New to this - help!

[emmini]

Hi! I'm new to the site, and new to the wonderful world of beardies! Just got 2 babies, about 3 months old apparently, one 15cm long and one 17cm. We are very confused about the amount of conflicting advice from the reptile centre they came from, and on forums etc so don't really know if what we are doing is right! They are both housed together in a 4.5ft(w) x 20"(d)x 16"(h) They were on wood chips until I read they were dangerous and have now put paper towel in. The trouble is, our 2nd hand viv already had rocks cemented to the bottom, so have had to work round these, taping strips together with masking tape - is this ok? They have a 100w basking bulb on a dimmer, a Repti-glo 8.0 UV light (brand new), and the temp is about 88C on the warm side and 78 on the cooler. They seem very happy together, basking side by side etc, but one is eating about 5 dusted crickets at a time (twice a day) plus small amount of mustard cress (doesn't like any other veg) and the other one is not interested in crickets at all! She(?) again, will eat cress but no other fruit or veg, so appears to be vegetarian! We have tried taking the other one out and putting the crickets right in front of her, but she just watches them! The pet shop have advised mini mealworms, but I have read they are not good! She doesn't seem stressed at all, she is happy to be held (once we've managed to catch her) and the other one doesn't appear to bother her at all. Its just that I don't want her starving! I have read that we need to get them fecal tested so they are going next week, but has anyone got any ideas in the meantime? Sorry to prattle on, just want to get it right!
p.s. I wanted to add a photo - can someone tell me how?![/img]

 

[Catalyst]

Hi! I'm new to the site, and new to the wonderful world of beardies! Just got 2 babies, about 3 months old apparently, one 15cm long and one 17cm. We are very confused about the amount of conflicting advice from the reptile centre they came from, and on forums etc so don't really know if what we are doing is right!

This is fairly common - there's a lot of information out there (right and wrong) and good on you for coming here to find the answers you need instead of just taking the store's word for it. Welcome to the site

They are both housed together in a 4.5ft(w) x 20"(d)x 16"(h) They were on wood chips until I read they were dangerous and have now put paper towel in. The trouble is, our 2nd hand viv already had rocks cemented to the bottom, so have had to work round these, taping strips together with masking tape - is this ok?

Good idea pulling out the wood chips - any loose substrates are a bad idea for young dragons. Solid is the best way to go. When you're talking about rock being glued to the bottom, are they large rocks or like a layer of gravel? To post a picture you get yourself an account on photobucket.com and upload your pictures onto there. Then when you're posting the picture here, hit the "Img" button, type in the link to the picture (it'll show up under the picture when you look at it on photobucket), and then hit the "/Img" button again. If you are able to post a pic of the rocks you're talking about we'll be able to better help you find a substrate that will work best for you.

They have a 100w basking bulb on a dimmer, a Repti-glo 8.0 UV light (brand new), and the temp is about 88C on the warm side and 78 on the cooler.

They need a basking spot in the 100-110*F range in order for them to digest their food properly. Your cool side is about right around 80*. What are you using to measure the temperatures? We suggest using a digital thermometer with a probe since they are quite accurate (as opposed to those stick on the glass strips that can be off by as much as twenty degrees.

They seem very happy together, basking side by side etc, but one is eating about 5 dusted crickets at a time (twice a day) plus small amount of mustard cress (doesn't like any other veg) and the other one is not interested in crickets at all! She(?) again, will eat cress but no other fruit or veg, so appears to be vegetarian! We have tried taking the other one out and putting the crickets right in front of her, but she just watches them! The pet shop have advised mini mealworms, but I have read they are not good! She doesn't seem stressed at all, she is happy to be held (once we've managed to catch her) and the other one doesn't appear to bother her at all. Its just that I don't want her starving! I have read that we need to get them fecal tested so they are going next week, but has anyone got any ideas in the meantime? Sorry to prattle on, just want to get it right!

There are a couple of possible reasons behind the one dragon not eating. First of all, most dragons go through an adjustment period when they change homes. This is normal and it can take upwards of a week before they settle in and begin behaving and eating normally.

The second possible factor involves interactions between the two dragons. If the larger dragon is dominant, then the smaller one may be experiencing a greater level of stress and this can affect her behaviour and appetite. Do you know the genders of the dragons yet? Unless they are both females you'll need to be prepared to separate them by the time they are six months old. If they are both females they may be just fine together, but it's not a guaranteed thing so you'll have to keep a close eye on them for any adverse effects on the non-dominant dragon (i.e. if she keeps not eating, if she stays small or doesn't grow as quickly as the other one, if she tends to be darker and hide more, etc.)

Good on not going with the mealworms, they're a bad idea. For young dragons you want to stick to crickets and roaches (both no longer than the space between your dragon's eyes), silkworms, pheonix worms, butter worms and smaller horn worms. Those worms can all be larger than the space between the eyes because they have no shell and so don't pose any impaction risk.

Hope this helps Feel free to ask any questions you have, we're always happy to talk dragons!

