IS THIS RIGHT?!

[Beardienatic]

Hi guys!
I am getting a bearded dragon soon, and I just wanted to double-check that all of my information is correct before I buy it, so I can take the best possible care of my new beardie. This is what I have found from my research and/or what I will be doing for my beardie.

*Enclosure - 120cm x 60cm x 60 cm, made from melamine sheets
*Substrate - Repti-carpet, the fake grass look-alike (sand seems too risky with the possibility of impaction)
*UVA & UVB light -
-- UVA is the basking light, UVB is the general light
--How many watts should my lights be for my enclosure size?
--Light times - Summer 14 hours on, 10 hours off : Spring & Autumn 12 hours on, 12 hours off : Winter 10 hours on, 14 hours off OR Is it just better to leave it on a permanent cycle of 12 hours on, 12 hours off?
--I live in Melbourne, Australia, would I need a heater at night?
--What should the temperatures of the enclosure be?
*Thermometers - It seems like the digital version is better than the others?
*Hiding places should be provided as well as a basking area, within 15cm - 20cm of the light (6inch - 7inch)
*Bathing - I was thinking once every week, and twice a week when shedding
*Feeding - "Salad" once a day, misted with water, crickets once a day, as much as the bearded dragon can eat in 15 mins ( I was thinking of feeding him in a different area than his enclosure, so I can safely remove any crickets he doesn't eat). I will mist him after each feeding to keep him hydrated.
-- Is commercial pellets helpful/ neccessary?
*Water - I will keep a water bowl in the enclosure, aware that he will most likely not drink from it, but then he can soak in it if necessary. Is this a good idea?
--I know they cannot drink tap water, so I thought I would use the product ReptiSafe that removes harmful chemicals and minerals from the water.
*Cleaning - Spot cleaning done daily (or as often as he goes to the toilet). Enclosure totally stripped and cleaned with a 10% bleach Reptile Cleaner Spray monthly or every two months?, then rinsed until no more bleach is smelt.
*Supplements - I haven't been able to get a clear answer on this, but it seems calcium powder over insects every second day, and multivitamin powder twice a week over insects.
*Brumation - how do I know if my beardie is heading into brumation or is sick? Should I wake him up during brumation? Should I feed and spray during brumation?
*Vet- I have found a good herp vet in my area, does anyone have any ideas on how much vets cost here in Melbourne? Do I need to take him for yearly check-ups or just when he seems ill?
*Taming - I have seen in a few places that it is recommended not to pick up your beardie for the first week that you have it, is this true and accurate information? Any tips of getting him used to me will be appreciated.
*Insects - is crickets enough nutrients, or do I need another type of insect?
-- How many crickets does an adult bearded dragon eat daily? (I know it does depend on the individual, but just a rough estimate, please?)
*How much does the initial set-up cost?
*How much does the ongoing costs (food, etc) cost per year?
*Shedding - How often will adult beardies shed, and what can I do to help him?
*Is it ok to feed him dead insects? I am an animal lover, and would kinda hate to watch my beardie kill the crickets. :?
*CAN ANYBODY PLEASE GIVE ME A LINK TO A CHEAP ONLINE INSECT ORDERING PLACE?? (Remember, I live in Australia)

Sorry for all the questions, I just really want to make sure everything is perfect for my new Bearded dragon.
Please let me know if any of my info is wrong, or if there is anything I have missed.
Thank you so much in advance!!

 

[AHBD]

Hi there....it's good that you are so enthused about getting your new beardie and getting everything right for his arrival. I'll try to answer a few Q's later, but I notice that you are from Australia, and there is a member here from Australia who posts quite a bit in the " health " forum. " His username is Kingofknobby's, so if you have a look there in the health I'm sure you can contact him for specifics on where to buy feeder insects, including silkworms.

