Live feeders for an adult: How much is too much?

[KristenT]

So, Taz went through an entire container of worms today. 'Hog' is the immediate word that comes to mind... but it got me thinking.
Taz has never been all that big on veggies. He'll eat them, but begrudgingly so. But I could probably put a container of 100 butter worms in there, and he'd eat every one. In one sitting.
I know the general rule is however much they can/will eat in 15 minutes, but I'm really not sure Taz has a stopping point.... and he eats so fast!
So in reality, how many feeders are too much? Is there a better way to tell than the 15 minute rule? By the time 15 minutes is up, he'd have cleared the entire, newly bought, just opened tub of food!
Yes, I make sure he still eats his veggies and some fruit. I'm a mean mom like that. But I just wonder... feeders 2-3x a week for a fully grown adult male... should he be scarfing them like that, and just how much is too much?! lol
Anyone else have this issue?

 

[Sauzo]

Harley is the same. She eats a couple pieces of greens a day but when it comes to silkworms or hornworms, she is a bottomless pit. I spoiled her by feeding her all she wanted and now at 1.3 years old, she is 610g and 17-17.5 inches. I've been fighting with her these past few days to get her to eat salad and trying to get her to slowly lose weight. She is determined and ate some butternut squash in 3 days but she will eat her dubias which I've limited to 3 a day. And worms are out till she drops a little weight. Plus I've been making her run around everyday which again she hates. She always tries to get to her "perch" on the top of the couch back and stretch out and watch tv and us.

Bottom line is if you spoil them as much as I did with Harley, be prepared for some tough love to try and get them to eat salads and exercise :?

 

[Taterbug]

How old is he? How is his condition? If he's in good shape, I'd keep a log of his weight and monitor his physique. An over weight dragon will have larger fat stores in the armpits, neck and stomach. A trim dragon will have fat stores in the head and tail, but not look swollen. Reduce the feeders to a "maintenance" amount maybe, and he'll make up the difference in veggies if he is still hungry.

There are some vet manuals out there that you could estimate based on his weight so many calories of insects etc, and some info out there of the content of the bugs. The choice of feeder makes a difference. Crickets, roaches or silkworms, are "leaner" in that they are low in fat and calories and can be gutloaded with extra nutrition. On the other hand, butterworms, superworms and large hornworms are much higher on calories and fat.

Dragons are considered "ambush predators" - after a point they are just fine wasting as little energy as possible to hunt, even if that means going a while between bugs. Food in captivity is hardly any work at all, and often on a schedules. Some animals will adapt and not overeat, others will just eat every bug they ever see. I'm sure on some level they recognize that insects are a "better" food source than veggies so why bother with salad if the bugs come everyday.

How do you feed him? Does he need to work for it? Pepper will eat way more bugs from tongs than if he has to walk across his cage to get them.

 

[Sauzo]

If you are directing those questions to me Tater, Harley is porker and she is 1.3 years old. She looks like a pot bellied pig but a beardie And oh I know she Is way overweight. That's why I bought a scale and weighed her. She has a quadruple chin, fat little arms...pretty much fat everything. I spoiled her way too much. And yes that's kind of why I am putting her on a "maintenance " diet but she is determined and is fine with 2-3 dubias a day and wont cave in for the salad so basically the roaches get a good salad every night.

She used to get huge hornworms, silkworms, butterworms, dubias, phoenixworms. She absolutely loves hornworms and silkworms but I am cutting those off for a month or 2 and then I might start silkworms again as a treat.

I've also been making her run around on my bed to try and give her exercise as well as making her swim in her little tub. Of course those only work for a little bit as she mostly likes to just sit and watch me work on the computer or watch tv from the top of the couch back while stretching her back legs out perfectly straight. It's actually pretty hilarious.

 

[KristenT]

Taz is 3 years old, and I don't know his weight at the moment... I do need to get a scale. He is in good condition, but he doesn't have extra fat stores. He's got decent fat stores in his head and tail, but no excess. That's what gets me.... he acts like he's a pig, but he's not over weight.

I feed him roaches and silk worms when I can get them in.... I detest crickets, and refuse to mess with those.

I don't intentionally make him work for his food.... but all I have to do is take the worm dish out of his cage, and he starts going nuts. Glass dancing, jumping on and off his basking spot and branch, racing back and forth across the cage... the whole works. He's a pretty active dragon... when he's out for floor time, he's constantly moving.

This morning when I went to give Taz a few bugs in his dish, he was leaping at the dish as I was lowering it into the cage... he's almost got my fingers a few times! He just acts like he's so starved all the time! :shock:

I guess he's just a pig... I have had him fecal tested for parasites before, twice... both were negative.

I'm just wondering should I let him have his fill in 15 minutes, as much as he wants (or until I run out of feeders....) since he's not over weight, or will some dragons eat so much they hurt themselves? I'm just worried Taz doesn't know when to stop....

 

[Sauzo]

Well I used to feed Harley as much as she wanted in 15 mins 3 times a day. She never liked salads so the most I could get her to eat would be about 3-5 pieces. She loved worms and would eat probably 6-7 xtra big hornworms a day when I let her. She could polish off a hornworm or silkworm container in 2 days unless it had the xtra big ones in there. She never acts hungry though. She is really mellow and doesn't run much. She more or less waited for me to handfeed her or drop em in front of her. She likes her dubias too. kind of weird how your dragon only has fat stores in the head and tail. Harley has fat stores in places I didn't think they could store it :lol: Head, tail, legs, arms, belly, boobs, quadruple chin beard and jowls Be happy though as like I've said in other posts, I know have to put Harley on a maintenance diet which honestly she doesn't seem to care but still doesn't want to eat her veggies.

As for eating themselves into a coma, my advice is use judgement and compare the insects size and numbers in relation to your dragon. Cause if you have one like Harley, your might eat themselves into obesity.

 

[KendraA]

I found this video helpful in deciding how much insect protein to feed. This breeder does a lot of scholarly research when it comes to bearded dragon husbandry. I thought it was interesting that he devised a unique feeding schedule based on his own beardie dying early of complications he believes to be due to too much protein (discussed in the video):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tU-r0C5iZ8M