Should we be worried about this poop?

[Zucchini]

We got a Baby Bearded dragon in mid February. He is going through his second shed.

He will eat a couple bites of veggies but mostly eats only Dubia Roches.I try to gut load the roaches with veggies.

He started having alot looser poops during this shed. He is moving around some but you can tell he is pretty uncomfortable.

Does this look OK? Is that common durring shed? I just read about gout and now I'm worrying about him getting that.

I have tried bsfl but he won't even try it.

He likes arugula, zucchini, cucumbers, and squash but will have one or 2 bites.

 

[KarrieRee]

We got a Baby Bearded dragon in mid February. He is going through his second shed.

He will eat a couple bites of veggies but mostly eats only Dubia Roches.I try to gut load the roaches with veggies.

He started having alot looser poops during this shed. He is moving around some but you can tell he is pretty uncomfortable.

Does this look OK? Is that common durring shed? I just read about gout and now I'm worrying about him getting that.

I have tried bsfl but he won't even try it.

He likes arugula, zucchini, cucumbers, and squash but will have one or 2 bites.

poop looks good all the veggies your feeding are going to cause the extra water -- please offer greens and rinse before serving-- I am posting a nutrition website ignore the kale the info is outdated and a great staple
Nutrition Content
try some small hornworms on the salad --- they will grow fast so you will need to use them everyday 1-2 and they are a good hydration worm - if you need websites for insects/ worms etc please ask I will post the pet stores are too expensive --

 

[Zucchini]

Thank you! Is Arugula ok? We will keep trying with different greens from your list. I get the roaches from Dubia.com do you have another site that's better?

 

[KarrieRee]

Thank you! Is Arugula ok? We will keep trying with different greens from your list. I get the roaches from Dubia.com do you have another site that's better?

Dubiaroaches.com dont know if that is the same site -- argula is really good for a staple

 

[Zucchini]

Dubiaroaches.com dont know if that is the same site -- argula is really good for a staple

Yup! That's the site I meant. Thank you.

 

[xp29]

poop looks good all the veggies your feeding are going to cause the extra water -- please offer greens and rinse before serving-- I am posting a nutrition website ignore the kale the info is outdated and a great staple
Nutrition Content
try some small hornworms on the salad --- they will grow fast so you will need to use them everyday 1-2 and they are a good hydration worm - if you need websites for insects/ worms etc please ask I will post the pet stores are too expensive --

I finally got smart and bookmarked that site lol.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

That stool doesn't look too bad, just a bit watery. Do you give very much fruit?
I agree, Arugula/rocket is really good & most of them really like the flavor, too.
You can incorporate some squash or sweet potato to firm up the stool a little bit.

Tracie

 

[Zucchini]

Hello,

That stool doesn't look too bad, just a bit watery. Do you give very much fruit?
I agree, Arugula/rocket is really good & most of them really like the flavor, too.
You can incorporate some squash or sweet potato to firm up the stool a little bit.

Tracie

He won't eat any fruit and barely eats any veggies. He will eat maybe one bite a day of something. Dubia Roaches and a couple bites of Arugula is about it everyday. We are trying to offer him veggies before his Roaches now so he gets alittle more. I just found out they can get gout and was worried.

 

[KarrieRee]

He won't eat any fruit and barely eats any veggies. He will eat maybe one bite a day of something. Dubia Roaches and a couple bites of Arugula is about it everyday. We are trying to offer him veggies before his Roaches now so he gets alittle more. I just found out they can get gout and was worried.

If they eat excessive amounts of the roaches it is a good possibility- my two have been on roaches all their lives one is 5 the other turning 4 in July - I have had my first issue w/ the roaches and a parasite - Blaze has it cant remember what it was called but he has a appointment on Wed so I am going to find out then - but its good to offer other staple insects -- my two will not eat crickets so I fed BSFL early on now they dont like them either but they will eat silk worms - so they have just finished off some of them and then I also offer the horn worms and super worms - neither of them like meal worms and wax worms I dont feed - I did try once a while back and they werent fond of them either so -- I have a couple of picky dragons and their protein so I offer the ones they eat mixing it up -- they are now finding babies w/ gout -- I dont know how this is happening so early on -

 

[Axil]

I just read about gout and now I'm worrying about him getting that.

