Pilot has turned white and is SO weak. I fear he's dying!!

[randisjoy]

I just rescued two bearded dragons. I am so worried one of them is dying! The other one seems to be undernourished but pretty good. She's alert and pretty active and ate very good yesterday. She (Blazer) seems to be slightly malnourished and dehydrated.

The VERY sick dragon (I named him Pilot) was COMPLETELY white yesterday. He was and still is not moving. He's just too weak. I visited a friends home and was so saddened by what a saw. This was several months ago and he was white but not all bones like he is now. The next time I went to visit the family I asked to see him & he was absolutely fine. They said they just fed him a few days in a row (aren't you supposed to feed them EVERYDAY?!! ) This past week I was there again and was so mad at myself for not asking if I could care for them sooner because what I saw was frightening. Seeing my concern, they asked if I wanted the two of them. I think they were happy to not have the responsibility. (they were their children's responsibility who did not do a good job at all. Shame on the parents for letting this happen!! ) My daughter & I went over there yesterday to bring them home. I need to be sure I have gotten good advice in the set up and that I am doing everything I can to save Pilot's fragile life. These other people had them for several years in a set up that didn't supply enough heat. The dragons only had a reptile heating pad (which doesn't seem to put out much heat at all!) and one long fluorescent tube stretched over them both. I've brought both bearded babies back to my home and bought a 40 gallon breeder critter keeper. I put them in together, which I wasn't to sure of. First, I was thinking it was very scary because if one is sick and the other isn't, I don't want to end up with two sick Dragons! Also, because the "healthy" (I say that loosely because she is very skinny but is alert and eating on her own) but she's is a little ball of fire compared to him & I didn't want her to hurt him! I was told they were separated a few yrs ago when they were babies because there was mysterious wound that showed up on the little one and they were worried the bigger one (now the sicker one) did it. All the pet stores I've spoken with encouraged me to put them together. The sicker ones symptoms seem to be from being very dehydrated and malnourished (besides the mysterious white color which NOBODY has a clue) so I'm really thinking/hoping there's nothing to catch. I'm also thinking his color has to do with not enough heat? In the car on the way to my home, my daughter kept him close to her on her arm to warm him up. By the time the 10 minute ride was over, he already had a little bit of his color back. I've invested quite a lot (for me at least!)in hopes of turning this little guy around. I don't think he's had sufficient heat (or food!)so I got a mercury vapor light. Even though it has both types of light, I'm still going to stick the long fluorescent on there during the day. Can't hurt, right? The mercury vapor light is 125 watts (exo terra solar glo). Also, for extra heat, I stuck the two little heating pads under the hot side. I hope that's OK? Last night was the first night they were here. I bought a 75 watt black bulb to keep them heated overnight. I read a good temp for the night can be as low as mid 60's but with them not being 100% and especially Pilot (whom I scared is very close to dying I wanted to take no chances. Do I have the right idea or even though he's so sick, would he fair better in the lower night temp? I also keep my home very airconditioned. The temp during the day has been 85-88 or so. Is that high enough? Last night it was about 70 with the 75 watt black bulb. I guess that will be OK for when they're healthy? I was uncomfortable with it because of their health though so today I went out and bought a 100 watt ceramic heat bulb for the night hours. (I guess from what I've read on here, the stick on therm that I'm using (one on each side stuck down 3/4 of the way closer to the bottom) is unreliable? What kind is it that I need and where should I look for it?

I put the new ceramic heat bulb on tonight. I had just fed Pilot the emergency Flucker's (which I really hope I am doing right!!? I described how I'm doing it a paragraph down. Sorry I'm all over the place here!) so, because I fed him right before turning out the lights, I put the black bulb on too (the box said it helps with digestion) Well, I just went over there and noticed Pilot managed to move away (a very little bit) from the black bulb (I had it right over him), so it must of been too much and I unplugged it. The temp read about 84 degrees so I'll see what it goes down to --{update-hours later it's barely 80 degrees}--All I know is this morning and through the night(I woke up several times in the night to check him. I really was so worried I couldn't sleep) he looked all white again and I was really scared I was going to wake up to find him gone. This whole thing is so stressfull. I want him to pull through!

I cant find his symptoms of the white on the internet at all. I'm not even sure if it's that important anymore and that maybe he just needs nourishment and heat?? He has gotten a lot of his gray/brown back except his head is still pretty white (I can give these updates because I've been at this forum for HOURS straight! . Does anybody have any ideas of what I can do to "bring this little guy back to health? I'm so scared for him.

