What on earth is going on?

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Ophiophilist

Hatchling Member
I hate having to make this post, but I don't know what else to do but go to a vet, and I guess that's the next option – though I feel like there's something simple going on here and I'm just not figuring it out.

Iroh has not eaten since Monday (today is Friday). He ate a huge meal of about 80 large crickets Monday. I feed dubia as a staple, but only had a few left and had to go with crickets. (Additionally it's been a week and my dubia order has not shown up, nor is the company responding to my requests for information as to why my order is still pending. Really disappointed in them.)

He stuffed his face and then did not eat and did not poop Tuesday. He had a huge poop and passed urates Wednesday, but did not eat. He had another huge poop Thursday, but did not eat. His poops are well-formed and appear normal. I have been bathing him regularly and giving him water with electrolytes, acidophilus+, and offering salad and bugs (superworms, crickets, a few leftover dubia) and he's ignored it all.

Additionally he seems very lethargic and sleepy. He was cage surfing and headbobbing furiously a few weeks ago, but that's stopped and now he hardly moves. He doesn't seem to want to bask much and instead hangs out in his hammock out of the direct basking light.

I sent off a fecal sample Monday for testing, I also texted and emailed the breeder asking for info a few days before that because he seemed off, but I haven't heard back.

The pertinent information: male, 17", 380 grams, almost 8 months old, staple diet of turnip and mustard greens, butternut squash, offered fruit and bearded dragon bites as treats, staple of dubia except for the big meal of crickets Monday. Feeders are dusted every feeding with Repashy Calcium Plus which is calcium and multivitamins in one meant to be fed every feeding. He's in a 40 gallon tank with tile, 24" Reptisun 10.0 tube UVB changed last month, heat bulb is a 50 watt Zoomed basking bulb, temps are 105 basking spot, mid to high 70s on the warm spot, temps tested with a digital probe thermometer and a temp gun, he has a CHE turned on at night to keep him warm. He gets regular baths and water with electrolytes dripped on his nose. He is still drinking that way.

He's been slowing down on his eating and suddenly stopped eating greens altogether in the last month or so, but he's never stopped eating entirely before, and I don't know what to make of it. I'm hoping he's just eaten too much to process at one time and is trying to empty his belly before eating more, but it also sounds a lot like brumation and he's just not old enough for that. :cry:

I will report back if he eats or poops today or if I hear back about the test results or from the breeder.
 

TipsyTraveler

Hatchling Member
Brumation?

also, USPS is terrible. go with UPS for shipping whenever you have the option. its worth the extra few dollars. you should also think about breeding the dubias.

my only thought could be impaction or brumation, but since hes pooping, thats ruling out impaction.
Wait for your fecal results, and maybe someone that is more experienced than me. sorry, this is all i could think of.
 

Ophiophilist

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
I had always heard that under a year is too young to brumate, or at least to brumate safely?

Thank you and I agree with you on the USPS vs. UPS, but the problem is the roaches have not been shipped at all although they were paid for Monday morning. This company has been very prompt before and I don't know what's going on, and they have not responded to my customer service request. I'm going to email them again. It's unusual and I hope it's just a fluke.

Thank you very much, I appreciate the input. I almost hope it is parasites at this point, because it's something I know how to fix, and not this vague weird behavior.
 

KristineM

Gray-bearded Member
I have the exact SAME thing going on with my 8 month old male. I did just as you have and sent out a fecal. He was clear of parasites and it sounds to me that you are experiencing the same thing we are here.

Yes, too young to fully brumate BUT this is also called a "winter slow down" and the best thing you can do is keep him well hydrated as you are and make sure his humidity levels aren't dropping too low with the change in season.

Sounds perfectly fine to me. As long as he is pooping and urates are present...it's fine. Well, assuming the fecal comes back clear.

Batman will eat 1 dubia in a day and not eat anything the next, 2-6 on a FANTASTIC day and nothing for 2-3 days BUT he is getting his daily soaks, oral fluids, and we are adding humidity to his tank as they get very low. His lights go on at 6:20am (this is our only option) and some days he is OUT by 4pm. As long as he has been soaked, offered oral fluids, and is doing his business normally...it's perfectly fine.

Please keep us updated if anything changes and let us know how the fecal turns out. It IS also ok to syringe feed/supplement with baby food or carnivor care every so often if he quits eating all together and is not having normal bowel movements. If it gets to that point, just let any of us know and we can walk you through that too.