I recently spent a lot of time looking into gout in Bearded Dragons and the risks and causes. Gout is caused by proteins being broken down into uric acid that is for whatever reason not cleared by the kidneys but instead builds up and crystalizes. This is a serious problem as those crystals do not break down, and from what I understand the process is irreversible once these crystals have been deposited.

Dubai Roaches (and perhaps all roaches?) can be doubly problematic because in addition to being higher in protein than most (all?) other feeders they also have the ability to store uric acid inside their bodies that they use for nutrition in times of starvation. It's important that they are fed low proteins diets so they are unable to do this. What "low protein" is, seems to be up for debate. DubaiRoaches.com where i buy my roaches cites a Repashy article that recommends under 15%... but then feeds their roaches 17%.

This article cites a study on german cockroaches (sorry the actual study is behind a paywall) which gives a nice graph indicating that at 5% protein consumption these roaches no longer contain any free floating uric acid. The problem is that these roaches then suffer high mortality, and low growth rates so no supplier is willing to go that low.

I still feed a lot of Dubai, but i try to mix in other feeders as often as i can. I'm also careful about hydration as dehydration makes it more difficult for the kidneys to process out uric acid. Hornworms have a very high moisture content and I like to give Beebz 1-2 a day. This seems to be more than is typically recommended but as he doesn't have any loose stools as a result i believe he is benefitting from the extra water.

It's also important to understand some Dragons can develop gout from a disease or genetic dysfunction of the kidneys that would not result in gout from a healthy Dragon consuming the same diet.

Disclaimer: This is all just my layman level understanding after doing my best to research the topic for my pets' health. Others with more experience in the hobby, or veterinary expertise have more authority on this subject and are encouraged to correct any mistakes made here.

 

[Zucchini]

If they eat excessive amounts of the roaches it is a good possibility- my two have been on roaches all their lives one is 5 the other turning 4 in July - I have had my first issue w/ the roaches and a parasite - Blaze has it cant remember what it was called but he has a appointment on Wed so I am going to find out then - but its good to offer other staple insects -- my two will not eat crickets so I fed BSFL early on now they dont like them either but they will eat silk worms - so they have just finished off some of them and then I also offer the horn worms and super worms - neither of them like meal worms and wax worms I dont feed - I did try once a while back and they werent fond of them either so -- I have a couple of picky dragons and their protein so I offer the ones they eat mixing it up -- they are now finding babies w/ gout -- I dont know how this is happening so early on

I'm glad we are not the only ones dealing with a picky Beardie. They make it hard to keep them healthy. I did order some horn worms for him. So hopefully he likes those. It very odd babies are getting Gout unless they are getting breed with week kidneys.

 

[Zucchini]

I recently spent a lot of time looking into gout in Bearded Dragons and the risks and causes. Gout is caused by proteins being broken down into uric acid that is for whatever reason not cleared by the kidneys but instead builds up and crystalizes. This is a serious problem as those crystals do not break down, and from what I understand the process is irreversible once these crystals have been deposited.

Dubai Roaches (and perhaps all roaches?) can be doubly problematic because in addition to being higher in protein than most (all?) other feeders they also have the ability to store uric acid inside their bodies that they use for nutrition in times of starvation. It's important that they are fed low proteins diets so they are unable to do this. What "low protein" is, seems to be up for debate. DubaiRoaches.com where i buy my roaches cites a Repashy article that recommends under 15%... but then feeds their roaches 17%.