 

[premammalian]

Wellcome to the forum.
You are from Australia, so I cannot advise you on the costs or the sources you will get food and supplies, however other australian members can help with that.
Generally you are right in your conclusions, but I must point out some areas.
The enclosure dimentions are good, although you would not have any problem by using a slightly smaller one. I suppose from your posts you will get a larger or adult dragon, and that it is good, as they are more hardy and tolerant of mistakes.
The watage of the lamp isn't dictated only by the dimentions of the tank, but also from the ambient temperature and the distance of the basking spot from the lamp. A 40 W may help if the temperatures are room temperature and it isn't higher than 12 cm from the basking spot. In case of temperatures rising much, you can change the bulb to an 25 or 30 w. You must aim for a 37-40 basking spot.
To create the basking spot and other climbing areas, provide some sturdy branches for the dragon to get high, as they would do in nature, and also exercise and file its nails. Also you can put a hiding spot.
As for substrate, I personally would not mess with carpeting of any type. Besides of having the danger of threads twining around your lizard's digits, possibly cutting circulation and causing them to fall off in the long run, it is difficult or at least time-consuming to clean. Most choose it due to supposedly naturalistic effect, but the fact is that these dragons come from a dry environment, not from a lawn park. I use paper, choose a type similar to cardboard, and also many membbers use tile.
A water bowl isn't needed, and a large one enough to soak would raise humidity to unacceptable levels. Also it isn't mandatory to spray just after feeding, you can do it any time, and not necessarily daily. Bearded dragons drink tap water just fine.
As for food, aim for variety, as large as you can. Crickets are of course nutricious, but they are overvalued. There are many other insects to include as well. Cockroaches, mealworms, superworms, silkworms, phoenix worms, etc. I don't know if all of these are available in Australia, but I am sure that silkworms, phoenix worms and a type of roach called wood roach are available. The insects must be dusted with calcium pouder every few feedings. The actual vitamin needs are debated, but you can give twice a month to be safe.
It is not mandatory to wet your salad always, and not necessary at all if you include succulent foods like vegetables in it. Most of the time though, try to use mostly leaves and flowers.
Your light cycles are good. I increased mine to 13 hours at summer, but that isn't much of a difference from the ideal 14. Also don't forget to expose your animal to natural sunlight. At winter your animal might brumate. It isn't something bad, it is natural, and if it hasn't any major health problems, it will be just fine. I brumated mine for three months, and when she woke up didn't lose any noticeable weight, and also fed the second day. You can just induce your dragon to brumate. Beware also that your dragon might estivate in hot temperatures, like mine did this summer. They tend to hide a lot like in brumation, but generally they feed well, defecate erraticly, and bask for a limited time. It is an uncommon occurrence though and you must not obscess over it.
Last but not least, a bearded dragon is a born hunter. You can feed dead insects, but they quickly deteriorate and lose much nutritional value. They aren't like the rodents for snakes which are frosen and keep for long. The dragon must eat live insects, and watching it hunt is the most exciting part of feeding. Moreover insects have not so sophisticated nervous systems like vertebrates to feel pain like us.

 

[Beardienatic]

Hi there....it's good that you are so enthused about getting your new beardie and getting everything right for his arrival. I'll try to answer a few Q's later, but I notice that you are from Australia, and there is a member here from Australia who posts quite a bit in the " health " forum. " His username is Kingofknobby's, so if you have a look there in the health I'm sure you can contact him for specifics on where to buy feeder insects, including silkworms.

Thank you, and I look forward to reading your responses to my questions! I will definitely have a look at "Kingofknobby's" posts for more info.

 

[Beardienatic]

As for substrate, I personally would not mess with carpeting of any type. Besides of having the danger of threads twining around your lizard's digits, possibly cutting circulation and causing them to fall off in the long run, it is difficult or at least time-consuming to clean. Most choose it due to supposedly naturalistic effect, but the fact is that these dragons come from a dry environment, not from a lawn park. I use paper, choose a type similar to cardboard, and also many membbers use tile.