Yesterday, when I got him home & saw he had NO strength to even try & eat, I went to the pet store and got Flucker's Repta Aid-an emergency aid to feed him with a syringe. Is anyone familiar with this? Directions say only feed them 50% of RDA for the 1st-4th days. I was told he is about 3 years old which makes him an adult? Directions said to give 6cc of warm water with 12 teaspoons of the Aid. So, for 1/2 amount I still gave him the full water but only 6tsps of the product. Even with just the 6 tsp instead of 12, it was SO SO thick that I ended up adding more water. He seemed to be a bit better but ONLY immediately (for a min or two)after feedings yesterday. Today, hmm, I guess. His color is much better today though. I did try to make it thicker and follow the directions to a 'T', but after I finished half the syringe tonight, my gut told me to go add a bit more warm water, so I did. Is it supposed to be so thick or am I reading the directions wrong?
He has opened his eyes today. A VERY little bit and it takes great effort. Yesterday he opened them for a split second right after I fed him and put him back in his home. He is really, really weak. It's hard to feed him while looking at his very sick face. His eyes almost look black and blue and they are "sunken in" too. He's just so sweet and fragile I hope I'm doing everything I can for this little guy!! Any suggestions would be SO appreciated.

Thanks SOO much,
Randi

 

[jarett_harrison]

good job on takeing them in.
First off, you do need to separate them. The weak one sounds to be so weak that if the other one went at him he couldnt do anything.
The night time temp should be around 65 to 70. do not keep it to work. iv noticed that if my beardies are too hot they will not sleep.
The Flunkers stuff works pretty well. Get some pedialyte and syringe feed it. (Drip it on his nose) it will help him stay hydrated. you can also give them a 15-39 min bath. separated of course in baby warm water.
Get rid of the heat pads. They commonly overheat which a weak dragon could burn severly.
How are you mesuring the temps? If it is a stick on, its not reading right. Go to wal-mart and buy a digital with a probe therm. It will read the temps right. and what "black bulb" are you talking about? If you have a black light on him at night turn it off. It keeps them awake also. Another feeding method you could try is to buy some crickets and mash them down to nothing. (it will take quite a few) and add water or pedialyte and now you have cricket soup. Im pretty sure from the care you described by the previous owner they didnt use vitamin supplements. You need to get calcium with out vit. D3 and the vitamins they sell also. The best brand in my opinion is herptivite. and he will do better with a lower night temp.(but not too cold between 65-70)
When you get a good therm. leave the brobe on the basking spot for atleast thirty mins then check the temp. It should be around 110. That is a little high but the extra heat will do good. The cool side of the tank should be between 75-85. What substrate are you useing? If its any particle substrate i suggest taking it out. put down paper towels or even some towels you mind getting poo on. lol i hope this guy pulls through for you! You are doing the best you can! =]

-Jarett

 

[randisjoy]

Thanks for your reply I feel like you are sent from heaven right now!!!!!

Even though he's so sick from being cold and underfed you still think the temps should be around 70?

Thank you for the pedialyte suggestion. I am going to get that while I am out getting the second set up.
One of the petstores (so I KNOW I need to double check) said I could use baby food in the syringe. I know that crickets/worms would be the best mashed up but there's noay I can get mayself to mash them I really hate to say that too but I know I can feed them to them but not mash them

They mentioned a protein babyfood like chicken. ould I be better off just buying him some dark meat chicken for the fat AND protein and zapping it in the microwave, mashing it up and adding some pedialyte to that? If I do use one of these other "syringe" foods, should I keep doing the Fluker's Emergency Aide?

The temp of the bath water?? How do I measure? If it feels not warm and not cold on my skin, then it's about 98 degrees or so?

I'm using two supplements. The first one I have only been able to give to the little one that's eating. It's Dragon Dust plus calcium by Repashy Superfoods. The second supp is Fluker's Liquid Vitamins- Electrolyte spray formula. it says to put it on their food but the store said I can spray them with it too. I wonder if I should spray the Emergency Fluker's Aid???

The black bulb is 75 watts and is made by Repta-Sun. It says it can be used to provide low levels of supplemental UV radiation.

 

[jarett_harrison]

im not sure i agree with the black light. You need to get a real uvb light. sorry for takeing a while to reply. Well if you cant mash the bugs then yes baby food works very well. get a high protien food. I would give about three ml's every four to five hours. and around 70 for the night temp. During the day it needs to be extra hot. basking of 110-115 and an ambiant temp of 90-95. cooler side with a temp of 80-85. The extra heat will help. try to feed him three times a day. hope this helps!