Sick beardie - not sure what the problem is

[Drache613]

Hello Gabrielle,

How are things going?
The yellowish tint, could that be from the gel & the cream? Does it wash off? Those creams can discolor the skin/scales.
It looks like it is improving between using both agents though. You are also covering it at night, too? I really think that will help out.
Is she doing well otherwise? Does she eat a lot too & is she still gaining weight?
I am glad to hear that she did shed without any trouble!
You are doing a great job, keep it up.
How is Nammer doing? I hope he is hanging in there & eating well, too.

Just to confirm, the areas on her were not yellow fungus, right, in that area? I really think it is a burn. Yellow fungus normally just doesn't look like that. I wish though that you knew whether or not there was a heater or heat rock in the tank where she was prior to you getting her, just to be 100% confirmed.

Keep us posted on them both.

Tracie

 

[Gab122]

Hi Tracie,

I'm going to answer your questions w/in your message below:

The yellowish tint, could that be from the gel & the cream?
no I don't think so - gel is clear and cream is white but I do still occasionally use betadine swab - I bet that might be culprit - but could there be yellow fungus growing on rim of burn?
Does it wash off? Those creams can discolor the skin/scales.
It looks like it is improving between using both agents though. You are also covering it at night, too?
im covering it all the time now. Day and night
I really think that will help out.
Is she doing well otherwise? Does she eat a lot too & is she still gaining weight?
no she's only eating a little lately and sometimes she arches her back like she's trying to pull her chest in and away - like she's in pain
I am glad to hear that she did shed without any trouble!
You are doing a great job, keep it up.
How is Nammer doing? I hope he is hanging in there & eating well, too.
Nammer is doing awesome!

Just to confirm, the areas on her were not yellow fungus, right, in that area?
that area wasn't tested. They tested her back and Nammers arm together and we got final results finally last week that it was yellow fungus. I wish we hadn't tested both together.
I really think it is a burn. Yellow fungus normally just doesn't look like that. I wish though that you knew whether or not there was a heater or heat rock in the tank where she was prior to you getting her, just to be 100% confirmed.
I did go back and ask them and they denied ever having a heat rock.
I don't understand how burn could get soo much worse under my daily careful care. Or could it be that full burn is now coming to the surface? Also... Can you tell me what that area w/o scales is in pic below. Could it be that shed came off too soon? Top right area of chest next to burn and arm. Not in pictures prior to recent shed.



Do you have an opinion about vetericyn ?
Thanks!
Gabrielle

 

[Drache613]

Hello Gabrielle,

Forgive me, I am frustrated with it not healing up more quickly too. It sure was a deep tissue injury I would agree.
It just doesn't look like it has any fungal properties. It has improved some since you have gotten her hasn't it?
I think the betadine is the culprit for the discoloration on those scales.
I am sure that the area is painful for her right now. I think continuing to put the cream on & the vetericyn on daily should help out. Is she still on a pain killer?
The shed may have come off too soon, yes. If it doesn't start to improve quite a bit, I think a skin culture on that area to see if there is a staph type of infection going on that wasn't detected.
For now, keep it covered & continue using the treatments.
I haven't used the vetericyn but from what I have read, it sounds like it has some great properties.

Let us know how she is doing.

Tracie

 

[Gab122]

Hi Tracie,
No, I don't think it looks improved since we got her 3 months ago. I think it looks like it continues to get worse. Could it be a chemical burn instead of thermal? It started smaller and now covers most of her chest.
I don't know if it's the sort of thing that reveals itself more each shed before it gets better or if it's actually in fact getting worse.

Just as a refresher here are a time line of pics. Took me over an hour to find dates for each pic but def worth it to get timeline. Date listed before each pic.

I can't find any pics of underbelly before 11/18 but daves dragons store in Manchester nh noticed and pointed out the burn to me the first week of Sept. I think Sept 6 or sept 7.

We bought them sept 3rd so I believe burn was already there.

10/18


10/24


Nov 1


Nov 10


Nov 24


Nov 29


Dec 5


Dec 17


Dec 23


Dec 26


I will update today's status pic a little later.

