New dragon, got a few questions....lots of pictures

[BadCon]

Hi all,
I got a new beardie a couple of days ago, and I estimate he is around 6 weeks old, however he was not in the greatest conditions at the pet store, so he could have been stunted. This site was a huge help is picking out the proper equipment, for that, I thank you all. However, I still have a few questions and concerns. But before I get started, let me describe my setup.

Enclosure = 20 gallon
Light/heat =Rep-Pro 100 watt mercury vapor bulb
Substrate = paper towels
Suppliments = T-Rex 2:0 calcluim/no phosphorus, Rep-Pro Vita Max multi vitamin
Food=Mixed veggies, Can 0 Crickets, Wax worms, Meal worms, (I just ordered some pheniox worms and some silk worms), and two types of dry food, Jurassi pet Jurassi diet bearded dragon food and Zilla fortified bearded dragon food.
Additionally, I also got some lizard misting spray because he is shedding...I also have given him a couple of baths.

Here are some pictures of my dragons home, and the products I purchased.
Cage

Products

I have noticed he does not have much of an appetite. This is most likely due to all the moving around he has done, but even still...almost a week later he is not that interested in eating. He won’t take crickets at all. I have had moderate success with worms...first meal worms, but due to impaction concerns I have moved onto wax worms....and as soon as they come in, phoenix worms and silk worms will be his primary staple. He will occasionally eat some of the premade dragon foods...I bought a couple as backups, and to augment his diet. He poops...usually just once a day; they are healthy looking from what I can tell. He will eat some of his greens...from my understanding babies usually are not that interested in greens. I will give it another week or so before I get concerned. He is eating, just not as much as I thought he would....maybe my expectations were high.

Also, I have a few questions regarding temps. I have read that for young dragons, a 105-110* basking temp is ideal. My question is where to place the probe to get a reading. Is that recommended temp with the probe directly under the light? Or should that be the air temp on that side of the cage. I bought a digital probe, and when I place it directly under the light, I am reading temps upwards of 130 about 7-8" from the bulb...however the air temp is significantly lower...around mid to high 80s. Could my bulb be to close? Should the probe read 105 directly under the light? I am putting up pictures later in the thread, so you all can take a look.
Secondly, anyone had any experience with the rep-pro mercury vapor bulb? I read these types of bulbs were fast becoming the norm due to increased UVB and heat all in one. Can the UVB penetrate a metal mesh screen? I have my light placed outside the screen, and I wonder if this greatly diminishes the UVB output.

finally, let me introduce you all to Bacon, my new dragon:

Him Chowing down on some greens...

I just snapped this pick right before bedtime...

Finally, a pic of him in his new home...

 

[Chaaland58]

Hi there, nice looking dragon.
It sounds like you've been doing your research, and are dedicated to having a nice healthy pet, great job going for the MVB, they're excellent. Here are a few things i noticed, and i'm sure others will chime in afterwards.
-You are right to be concerned about his eating habits, but it is normal for them not to have much of an appetite after moving. Also, think of it this way. He was in a petstore, who knows what and how often they were feeding him, therefore, he might be eating more now than ever! So let him settle in, and get used to his new habitat and this whole "eating whenever he wants" thing that he's probably not used to. Now, at this point, obviously you want to get him the most nutrition possible, but if he's being picky, then get him whatever you can, and supplement with the calcium/multivitimins. Calcium=5 days a week Vitamins=3 days a week.

Once you get him eating, here's what you should consider with the food you have now;

-Can o crickets; Dont bother with these, they're not very nutritious, you cant gutload them (because they're dead :lol: ) and they lack enzymes. Stick to live crickets when you can, only offer these when you are out of options.

-Dry food; Same deal, a little higher on nutrition than the can o crickets, but, no enzymes. However, they are great to mix in with your salads as an extra, or to augment his diet, like you said. At this point, it sounds like anything you can get him to eat is good, just make sure you're sprinkling some calcium dust/vitamins on there.

-Vitamins; Check the vitamin A content on the multivitamin, some, such as A, can be toxic at certain levels.

-Greens; Thats great that he's eating them at all. Make sure to get him some real nutritious ones like Collards, they're high in calcium and are exactly what he needs. The best part is, stop and shop will only charge you for what you take (they charge you for the weight) so you can just go in every now and then and grab a couple leaves as needed.

Ok, now for the basking stuff
-Take the temp at the highest possible point he can reach on his perch, just to make sure that the temp on any surface he can reach isnt too high. So, place the probe right where he would be sitting, and let it sit there for about 15 minutes to ensure an accurate reading. That high spot that i see in the back corner of your tank, should be no higher than 110, i actually keep that point no higher than 105. If its too hot, all you have to do is lower that platform. Also, find out if anyone you know has one of those laser thermometers, they come in handy with the mercury vapor bulbs, because they do superheat surfaces, and with the lazer thermometer, you can get the temp of the surface itself, and most importantly, make sure you're not frying any beardies.
- Yes, the UV in mercury vapor bulbs can penetrate the mesh screen, it will cut it by about 35%, but that is to be expected. I'm not sure if the MVB is different, but with most bulbs your dragon needs to be within 12inches of the bulb. Just make sure the temp is right first.