I have not actually seen reptile carpet in real life, I know the carpet type has loops that can easily get caught on their nails, but I was under the impression that the fake-grass one, was actually just fake grass.

 

[Beardienatic]

Two more questions!
How often is bathing recommended?
And what are some of the signs of brumation?

AHBD and everybody else - please still answer all my above questions, I would like to get as many opinions as possible!

 

[AHBD]

O.K., I'll try to remember most of your Q's. For your lighting, the Reptisiun 10.0 t5 or Arcadia 12% are a couple of the best long tube UVB bulbs. The UVB is needed for the beardie because it enables the reptile to assimilate calcium.....without a good UVB bulb a dragon will develop MBD [ metabolic bone disease] A good strong white basking bulb, it can be a halogen or other to light + heat the tank. You will have to experiment with wattage to determine which bulb can heat the tank properly. Possibly a 75....but your digital thermometer [ or a heat gun ] will tell you what you need.

Most young dragons don't care for non living prey items and most don't like the beardie pellet food [ which is not as nutritious ] so you will be watching the demise of many an insect. You'll get used to it, and beardies dispatch them quickly....so do not worry lest you be overcome with angst at the soon to be often witnessed spectacle. :lol: You will be fine !! You'll also need good greens to feed ...I don't know what you have available in Australia but in the U.S we have turnip, mustard, collard, dandelion greens.

It may be best not to have a water bowl in the tank for a very small baby, they get disoriented when sleepy or ill and can fall asleep right in the bowl. If you MUST put a bowl in, wait until he is at least 12"....but most owners don't keep waterbowls in the tank for humidity concerns, also many beardies will use it as a toilet. Beardies don't need to be sprayed down, only to assist in shedding, and even then just a light spritz that doesn't wet the tank. I hydrate all my dragons by dripping/spraying [ a gentle direct stream ] on their snout. My babies drank every single day that way, sub adults/adults 1-2 times a week. I only bathe if they are dirty, many owners do so every couple of days ....you can decide what works for you.

Calcium powder very lightly once daily for babies, 2-3X a week for adults....vitamins 1-2X a week, also VERY lightly. I keep my lights at 13-14 hours during summer, then less during the fall. My beardies are in my basement where it gets cool enough in the winter to turn lights off completely for part of the time when they brumate at 65 degrees. Oh, and babies NEVER brumate...if they hide or sleep constantly, something is wrong. Only sub adult.adult dragons brumate.

The fake grass is a bad idea, it will trap fecal matter every day and can't be easily spot cleaned. Some people use cut tile [ from home improvement store ] or you can use non adhesive shelf liner. Basking logs are usually preferred to rocks for climbing, but a combination of both will offer choices and rocks can help file their nails.

So there are some ideas...please update when you get your beardie and how you decide to set up the tank.

 

[Beardienatic]

I won't be getting my bearded dragon until about February or March 2016, since me and my family are going away for 6 weeks, and I don't want to have my beardie for a a few weeks and then give it to somebody else for a month and a half. I would like to have him settled in nicely into my environment and routine before switching it completely again. And on top of that, I will be building the enclosure myself (well, with my dad), and we are moving house around that time, so I need to allow enought time to move and build an enclosure!
But, I will DEFINITELY be posting an update as soon as I get him.
*Can bearded dragons be trained to drink from the sippy-bottle thingies? (like what is used with guinea pigs and rabbits?)
*How often is feeding recommended? (I will be getting an adult beardie, since it seems they are hardier and easier to care for than babies)
Thank you so much for all replies!!

 

[premammalian]

I have heard that this can be done with chameleons with some difficulty, but do they actually need to drink so much? Remember that they are arid living animals with much better conservation strategies. Generally reptiles and birds conserve much better water than mammals.
As for brumation, your dragon will start prefering the cool side of the tank, hide more, eat less, and later it will do mostly nothing and hide.
I have justopened a topic about bathing. In my opinion it isn't necessary if there are no problems.

