Is it the Metacam?

[KevinsMama]

Hey everyone I'm getting worried about Kevin. I have a recovery thread going & I posted there but I'm stressing.

He has a splint on his back leg due to a broken femur.

He is eating somewhat normal but today he isn't the tiniest bit active. I am hand feeding him so he doesn't move for eating. He has stayed in the same place all day & I caught him with both eyes closed a bit ago. I also think he shivered twice but I'm not certain. His poop has been super runny & watery but the urate looks good.

I don't know if I'm being silly & worrying & due to all the stress lately he's just overwhelmed or if something is wrong.

Could it be the Metacam? Does is have drowsiness and diarrhea as a side effect? I've been looking forever but all I see are horror stories but no list of sure side effects.

I would have to call the emergency line since it Christmas so I'd rather not unless absolutely neccesary.

 

[KevinsMama]

Man, it's Christmas, everyone is busy that could give me advice. I'm sure I'm overreacting. My husband keeps telling me I am but he literally knows nothing about beardies other than what I've learned h taught him. Which isn't much. He is keeping me calmer tho.

 

[AHBD]

Poor baby, this is so hard on them. I didn't want to say from the start but beardies often do better without a splint [ according to some vets ] and their bones will usually knit themselves. The splint is putting lots of pessure on the entire leg + shoulder and I wondered immediately why it was put up in that way. You can't really immobilize an active animal like that. I think that it should have just been wrapped but left in the natural position or else just left to heal on it's own. Here is another vets opinion :

https://www.justanswer.com/veterinary/45lzf-female-bearded-dragon-broken-arm-not.html

 

[AHBD]

Having said that, at least it is the back leg and although it's extended backwards it's not as dramatic as it would ave been if it were the front [ I forgot that it was the back ] but it will still be very uncomfortable and many dragons do heal without being splinted. Either way , if you say he's still eting that's a good thing. It IS difficult to dose a tiny dragon with metacam though.

 

[KevinsMama]

Poor baby, this is so hard on them. I didn't want to say from the start but beardies often do better without a splint [ according to some vets ] and their bones will usually knit themselves. The splint is putting lots of pessure on the entire leg + shoulder and I wondered immediately why it was put up in that way. You can't really immobilize an active animal like that. I think that it should have just been wrapped but left in the natural position or else just left to heal on it's own. Here is another vets opinion :

https://www.justanswer.com/veterinary/45lzf-female-bearded-dragon-broken-arm-not.html

That makes a lot of sense too. I just assumed because of it being the femur & broke in half that it was to prevent further injury so both sounds right.

So what should I do? She wants to leave it in the splint the full 6weeks taking him in every 2weeks to redo it. I know he will have some muscle & possibly shed damage by then.

I'm kinda wary of the vet anyway cause she mentioned the big E word after showing me the xrays. She made it seem as a lower cost & maintenance option. I had no idea how to feel about that. I've never heard of putting down any animal other than a horse for a broken leg without giving the chance for healing! Completely caught me off guard when she said it was an option!

And the Metacam. I feel he is too small to get a proper dosage. I'm really reluctant to giving it to him now.

Something just doesn't seem right.

 

[AHBD]

Maybe just see how he's walking after she takes it off after 2 weeks. Of course it will be stiff and there will be some limping but it may have healed enough by then to just let it be.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

I agree, splinting isn't always the best but sometimes helpful depending on where it's at.
The metacam can be hard on their systems & has been known to cause diarrhea.
I would definitely try to give some type of probiotic if you can, to try & help settle his tummy
right now. Can you get some oral fluids into him also?
Everything always happens on a holiday!

Tracie

 

[KevinsMama]

Ok. She said it was imperative the splint stays on the whole 6wks & takes him in another room to splint it so what I'll do is when it starts to need replacing, I'll just call her to get the appointment, just in case, & cut it off to see how he does myself.

I haven't had much luck getting him to take water, hes so grumpy with everything but I'm persistent so he gets some lol. I got him some liquid calcium thinking it might boost him a little but haven't gave him any cause I was waiting on someone to advise me on that.

I've seen other posts recommending yogurt for a probiotic so I'll head out & get some after Christmas when everything opens. Is there anything else I should grab while I'm out?

 

[AHBD]

You can just put a dab or drop of the liquid calcium on one his feeder insects, that should be plenty.

And yes, now that I remember the xrays, he has a complete break in 2 places so some splinting is probably the best thing for him. Hopefully it will be. And again, the fact that he's eating is a very good sign and shows that he's a strong little guy.