Hope this helps! It sounds like you're on the right track, keep up the good work.

 

[BadCon]

Thank you for the info.
Yeah, I am not to keen on the Can O Crickets...however, I got some live ones and he would not eat them (properly sized). I think its because the pet store was feeding him crickets that were way to big...he does not like the small ones. So far he has actually eaten a some of the Canned crickets. I ordered some silk worms, and some pheonix worms off the internet, and they should be in soon. He will eat meal worms, so hopefully he'll eat these as well.

The greens I feed him are as fallows...Escarole, Endive, lollo rosa, green oak leaf, red oak leaf, red and green chard, mizuna, arugula, Mache, Frisee, radicchio, parsley, dill, and cilantro. I also add some thinly sliced carrot, zucinni, or some red and green squash, depending on whats going on my own salad . I read the suitable veggie list for dragons, but I am not sure about a few of those lettuces. Perhaps I will get something a little simpler next time.

I went and read the ingredients on the multivitamin I purchased. It does not list specific vitamin content, rather various ingredients and herbs. I am assuming there actually is some vitamin content, but since it is not listed...I will most likely replace it with some Herptivite...which seems to be highly recommended around here.


I guess I need to get a stand to raise that light up some. No joke about superheating the surface, it pegged the thermometer today...this rep-pro bulb seems to have a very narrow beam. I have been worried about him getting to cool...and in the end he is most likely getting to hot. I have a simple thermometer on the cool side of the tank, and it is constantly between 75 and 80* depending on whether or not I have a towel covering that side. I'll ditch the towel, and raise the light.
I am trying to fab a top that allows the light a clear path into the tank...no screen. I want to make sure he gets enough UVB. Although, this light is so damn bright (and HOT :shock: ) I seriously doubt UVB is an issue. A side not about this bulb being hot....it instantly nuked the upholstery on my chair when they accidentaly came into contact...it only took a second. Good thing my fixture seems to be ceramic, anything else would be a puddle of go in minutes. Anyone considering the MVB should take that to heart....major fire hazard.


Thanks again for the input. This little guy was a present for me and my roomate...to go along with his Anoles. They are not very friendly (duh) and we wanted something that would chill with the guys. A beardie seemed like the obvious choice. Here is hoping he/she turns into a big beautiful dragon!

 

[Chaaland58]

What you can also do is get rid of the perch alltogether until you're positive you've got a good reading, or move that lizard hammock to a spot under the light, you wont have to worry as much about that becoming superheated because its mesh. P.S yeah, i've got a niice brown spot on the carpet infront of my dragon tank where my roomate thought it would be a good idea to place the clamp lamp while taking the top off of the tank. This is the same kid who today pulled groceries out of a paperbag, and let it fall onto a candle. Thank god for dish hoses built into sinks :lol: So in addition the MVB, my roomate is a fire hazard!

 

[jennybud]

you sound like your getting all the stuff together. it's awesome that he's eating greens so well aready it was a month long battle with me to get bindi to eat his greens. a question about your feeding habits. crickets are mean little buggers you want to make sure you don't leave any in his cage if you feed him in his cage but a good thing to try might be get a ten gallon tank then only tap in one or two crickets in at a time. i find that if i put too many in the tank at a time bindi gets flustered and will tap on the glass (our signal that he wants out) he also might not be use to seeing so much food at one time. pet stores are not known for their over feed animals. plus in a feeder tank there are no distractions like climbing perches or basking rock ect. . . and the best part you don't have to dig the crickets out of the cage cause they will eat your beardie alive. not a good prospect. i can't remember if any one else has said it already. but if he will not eat his crickets remember to dust his food any way. right now bindi is on another hunger strike and will only eat his veggies when i'm not looking so we sprinkle the calcium or vitamins on his veggies.

oh and the last thing. don't feed him too many wax worms i tell my beardie sitter that the wax worms are like king size candy bars. good tasty treat but not really good for you. so only use them as a treat not a staple.

but it sounds like your dragon has a great home with some wonderful owners i'm sure you'll get everything to work out and just to let you know bindi's longest relocation stress food strike lasted about 3 weeks. we had a hard time to get him to eat anything but hopefully it should pass with some patience.

 

[TLSlusher]

P.S yeah, i've got a niice brown spot on the carpet infront of my dragon tank where my roomate thought it would be a good idea to place the clamp lamp while taking the top off of the tank.

LOL.. I'm glad to hear someone else's carpet looks like this!! I actually did my finest work with a ceramic heat emitter.. it was off and I must have hit the on switch when I put it on the floor. About 5 minutes later, there was a REALLY funny smell coming from next to my turtle's tank.. HMM WHAT COULD THAT BE???

And you'd think I'd learn my lesson but NOOOO I put a heat lamp down on top of one of my probe thermometers once too.. GRR!!

Moral of the story.. be careful with hot stuff.. :roll: