Phoenix Worm trouble/stunted growth?

[Elora]

Is it possible that Skyler will always have an appetite problem? Back in August I bought 2 very tiny bearded dragons and I housed them together. At the time I thought it would be okay but it soon became very clear to me that it was not. After a month Stompy grew to be almost twice the size of Skyler. Skyler stopped eating so I separated them. It took a whole week of me force feeding baby food before he would start eating crickets again. About a month ago I started getting Phoenix worms for the two of them. Stompy LOVES them but Skyler has always been a bit weirded out by them. Skyler and Stompy are fed apples and kale/mustard greens every day and sometimes broccoli, dandelion greens and celery leaves. Stompy eats ALOT and always seems hungery for more a few hours after I feed him. Skyler usually only eats half of the phoenix worms that stompy does and sometimes he just spits them out and walks away. I ran out of Phoenix worms once and had to get crickets for a few days and Skyler ate a ton of them.

I really dont want to get crickets because the pet store that is near me always runs out of them. They never hae crickets Sunday-Wednesday and the last time I went there looking for crickets the girl working there just said "well looks like you will just have to wait" and said it with a slight attitude. I dont want to support that pet store nor do I want to depend on them. Does anyone think that if I orderd butterworms or something else that he would like them better? I just got a larger tank for Skyler since his first move out of the tank with Stompy was an emergency and I only had a 20gallon. Now he is in a much bigger tank! The problem I am having now is that he only will eat apples..and a freeze dried cricket. This is the second day he wouldnt eat the worms but loved eating apples. IM SO CONFUSED.

oh and Skyler is still thin and smaller than Stompy. Im having a very hard time getting meat on his bones even 3 months later! :x

edit: also another reason im mad at the pet store is becase ther crickets are always different sizes but are the same price. Some times they are large and I cant even buy them becuase theya re too big for my beardies and sometimes they are TINY almost pin head crickets but are 10cents a peice. :evil:

 

[Elora]

Edit: I forgot to ask what is a good way to get a skinny beardie to fatten up? the most obvious answer to me is to feed them more but Skyler will only eat a small amount a few times a day. Is there a feeder that I can get online that helps to build up their fat?

 

[Trogdor_1]

To try and figure out what is wrong with your little one, a little more info is needed. What kind of lights are you using (UVB and basking)? Also, what are your temps and what do you use to measure them? Do you use calcium? If so, what kind and how often?

To answer some of the basics: yes, you can order feeders online. And yes, there are MANY other things to feed beardies other than crickets. However, some of these feeders are more expensive. Try looking into butterworms and silk worms. You could also feed hornworms, but they grow very quickly so you would need to feed them to your dragons before they grew. You should also consider ordering your crickets online. They will show up once a week (or whenever your reorder) and you never have to go to the petstore again.

Check out mulberryfarms.com and luckylurecricketfarm.com to look at prices and types of worms/crickets.

 

[peera]

I've seen you around a lot, so I know you've seen this site recommended, but I think it would help to look at it again- http://www.beautifuldragons.503xtreme.com/Nutrition.html Apples and kale are not everyday food. Apples could be one of the things keeping him from putting on weight because they're a mild laxitive and stealing his nutrition by making him poop before his body can fully process the food. If he likes the crickets, at least until you get him nice & plump, ordering offline could definitly be the way to go. I order mine from http://www.lllreptile.com because my local pet store kind of sucks for crickets too. They always have them, but they're never small enough. Online they're generally cheaper and most of them are going to be the proper size. win/win. You can try other feeders to, as the poster above suggested, but since you know he likes the crickets maybe you should at least get a small order so he'll have something to eat.

 

[Elora]

I suppose ill look into ordering the crickets online. I just find feeding crickets to be a bigger hassle than the nice contained phoenix worms :wink: I just wish I knew why he dosnt like them! I think what I have been feeding them is mustard greens and not kale. i suspect they where mislabled at the store because they where under the mustard greens spot but the label said "kale" but they rang up as mustard greens? or are they the same thing? If not mustard greens as a staple what do you suggest?

Skyler is in a 50g with a basking temp of 104 (probe thermometer). I use a ceramic heat emiter (gets too cold at night) and a 40wat bright white bulb. also I have Reptisun5.0. I have positioned it so that he can get close enough to it. I use shelf liner as a substrate. He also gets baths every other day. I think that his temps could be a bit warmer so I bought a small heater for my room to take the chill of during the winter so I i hope that helps. I dont use calcium that often becuase of the pheonix worms but I use multivitamins. I use calcium if im feeding crix.

 

[Elora]

oh wow great price on those crickets! im going to get some as soon as i figure out what size x_X

 

[peera]

Agreed, crickets are a way bigger hassle than worms, I hate them too, but for little ones it's sooo much cheaper with the amounts they can eat, and if you have a picky eater, what can you do? :dontknow: You can try him out on other types of worms too, just have the crickets on hand to guarentee you'll have something he'll eat. For figuring out the size, how big is the space between his eyes? You'll probably want the next size down from what he can eat according to that, babies tend to like the smaller ones. I think they're less threatening, maybe?

