH the flourescent tube light as well as the compact & coil lights.
The phosphor may have been fixed, but, the lights have not been tested so I will not recommend it until testing has been done. We are still experiencing problems with dragons that are under those lights, so, obviously they were not all recalled. I simply do not trust these lights.
As I have said, if you are going to stick with the Reptiglo 10, your dragon will not be getting adequate UVB lighting. They just do not put out enough UVBs for them since they have high requirements. If you have bright enough light then that is why your dragon did not experience any of the eye problems. However, the UVB output is still poor.

Tracie