Is there a reptile vet who specializes in burns?

Thank you for all your help!!!
Gabrielle and miss Herman (Hermie/ Hermania)

Edit: here's pic from today 12/28 - top of scab is loose
White cream is silver cream - gently wiped off for pics then reapplied and rebandaged.





2nd update:/ evening.
I just fed and changed bandage on miss Hermie as carn care got on it. The top of the scab looks like it's gonna fall off.

I think I've gotta be doing something wrong. Could the parasites (which we only had tested 2 weeks ago) and yellow fungus cause burn to not heal? She's doing battle on three fronts basically. She's winning the fungus and parasite battles and losing the burn battle. ??

 

[Jenna8359]

Do you thinkk maybe it wasn't a burn and it was caused by the fungus? I know it is a flesh eating fungus. Does it seem to dry up or is it always wet?

 

[Gab122]

Ugg - I hope it's not a flesh eating fungus! We've been treating it as a burn. Or maybe that's why the burn treatment isn't helping. Everyone seems to think it's a burn tho. But she did have yellow fungus on her back so i suppose it's possible. ???


I don't know what to do. Can anyone recommend a reptile specialist vet in NH or Mass. I've been to two in NH w/o improvement.

 

[Jenna8359]

I just got an oral fungal treatment for my rescue with yellow fungus and she seems to be responding well. Do you already have an oral medication to kill fungus? Try Neosporin instead of the burn treatment. I feel like yellow fungus wounds and burns should both be dried out and get as much open air as possible, however her stomach will be aggravated if you don't have a bandage on it. It seems like you need to find a way to let it air out and start to harden. The name of my medication for the yellow fungus is called voriconazole. It was 70 dollars for a 2 month supply and she needs to be on it for 50 days. My reptile vet had to order it from Arizona and it was shipped to me in three days. See if your vet can order you that. The pharmacy that filled my order was road runner pharmacy in phoenix, AZ. I am from Louisiana and it got to me fast. It will start killing the fungus from the inside out.there number is 887-518-4589

 

[Jenna8359]

From what me, my vet, and my vet student friend have been reading, yellow fungus doesn't actually eat the flesh but starts to make it flake and decay and kills good flesh. It can grow on their organs and on their scales. I was told it could start from the outside and work its way inside the body or start from within and work itself out. It is scary but you are doing so great and are doing everything for that little girl that you can. From what I have seen from articles and pictures yellow fungus makes a yellow scab looking thing and falls off to reveal raw skin and meat.

 

[Gab122]

Hi Jenna
Thanks for the info

You sound very knowledgable! Do you have some biology or medical degree or vet training? If not maybe that's your calling!

Have you been a beardie mom long? Me just 3 months do you have experience w/ burns at all? I'm looking for a burn specialist. Does your rescued beardie have fungus that looks like my girls chest? I ask because two vets who saw Miss Hermy in person and others think it's a burn.

I'm open to the possibility that you are correct, I guess the thing to do is to have that chest wound tested itself. Sadly that takes forever to get results.

Thx
Gabrielle

 

[Drache613]

Hello Gabrielle,

I agree, I have really thought it was fungal but it didn't clear up at all with the anti-fungal so trying another approach & neither one have done much. I think the area needs to be cultured. I pm'd you a site that does PCR testing for yellow fungus & has a quick turn around. It is the lab that I use for adeno virus. I am sorry, I had hoped it would be getting better but it's time for a more aggressive approach now. I can email my friend at the lab to get more info if you want?
The yellow fungus definitely does manifest in a lot of different ways & does cause scabbing, etc like a burn would. It can cause thickening of the skin, then scabbing, etc to expose raw skin. I am very surprised that the vets didn't culture the area directly & that does need to be done to be able to target it. Airing the wound out would be helpful but it is too deep not to be covered right now, it would hurt her more. Water or baths should be avoided as you have been doing & the creams, etc should be used too since it has been infected looking. Covering right now is for the best. I don't know if you could uncover it at night without it rubbing but you could try. As long as the creams stay on & penetrate some. If it would dry out without the scabbing coming off so badly. I think it does need some type of cream on at least to help keep the scabbing a bit softer with less scarring.
There are a couple of oral antifungals that help clear these infections up. They get inside of the organs & body & are hard to clear out.
Would your vet prescribe anything without a confirmed diagnosis? At this point, the topicals have not helped so an oral would help much more.