 

[emmini]

Hi Catalyst, thanks for getting back to me so quickly! I will attempt in a minute to get some pics from photobucket - the picture of the viv was taken when we first set it up - obviously the wood chips have gone now, but you can see all the grey rocks that have been cemented in. We have also moved things around and put in another branch so they can get closer to the UV. Another thing - the pet shop sold us at great expense a hot rock to use at night when everything goes off, but I've since read they shouldn't be used. Is it ok to use it just at night for heating purposes? With regard to temperature, we have one of those habistat thingys with a probe - you can see it about a 3rd in on the back wall. In theory this is supposed to brighten/dim the bulb? There are also 2 sticky thermometers on each end - at the moment the hotter one is reading the same as the temp we set the habistat to. And what is the correct temp for the hot end? I'm beginning to not trust anything the shop has told me now lol! Also, how do you find the temp of the basking area? Sorry to ask so many questions, but I'd hate to think they were in any kind of distress because of something we are doing/not doing! Your help is much appreciated! We also have 2 corn snakes, but they are so easy in comparison! Going to try the pics now - hope it works![

[/img]

 

[emmini]

Well obviously it didn't work lol!

 

[emmini]

Gonna try again - hope this works, even if not very well - I'm obviously being really dim! All the palm trees are cemented in as well as the 3 big grey rocks, so you can see the prob with paper towels!

 

[Catalyst]

Hi Catalyst, thanks for getting back to me so quickly! I will attempt in a minute to get some pics from photobucket - the picture of the viv was taken when we first set it up - obviously the wood chips have gone now, but you can see all the grey rocks that have been cemented in. We have also moved things around and put in another branch so they can get closer to the UV.

Ah, okay, now I see what you were talking about with those rocks. I can see how it's a bit of a pain to get paper towels wrapped around those. Fortunately it doesn't matter too much if every inch of the bottom is covered - you could actually just leave it with a bare bottom as far as the dragons are concerned but the paper towels greatly facilitate cleaning. Basically unless it really matters to you, you don't need to be too picky/worried about laying down the paper towels in an exact fit.

Another thing - the pet shop sold us at great expense a hot rock to use at night when everything goes off, but I've since read they shouldn't be used. Is it ok to use it just at night for heating purposes?

From everything I've heard/read, heat rocks are just plain dangerous. Dragons sense their overall body temperatures, not specific hotspots, so they can easy have their undersides burned by those rocks. I'd take it back to the store if you can. If not then you can keep using as a decoration, but don't plug it in. At night your dragons don't need a heat source unless your tank temps drop below the low sixties, and if it does get that cold you're much better off using a ceramic heat emitter - it screws into your heat bulb socket and gives off heat without any light, plus since it's above your dragons' heads, it poses no risk of burning. If your temps are above the low sixties, then your dragons will be just fine at night - the nocturnal cooldown is actually healthy and natural for them.

With regard to temperature, we have one of those habistat thingys with a probe - you can see it about a 3rd in on the back wall. In theory this is supposed to brighten/dim the bulb? There are also 2 sticky thermometers on each end - at the moment the hotter one is reading the same as the temp we set the habistat to. And what is the correct temp for the hot end? I'm beginning to not trust anything the shop has told me now lol! Also, how do you find the temp of the basking area?

I dont' use a thermostat, although I know others who do, so I'm afraid I'm not familiar with how they work or what they're good for. The sticky thermometers aren't reliable since some have been known to be off by a fair amount. They're good for giving you a general idea of the tank temperatures but you'll want something else to give you the exact temperature in specific areas of the tank. For this your best bet is either a temperature gun, or a digital thermometer with a probe - like this one: http://lllreptile.com/store/catalog...ats/-/zoo-med-digital-thermometer-with-probe/. You can find similar thermometers at places like Walmart and many petstores for less than $10. To get the temp in the basking spot, you put the probe on the basking spot and leave it there for 30 min - 1 hr to get the final reading.

As far as temperatures, the basking spot should be in the 100-110*F range and then the cool end of the tank should be around 80*.

Sorry to ask so many questions, but I'd hate to think they were in any kind of distress because of something we are doing/not doing! Your help is much appreciated!

No worries We're always glad to help. Feel free to keep asking any questions you have and we'll answer them the best we can.

 

[emmini]

Thanks Catalyst! We are now in the process of trying to find another viv quickly so we can separate them. Perhaps then the little one will start eating! Will do as you suggest and just unplug the hot rock, at least its a nice surface for them to bask on! Your help and advice is much appreciated - it's all been a bit hit and miss! Take care xx :wave:

 

[Catalyst]

No worries, I'm just glad I can help If you guys have no luck finding a second viv, you could build one - I know of two online sites with full plans for building a basic 4'x2'x2' dragon enclosure. Good luck!

 

[emmini]

Hi! I'm frantically searching the net right now, but that size is SO expensive, and we really didn't envisage having to start all over again so soon - the first lot has cost about £400 in total! As for making one, we are a family of absolutely hopeless DIY'ers - wouldn't have a clue, even with step by step instructions but it may be worth a look anway, thanks!

 

[Catalyst]

Here are the sites if you want to take a look:

http://www.freewebs.com/crossfireenclosures/

http://www.timelessspirit.com/enclosure.html

There are also lots of members on this site who have built their own enclosures so I'm sure they'd be more than happy to help you out - just post over in the enclosures forum for more information on what they did. I haven't tried it myself yet but it seems pretty easy to do - just a wooden box with glass or plexiglass doors on the front ... then again, most of my diy projects look easy until I start the cutting and nailing, haha :roll: