Need Advice: What will it take for a Healthy Beardie?

[GoFast]

Oh Jodie....

First off, kudos to you for sticking in there!

Now let me fill you in a bit on what has been going wrong for you.

1. petsmart is that LAST place you should buy a dragon from. Especially such a little one. Ideally you want a good healthy dragon from a reputable breeder be it online or otherwise. There are several FANTASTIC and caring breeders here that have some great dragons. I wouldn't start with sucha tiny one. Try to find one 9+ inches in length. They are much more hardy and developed.

2. Your set up. That 10 gallon is just too small. Try to get something a hair bigger. In a very short amount of time(less than a year) you are going to need a tank that is AT LEAST 24"x24"x36" (48"would be better). The other issue is your temps, more so the way you were taking them. A digital thermometer is critical! SO get that accurite! Don't keep that water bowl in the tank either and I am not a fan of misting. Give the little guy a bath every few days instead. Also avoid the carrots and apples. The other greens you were using were great.

3. Your cricket source. I am guessing you were buying crickets form petsmart? Bad idea. They are dirty, poorly fed, and very often carry parasites. Try a reputable cricket site like ghanns. As much as these little ones eat, it is better to buy a whole bunch at a time anyways. You will save a TON of money plus they will be much healthier.

I think with these suggestions, you will have a healthy and happy dragon that will last you a LONG time

 

[healthybeardie]

We want to purchase a Healthy, Vibrant, Long-living Beardie, but unfortunately our first two experiences with beardies have been nightmares (In loving memory of Spike and Zeke)

Here is what we've done:

10 gallon tank, 60 watt basking, UV lighting (changing out every 6 months)
round stick-on thermometer (will be changing to an AcuRite digital for better accuracy)
Temperatures believed to be 100-105 basking and 80 degrees cooling
green reptile carpet
Large hollow rock cave for basking on top and hide away below
water bowl
daily misting
dusting small crickets
collards, mustard greens, small amounts of kale, carrots, apples

Last November, after buying books and doing Internet research, we purchased our first Beardie from PetSmart for my son's 12th B'Day. He named him Spike. He was about 2-3 months old, 5 inches. He ate dusted crickets but absolutely refused vegetables (I tried him on a variety). Unfortunately, within a couple weeks he developed diarrhea, ate less. Took him to the vets, spent over $100, got a fecal sample and diagnosis of Coccidia. Gave him 10 day's worth course of Albon. He seemed to perk up, and upon stopping the meds, he went down rapidly and began twitching. Because we had him for only 3 weeks, we believed he had the parasites before purchasing him and as heart breaking as it was to me and my son, we exchanged him (he passed away a short time later) for another, in the hopes of getting a healthy one. My instincts were to not purchase it there, but I gave in and we picked another (younger) beardie who was only a few weeks old and about 3 inches. His name was Zeke. My son named him, Zeke. Since I am the primary care taker of Zeke, I got really attached too. He ate vibrantly at first, crickets & greens. His poop was normal looking. Then after having him for 2 weeks, he suddenly developed diarrhea and went down hill from there and died a month later. Needless to say, I am turned off on PetSmart, but after reading all the posts, it sounds like Beardies are rather "fragile" especially when they're juveniles. I so want my son (and me) to have a positive experience with a healthy bearbie, but I just don't know where to purchase one. I've heard pros and cons (mostly cons) about breeders, on-line breeders and Reptile Shows. Right now I am considering getting one from an independent Reptile Pet Store. Where can I get a healthy beardie? What is the best age to get a beardie? Is there something I'm missing? Is the survival rate of juveniles something like 2 out of 10 or something? We're hoping that 3 times is the charm because I don't know if we can go through this again! Sorry its so long!

Jodi

 

[GoFast]

here is your first thread....

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[spurlee01]

Juvies really are not fragile at all. Tiny hatchlings can have a high mortality rate depending on the care giver. First, I would be sure you are buying a juvie. 10" at the minimum is what I would recommend. Second, a 10 gallon tank does not provide the space you need for a temperature gradient. You will need a 20 long at the minimum for a juvie, but you'd be much better off buying a 40 gallon breeder (or larger tank) because that is what your beardie will need by 6 or 7 months. I wouldn't mist in the tank because it can raise humidity too much. As for where to buy your beardie, I would stick to a reputable breeder which you can buy directly from. There are a lot of beardies listed in the "for sale" section.

 

[fresnowitte]

I just wanted to say I'm really sorry Jodi to hear about you and your son's losses with Spike and Zeke.

Also I think that Nick gave you excellent advise in the other thread and Sara has pretty much confirmed what he posted with her post.

I personally don't get beardies from pet stores unless I feel like rescuing one. Rarely are they ever fed or cared for properly...pet stores only maintenance feed (barely enough to keep them alive) and usually to large of crickets at that or mealworms, don't use proper UVB's, and 90% of the time the temps are way to low for them to even digest their foods.

So the longer a baby sits at the pet store the worse off it gets...by the time they are bought they have several issues already even if you can't see them. Such as you found out like with the high count of parasites....not uncommon from a pet store...they don't see poop pick up poop it may sit there for 24 hours while babies run around tonguing at it. Henceforth parasites! Many of them are somewhat impacted when they leave the store due to the large feeders and if they are on sand then a double whammy. Many pet stores worry more about the utility bill than offering good/proper lighting and heat for their reptiles so will often skip the additional heat and only us a coil bulb.

Best of luck to you an your son this time. :wink:

 

[healthybeardie]

Thank you, Barbara. I have every intention on getting a larger tank once the new beardie is acclimated to its new home. I hear relocation stress plays a factor too. That's why I am so curious on how beardies can be "shipped". The idea of getting one from a breeder sounds good, but I have a lot of questions and I guess I'll have to contact one. I just don't want another bad experience again!

 

[Kacymyree]

I just wanted to say that I share your pain.. When i turned 15 i got a beardie for my birthday present, we had everything set up but we were told ( by the pet shop) to house him in a 10 gal and he would be fine.. He was not.. let me just say that it is near impossible to get proper temps with a ten gal. go for a 20 gal at the minimum, but i would suggest a 40 gal

 

[fresnowitte]

Actually your better off starting with a larger enclosure even if you have to section part of it off because it seems to big. This way your beardie will not have to readjust again to the new enclosure...why do relocation stress twice when you don't have to? :wink:

Don't feel bad I use to trip about shipping beardies or having one shipped to me. But it really isn't as bad on them as I would have originally imagined before I was more experienced with beardies. See when you shut a beardies lights off even if it's not bedtime they will go to sleep. Also if you place a blankie over them placing them in the dark they will go to sleep...with that being said I believe (JMO) that they probably sleep nearly the entire time they are in the box. :wink:

 

[healthybeardie]

Are we talking about the same thing - buying a beardie from a breeder out of state and shipping it from one state to another via FED-X or something? How does the package not tumble all over?

 

[fresnowitte]

That's what I was talking about...cross country basically or from another state.

I recently was very worried about temperatures in the shipping company's facilities. So I expressed my concerns with my local UPS and they gave me a mini tour showing me just how the packages are handled and packed in big plastic bins with closing lids. Not only am I no longer worried about the temps but I'm not so worried about the tossing about of the packages either.

 

[sara24354]

I bought both of my beardies from a lady in another state and both were shipped to me,it's done all the time. Both dragons arrived very healthy and just lovable creatures.If you get a beardie from a reputable breeder,it's the best way to go. A breeder can more closely work with the bearides they sell.Will take more time to handle and make sure they are healthy,etc.........pet stores want to make a profit and don't seem to care as much.If they have to spend loads of money for lights and proper feeding,they are not gonna make as much profit.Also you will be able to find out b-days of your beardie and know exactly how old it is,and know that the parents are healthy most of the time. Getting a larger tank to go with at first is also a good bet,then there is no second bout of relocation stress. Put a beardie in a 10 gal tank,it gets used to it gets over relocation stress,move it to a larger tank and whammy,relocation stress again.

 

[Freeie]

You wont need a water bowl they wont drink from it. Bathing them or dripping water on their nose with a dropper for oral water intake would be better than misting. They soak up water through their vent. And some drink from the bath.

 

[healthybeardie]

Hey everybody:

Thank you so much for all the good feedback. Boy have I been getting some good info. on this site and believe I have found a good breeder. I'm getting close to getting a 40 gallon breeder tank with proper UVB lighting. I found an awesome sturdy 39" long coffee table to place the tank on! Once everything is set up...we just need to get the little guy! I can't wait! I'm as excited as my son...maybe a little more. I am so glad I found this site.

Jodi

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

We will help as much as we can.
The best UVB you can get for a tube bulb is the Reptisun 10 or if you want to get a mercury vapor bulb you can look at the Solar Glo mercury vapor bulb.
The best site to get the Reptisun 10 at is:
http://www.petmountain.com/product/reptile-fluorescent-bulbs/504983/zoo-med-reptisun-10.0-uvb-bulb.html

Keep asking questions!
I am sorry about your losses of your little dragons.

Tracie

 

[YellowRoomReptiles]

I have to agree with everyone on this site, I myself am a breeder and would only buy from another reputable breeder that I have researched. I have never had any problems shipping or receiving dragons from other breeders and this includes relocation stress. Most of the babies I have shipped myself have even eaten as soon as they are in their new homes. It's really not as bad as you think on the dragon, like said previously, they are shipped with hot/cold packs in insulated boxes in deli cups with blankets inside and the box is packed with newspaper to keep them from jostling and they just sleep anyways. You should definately not hesitate to research breeders, you can find many lists of reputable breeders on other breeders sites (check http://www.dachiu.com, they have a huge list, or http://www.rioreptiles.com has a nice big list of breeders also). Email them, and just get a feel for the breeder. Definately purchase a larger juvenile, both babies from petsmart that you purchased were definately wayyyy too small to have even been sold to petsmart in the first place, much less up for sale again. Pet stores buy their dragons from others, they don't breed them themselves typically, so those dragons may have already been to a couple of different homes, hence the coccidia outbreak due to stress from constant moving and the store not taking care of them properly. Reputable breeders don't sell babies until they are 6 weeks or 6 inches, and most of the time, they are larger than that. If you look for a juvie about 7 inches or larger, you will be past the more vulnerable baby stage.