 

[Beardienatic]

Sorry, I keep thinking of more questions to ask!
How often are bearded dragons (adults) expected to have a bowel movement? I know it can be a pretty wide range, but a rough estimate?
How many insects (medium crickets/silkworms) do bearded dragons (adults) eat per day? Again, I know it can be a pretty wide range depending on the individual, but a rough estimate?

Is this a good feeding schedule for an adult beardie?

MONDAY: Bok Choy, Capsicum, Green beans
TUESDAY: Cucumber, Endive, Butternut
WEDNESDAY: Bok Choy, Kale, Snow peas
THURSDAY: Carrot, Capsicum, Apple
FRIDAY: Cucumber, Green beans, Butternut
SATURDAY: Bok Choy, Endive, Snow peas
SUNDAY: Carrot, Endive, Pear

MONDAY: crickets
TUESDAY: crickets
WEDNESDAY: silkworms
THURSDAY: crickets
FRIDAY:silkworms
SATURDAY: crickets
SUNDAY: silkworms

***OR***

MONDAY: crickets & silkworms
TUESDAY: crickets & silkworms
WEDNESDAY: crickets & silkworms
THURSDAY: crickets & silkworms
FRIDAY: crickets & silkworms
SATURDAY: crickets & silkworms
SUNDAY: crickets & silkworms

 

[CooperDragon]

Adults can go every day or they can wait several days between poops. It depends on the individual and their current eating habits. Young ones often go more than once per day but not always.

An adult should be eating approximately 80% veges so the bugs are really only necessary every few days if that (whatever makes up 20% or so after they have their greens). I suggest rotating the salad offerings depending on what you can get fresh at the store. Offering a variety is a good idea and much healthier. I wouldn't follow a strict schedule for feeding an adult though. Rather, I'd offer fresh salad (perhaps at different times of the day) but I'd offer bugs on different days and times (still about 10 minutes or until they're done eating) so they don't sit back and wait for feeding time. They respond to routine and schedules so keeping them on their toes a bit regarding feeding time and variety may help keep their minds engaged and their hunting instincts up more than would be the case with strict schedules.

 

[premammalian]

Adults can poop in intervals ranging from daily to weekly or more. Most of the time expect it to poop every 2-3 days. Also it is not necessary to feed them daily always. I feed usually every two days. Don't make strict shedules, because it is guaranteed you will break them often. From vegetables, give mostly leaves and flowers, and less watery parts like cucumber with nearly zero nutritional value. Leaves must not necessarily come from edible vegetables, you can use hibiscus, mulberry, grape vine, dandelion etc. Also from insects try to create a variety of more than two species.

 

[Beardienatic]

Thank you so much for all of the replies!, I have learnt so much through this forum. You can be expecting a lot more posts and updates from me!!

 

[kingofnobbys]

repeat post

 

[kingofnobbys]

I'm in NSW.

I buy my crickets and worms (supers and mealworms) by mailorder from http://frogs.org.au/arcade/ , my cricket order usually arrives on my front patio on Wednesday am , Thursday at the latest , nearly always 99% healthy.Beats buying the crickets in tubs and paying through the nose for them. I use adult beardie pellets and carrot and buk/puk choi to gutload the crickets.
I buy 2x 700x 2/3 sized crickets every 2 weeks for my 5 lizards. You'll probably only need 2x 175 x 2/3 sized crickets every 2 weeks for one adult beardie.

Check GumTree for silkworms , or buy them as eggs from http://www.peacefulsilkworms.com.au/shop/ , she's a very nice lady and very helpful when you have questions...

My pets are fabulously spoilt rotten, fed Insects nearly every day (once per day now they are adults) , they get their vegs/salad/pellets at brekky, and insects + some greens in evening around diner time. (that said, if they beardie , or skink is asleep at dinner time - I don't wake them to feed them.)