Kale and mustard greens are not the same thing (unfortunatly, they do look very similar, kale is generally a bit darker and the leaves are a bit thicker), mustard greens are a lovely daily staple, although collard greens will stay fresh for you much longer (I've had some in the fridge going on 3 weeks now and they're only now starting to look droopy). Other favorites in my house are squash (any kind) and cactus leaves.

 

[Elora]

ohh good ill try out the collard greens. my beardies are so young yet that they just kinda pick on the mustard greens. Well actually Stompy eats most of what I give him but its defiantly not enough to eat a whole bundle of it before it goes wilty!

 

[peera]

I don't know what your scheduale's like, so I don't know if it'll work for you, but what I do is make sure they have the salads first thing in the morning as soon after the lights come on as I can, and don't offer live feeders until noon or later. Since they're generally pretty hungry when they wake up, those greens start to look awful tempting when the live food isn't forthcoming, lol.

 

[KairaandTaz08]

I don't know what your scheduale's like, so I don't know if it'll work for you, but what I do is make sure they have the salads first thing in the morning as soon after the lights come on as I can, and don't offer live feeders until noon or later. Since they're generally pretty hungry when they wake up, those greens start to look awful tempting when the live food isn't forthcoming, lol.

LOL, Kaira has been soooo lazy lately...she won't get off her hammock(s) until she gets her first meal of wormies lol. I agree though, "salad" first, then worms/crickets. Kaira is going through a weird phase right now and doesn't want crickets, just PWs...she's about 7 months old, so that's not the best diet for her. I figured out a few ways to get her to eat crickets though, every beardie is different. Taz will eat anything and everything he's given, but he's 5 months old and just went through several huge growth spurts. I bought butterworms and hornworms and then figured out ways to get Kaira to eat crickets, so the hornworms got too large lol...now I'm out of correctly sized crickets, so I having to increase their PWs & some other stuff. Anyways, that's just me rambling lol. Personally, I find mustard greens are the "easiest", longest lasting greens. The stores here hardly ever have good looking collards or turnip greens, but those are great staples (as peera mentioned). As for squash, I find they LOVE butternut squash. The only problem I have with squash is preparation time (grating it and everything :? )lol...but I'd definitely try butternut first. We just stick to the basics, really, but we have put a bit of Mint and Rosemary in with their other greens a few times. Taz loved the herbs...Kaira not so much. I wouldn't personally recommend herbs on a daily basis, but a little extra "smell" might help. I really think you'll have good luck with butternut squash though. It's sweet, but still good for them, and may help "replace" the apples.
You'll get it all figured out though. I'm glad you separated them before it ended tragically. How long ago did you move him into the larger cage, though? Is it possible he's still going through a little relocation stress? (sorry if I missed that info)
Abi

 

[Trogdor_1]

Another quick tip for getting babies to eat veggies - buy nautral, sugar free apple or fruit juice and dilute it in a squirt bottle with some water. Mist your dragon's salad with it before putting it in the cage. Not only does the misting help the veggies last longer in the cage, but the dragons will pick up on the sweet smell from the juice. That should definately help encourage them to eat more greens.

 

[protiemama]

Bogie absolutly loves cilantro. If I put it under the rest of his salad he will gobble up the other greens to get to the cilantro. It smells great. If you trim the stems a bit and stick the bunch in a cup of water in the fridge, they last forever.
As for ordering feeders online, if you are in the south east, Ghann's is a great supplier. Local shipping is only $7 and they give a great overcount.

Sandy H

 

[Elora]

thanks everyone for the advice. I live in NY.

I bought squash and dandelion today. I had the chance of going to a Wegmans because my boyfriends mom was going to a store near there so i went along. Earlier today I went to the local Quality which is the worst grocery store i have ever been to. I hate hate hate going in there becuase its a mess and they dont have anything more than romaine lettuce. today I did see a sign for escarole and endive but the area under the sign was a huge gross mess of half dead green blobs. :evil: :evil: :x

So when i brought all this home Skyler ate a few bites of the squash and 3 phoenix worms. only three ahhhh of course Stompy ate piles and piles of squash, greens and Phoenix worms.

 

[Elora]

Argg Skyler's hunger strike continues wouldnt eat anthing more than 2 phoenix worms. Anyone have any ideas?

 

[sammyjackson]

I had the same problem with my Sammy. I was giving her crickets but out of nowhere she stoped, I bought phoenix worms and nothing happened so I thought it was the lighting or the temps in her tank but everything looked fine. So I decided to try roaches and ordered the starting kit and an extra order of medium sizes from the roachguy and guess what??? as soon as she saw the roaches fall in the tank she jumped from her basking spot and made them disappear. Maybe you can try that and see what happens....