You are doing great.

Tracie

 

[Jenna8359]

Hi Sorry, I just checked my email! I've have been rescuing and rehoming dragons for 7 years and every now and then I find a special needs dragon that I keep. My main man Reeves is the only dragon that I have ever purchased and he is 7 years old. I bought him as a tiny hatchling and he is now around 2 feet long. My other 4 dragons are permanently mine and I currently have one foster who was recently diagnosed with what my reptile vet thought was yellow fungus. I have seen so many illnesses and have been to my reptile vet with these fosters so many times that I am starting to know what the problems are before the diagnosis comes in. This is my first time seeing and working with yellow fungus and I can definitely admit that it is scary. It is extremely contagious not only to bearded dragons but to all of my other reptiles. ( I also have a leachianus gecko named Ghost, a chahoua gecko named Grim, and a Prehensile tail skink named Ebenezer so quarantine and hand washing is extremely important) My passion about reptile happened 7 years ago with my first rescue. I love all lizards but my favorite are my dragons. And yes you were right I used to be a vet tech and now work at a hospital. I am really wanting to go to vet school but it is expensive and I figure I help just as many lizards rescuing and rehoming and just paying someone else to do the diagnosis. SO anyways...Back to the fungus....The oral fungal medicine that I ordered seems to be working nicely. After reading what you and Tracie wrote, I came up with an idea. If I had your dragon, I would personally try this. I'm getting this idea from a running problem I often had. When runners have blisters on the back of their heels and they still want to run without having the blister rub the back of their shoe they take about 3 bandaids and cut a small hole where the bandage part is in all 3 bandaids . Then they place one bandage on top of one another until they have three bandaids worth of thickness. The holes line up and allows the blister to breath while not being touched or rubbed by the back of the shoe. Try this with thick band aids or you can try to make something out of a few pieces of cardboard stacked and glued together and held together by vet wrap or a wrap that will stick to itself and allow you to wrap the dragon loosely to hold it in place. Large Band aids may work better since they are sticky and since you will be cutting a large hole on each you will be able to care for and monitor the wound at all times. This way she cannot rub the wound on anything . You can even try to cut rectangle pieces of cardboard and cut a large hole in the middle of each. Stack the card board stacks about 4 high and glue them to one another. After they dry, it should look like a think block with one giant hole. Your holes must line up, so trace them on one another. Then place the card bored under the dragon to where the wound is over the hole so the cardboard does not rub on any soft infected area. (imagine taking a swimming pool inner tube and placing your stomach in the hole.) This will create a space for the wound to sit without being able to touch the bottom of the floor. Then get some vet wrap or wrap from Walgreens that sticks to itself and wrap the dragon loosely to where the cardboard will not move. This way the dragon's belly has a space that falls beneath the cardboard which will allow her to sleep or sit without her stomach ever touching the bottom of her cage or floor. Ill draw you a picture and send it on here.


Let me know what you and tracie think and we can improve the idea. Jenna

 

[Jenna8359]

 

[Jenna8359]

Oh and I forgot to write the three squiggles inside the circle are supposed to depict the yellow fungus lol. Happy new years!

Add me.on instagram or Facebook if you have any other questions. I also have a website for my rescue and lizard stuff.
Jenna whitlow
Lizardluxuries.com
Instagram jen8359LL

 

[Esther19]

Would it be possible for your vet to post your dragon's history/pictures to an online vet consulting site? We thought my girl had neurological issues for a couple years, but couldn't determine the source of the problem. My doc posted Cissy's history and a video of her moving, and got a response of suspected pinched nerve in the neck, which is exactly what it turned out to be. Many good brains here are working the problem. Perhaps it would not hurt to add a few more.

 

[Jenna8359]

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