I try to give each beardie (with a bluetongue buddy) , never 2 beardies or 2 bluetonges out together , at least 2 hours each day to roam about time inside the house - I simply close the doors to the rooms I don't want them to visit and I simply keep tabs on them , other than that - they get to do their own thing (and they love it).
Rex trots about with her tail up in the air and gets into everything and will usually seek my wife or me out when she is ready for cuddles , or she'll crash in a corner somewhere or under the table.
Puff has always been much more laid back and sedate, he'll mozzy about at a leisurely crawl and will eventually drift towards the front window if the sun's coming in (in the pm) and curl up for a toasty nap there or he'll simply hang out close to Rex's tank or close to me (indicating he wants a nice snuggle - he's my big smooger , loves a nice long snuggle under my hoody's arms while being tickled on the back or petted.

Gets pretty cold in Melbourne at night (as you can personally attest to with the current weather.....brrrrrr ....(even freezing today and tonight here in subtropical north coastal NSW). I think your beardie will appreciate nighttime heating if the room it's housed in gets colder than 20oC.

My lizards all have heatpads (7W for the beardies and bluetongues , 5W for the water skink, just standard basic film type heatpads , I sandwich these between 2 layers of ceramic tiles and control them with simple switching thermostats (run 24/7 365d/y) , set to 36-37oC for the beardies, a few degrees cooler for the skinks , and they go in the enclosures under the main hide. My lizards all love their heatpads and often nap on during the day and sleep on them at night.
My house is airconed 24/7 , and never gets colder than 20oC.

You might need a CHE for night time heating of the enclosure in your location , control with a simple switching thermostat and put the thermostat on a simple household light timer so it only works at night after the basking light is off.

I add softened juvenile beardie pellets and vetafarm lizard pellets to the salad/veg.

NOTE cucumber has zero nutritional content. Only helpful in hydration..http://www.beautifuldragons.com/Nutritionframeset.html

Unless you are on bore water, tap water is fine. Just leave some in buckets for few hours if you are worried about "additives" , they'll mostly evaporate.

My lights are on a timer , on 6am , off 9:30pm , I don't change for the seasons (I'm not interested in breeding). My timer is nothing fancy , just a standard 1 - week programmable electronic timer from OfficeWorks.

I use UVB200 compact UV globes (UVA and UVB) in pendulum style dome ceramic fittings , par38 clear colourless spottys from Bunnings for bright light and heat. (80W globes in my 18" tall enclosures). You could just go to a good quality (ie Acadia) MVB and use a standard household T5 or T8 fluoro tube to light up the rest of the enclosure away from the basking spot.
You can alternatively use a T5 or T8 UVB10 (minimum) tube + a MVB or a par38 spotty.

Don't get sucked into buying elcheapo "non-brand" "shop's brand" UV globes and MVBs , they are a false economy , poor quality chinese clones (knockoff) and have poor reliability.

I'd also invest in a 200ml bottle of F10 concentrate and an F10 spray bottle, and a small bottle of Fluon.

For your enclosure - I would think 100W basking / MVB for summer , 120-130W in winter (for a tank 2ft tall).

I bath my beardies only occasionally (in a baby's bathtub) -
- when I think they might need help pooing
- when they are shedding
- when they have soiled themselves
- can use a luke warm bath if it's HOT in the house and they are getting too hot.

I have no water dish in my beardie enclosures. (They increase humidity) My beardies get sufficient hydration from their live insects and greens and salad/veg.

My substrate is just standard rock look floor tiles laid loose - if a tile is soiled - I simply lift it out and take it outside for a hosedown.

If you want to grow greens for the beardie - dandelion is good (grows wild in my yard, they and visiting rosellas love the flowers, the seed pods (before the open) and the leafs are good very high Ca.
Nasturtium (leafs , flowers) all good.
Hybiscus (check the variety - rose type is good - flowers and leaf ?)
Rose pettles
Puk choi/ buk choi
Mulberry leafs and berrys
strawberrys
blueberrys
are worth growing