Sounds like you're doing just WONDERFUL.
 

Drache613

BD.org Sicko
Staff member
Moderator
Hello,

That is quite a few larger crickets in one sitting, actually. It will take several days for all of that to process.
Is this a normal number that is eaten?
You can try increasing his basking temperatures slightly to be sure he digests adequately.

At 8 months, they can technically brumate as long as they are healthy, maintaining weight, etc. We had one brumate at 6 months but weighed 500 grams & he brumated for several months & was fine.
It is different for each dragon so you can use your judgement as to his condition.

Do you have any pictures of him?

Tracie
 

Ophiophilist

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
Kristine - I just heard back from the breeder and she thinks it's exactly what you describe and also offered the same advice, so you are spot on. Thank you!

Tracie - I was surprised too when he ate that many, but having always fed dubia I guess I didn't really know what was a normal amount for crickets. The good news is he pooped again today so he is definitely working through them. Maybe this will resolve itself in time.


Yes, tons of photos! These are from last week.

tumblr_mwfk2qfzxP1qz56kjo2_1280.jpg


tumblr_mwfk2qfzxP1qz56kjo3_1280.jpg


tumblr_mwfk2qfzxP1qz56kjo4_1280.jpg


Thank you both! I will post again with the results from the fecal test when I get them.
 

KristineM

Gray-bearded Member
He sure is gorgeous! Also, he actually seems like he'd certainly be "ok" to truly brumate (fully). My guy isn't there yet. Like Tracie said they CAN at this age go into full brumation but a lot of them do the partial thing which I've referred to as the "slow down" so either way...once all is checked out and cleared you can feel comfortable in whatever his body feels is necessary :)

Good work with him...really he's beautiful! It's obvious he's very well taken care of :)
 

Drache613

BD.org Sicko
Staff member
Moderator
Hello,

He is a beautiful handsome man! LOL Very orange, indeed.
It is ok if he slows down some. I doubt though he will brumate all that long, but as long as he is healthy he will finish growing & fill out well into his 2nd year.
Does he bask at all or mostly avoid his light right now?


Tracie
 

Ophiophilist

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
First the good news - he ate tonight! About 20 crickets. So it took three poops in a row with no food intake to get that big batch of crickets out of his belly. I will not be letting him eat that many at one time again. I have a suspicion now that I brought this on myself (and him) by letting him eat whatever he wanted, and he may not be as deep in the "slow down" as I thought.

@TomN @kcarello @KristineM: Thank you! He's my first beardie and I waited years for him. I've tried to do everything right as best I can for him, to the point of being a bit paranoid. I would love him even if he looked like dull as dishwater because I raised him from a teeny baby, but I admit I'm so proud of his handsome self, LOL! I tell everybody to go to Cheryl at Rio Reptiles, who bred him. She knows her stuff and all her babies are gorgeous.

Kristine, thanks again. I'm going to relax now, haha, and let him do his thing and just keep on with the care.

@Tracie - Thank you so much! I really value your input because I know everybody swears by you as the dragon guru! I am going to calm down now and just let him do his thing, whatever that turns out to be.

He seems to be sluggish in the mornings and takes longer to get under his light, then will be off and on basking all day, usually he was under his light about 90% of the time before. And then he wants to get out from under it in late afternoon early evening. He did bask after he ate this evening though.

That is good to know, he is from a line of very big dragons and I was hoping he'd at least make 20" (though of course as long as he's healthy, I would love him if he was a runt, too, LOL). I didn't realize he'd be growing up through two years though, duh on me! I will hang tight and see what spring brings.

I'll post again when I get the fecal test results but I think we have this settled now. Thanks again to everybody and I promise I'll try not to freak out the next time he hiccups. :lol:


Also I went to a reptile show today and got him some bling. He was not sure what to think about playing dress-up, haha.

tumblr_mwqw8lmxY61qz56kjo1_1280.jpg
 

Ophiophilist

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
Just wanted to report back - Iroh has some roundworms so I'll be doing a round of panacur. Otherwise he is good. He's eating about every other day now, small amounts of bugs, but at least he's eating something!
 

KristineM

Gray-bearded Member
Awww...poor guy! So glad you found out, though! Remember the Panacur can really throw them for a loop :( When my boy had pinworms, he was up and down throughout the Panacur treatments.

Good job figuring it out!!! Hope he is back to himself VERY soon!!!
 
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