This article cites a study on german cockroaches (sorry the actual study is behind a paywall) which gives a nice graph indicating that at 5% protein consumption these roaches no longer contain any free floating uric acid. The problem is that these roaches then suffer high mortality, and low growth rates so no supplier is willing to go that low.

I still feed a lot of Dubai, but i try to mix in other feeders as often as i can. I'm also careful about hydration as dehydration makes it more difficult for the kidneys to process out uric acid. Hornworms have a very high moisture content and I like to give Beebz 1-2 a day. This seems to be more than is typically recommended but as he doesn't have any loose stools as a result i believe he is benefitting from the extra water.

It's also important to understand some Dragons can develop gout from a disease or genetic dysfunction of the kidneys that would not result in gout from a healthy Dragon consuming the same diet.

Disclaimer: This is all just my layman level understanding after doing my best to research the topic for my pets' health. Others with more experience in the hobby, or veterinary expertise have more authority on this subject and are encouraged to correct any mistakes made here.

I only feed the roaches once we get them veggies. I fiquer if our beardie won't eat veggies he can get them through the roaches. I wonder if that will help. It also seems gout seems to come out after a parasite infection.

 

[Axil]

I only feed the roaches once we get them veggies. I fiquer if our beardie won't eat veggies he can get them through the roaches. I wonder if that will help.

Feeding roaches veggies certainly won't cause them to accumulate additional uric acid. I don't know long they would have to be on a veggie diet to reduce whatever uric acid is already being carried.

Gut loading is always a good idea regardless as whatever salad the roaches don't digest is available for your dragon. It's also important to keep the roaches hydrated as that water is available to your dragon.

It also seems gout seems to come out after a parasite infection.

That's interesting and not something I came across in my research. I imagine parasites lead to dehydration which would contribute. It's also possible that during a vet visit related to parasites gout would be discovered coincidentally.

Also to be clear my post earlier wasn't to indicate your Dragon has gout. Certainly I don't think a watery poo is a reason to be concerned about gout. Swollen limbs are one of the first signs. General crankiness when shedding is not uncommon in healthy dragons.

I also didn't mean to indicate Dubairoaches.com wasn't a good place to get roaches for those concerned about gout. On the contrary the fact that they are aware of the uric acid issue and publish the amount of protein fed to thier feeders is the reason I continue to buy my roaches there.

 

[Zucchini]

Feeding roaches veggies certainly won't cause them to accumulate additional uric acid. I don't know long they would have to be on a veggie diet to reduce whatever uric acid is already being carried.

Gut loading is always a good idea regardless as whatever salad the roaches don't digest is available for your dragon. It's also important to keep the roaches hydrated as that water is available to your dragon.

That's interesting and not something I came across in my research. I imagine parasites lead to dehydration which would contribute. It's also possible that during a vet visit related to parasites gout would be discovered coincidentally.

Also to be clear my post earlier wasn't to indicate your Dragon has gout. Certainly I don't think a watery poo is a reason to be concerned about gout. Swollen limbs are one of the first signs. General crankiness when shedding is not uncommon in healthy dragons.

I also didn't mean to indicate Dubairoaches.com wasn't a good place to get roaches for those concerned about gout. On the contrary the fact that they are aware of the uric acid issue and publish the amount of protein fed to thier feeders is the reason I continue to buy my roaches there.

That's all great. I didn't take anything you said like it was bad. All information is helpful. We got our Beardie as a pet for our 10 year old. She does amazing taking care of him but I didn't realize how much went in to it. I'm constantly worrying if we are doing it all right.

 

[Axil]

That's all great. I didn't take anything you said like it was bad. All information is helpful. We got our Beardie as a pet for our 10 year old. She does amazing taking care of him but I didn't realize how much went in to it. I'm constantly worrying if we are doing it all right.

Welcome to the club!

Our Dragon Beebz was purchased for our 12 yr/o daughter the first week of February so we are pretty much in the same point of our journey.

And you are already a step ahead of where we were. Up until a couple weeks ago poor Beebz was in a 15g enclosure.