 

[EllenD]

Having said that, at least it is the back leg and although it's extended backwards it's not as dramatic as it would ave been if it were the front [ I forgot that it was the back ] but it will still be very uncomfortable and many dragons do heal without being splinted. Either way , if you say he's still eting that's a good thing. It IS difficult to dose a tiny dragon with metacam though.

Normally I'd agree with you AHBD, but not for a femur fracture like that. That femur fracture must be in a splint, I saw the x-ray and it's a displaced fracture and it absolutely needed to be set and splinted in order for a collagen matrix to start to form between the fracture. If a Bearded Dragon has a "Hairline" fracture or even a Greenstick fracture or Spiral fracture that is not displaced then I wouldn't want them in any type of splint either, but in this particular instance he absolutely needed to have the bone set and immobilized, at least for 4-6 weeks. It was an experienced Herp Vet that did it, and he knew what he was doing. Had that fracture not been immobilized there's no way it would have healed properly, not even close. It was too far displaced.

As far as the MetaCam, it definitely does always seem to cause drowsiness and sometimes even nausea in both reptiles and birds. I've given it to both, and in both cases they were sleeping on and off all day, not moving much at all, and when you combine that with the pain of a femur fracture like he has, I would certainly expect him to not be very mobile and be sleeping. It's okay, he needs the rest, and it's better that he's not moving around much for right now, it's only been a couple of days since it happened, it's going to be pretty painful for the first week or so and he definitely needs the Metacam. I think I already stated that I was surprised he wasn't given a stronger narcotic pain reliever for a displaced femur fracture like that, it's the largest bone in the body and is extremely painful when it's fractured. Bone pain is a very unique pain all it's own, it hurts like a mother, lol. No other way to say it. As someone who has broken several bones and had hardware put in, there is no worse pain that I've ever experienced, and it's constant for the first few days to a week. And I had two open abdominal surgeries including a complete hysterectomy with 32 staples going across my belly...didn't hurt anywhere near like the broken Tibia and Fibula did. So he's a hurting little guy right now, and it's completely normal for the Metacam to make him sleepy and the pain + meds making him immobile. It's not only normal, but it's necessary for him to just be lazy for this next week.

As for the runny stools, I'd say that's probably a combination of both the Metacam and the stress he's going through. He's in a lot of pain, he's got the splint on his leg, he's not understanding what's going on, and stress can certainly cause runny stools. He's going to be out-of-whack for a while, but I'd say after the first week he should be out of the really harsh, "acute" pain that he's in now. Then it just becomes pain that he'll feel when he's moving it or bangs it on something, etc. That's the other reason he needs the splint for 4-6 weeks, not only for the displaced fracture to heal properly and to prevent as much ensuing Arthritis that will no doubt result when he's older, but also to protect the leg from being banged off of things and moved all around, which would be even more painful.

It's a nasty, serious injury he has. He'll fully recover, no worries there, but a displaced femur fracture is a very painful, very serious, very stressful injury, especially for a little baby dragon. He'll be fine, but this next week or so will be rough on both of you, I'm sure. I'd be a total mess if I was in your situation with one of my guys, lol, so I totally understand.

 

[AHBD]

Yes I realized that Ellen and corrected myself in the post just above yours. I believe the xrays are in a different thread.

 

[EllenD]

Yes I realized that Ellen and corrected myself in the post just above yours. I believe the xrays are in a different thread.

Yes, they are in a different thread, the first thread she posted...I apologize, I didn't see your correction, my bad. I just wanted to make sure that no one thought it might be a good idea to remove the splint or ask the vet to do so, not with a fracture like that. It's a nasty break, though it is a clean break, I didn't see any splintering or fragments, so it should heal with no issues at all. It's just going to be a rough first week or two for everyone involved. He's doing quite well considering the injury he has.

A lot of people don't realize that the main reason that orthopedic surgeons operate and put hardware in to most fractures anymore, even small, non-displaced fractures that 20 years ago they would have just put a cast on and taken off after 4-6 weeks, is to minimize the extent of the arthritis that the patient will inevitably suffer from in their later years. That goes for reptiles, birds, dogs, cats, etc. too. So this Herp Vet that Kevin was taken to seems like a very knowledgeable, experienced reptile vet, thank God. It's nice to see a vet who knows what they're doing for a change, lately it's been out of control....

 

[AHBD]

No problem and I agree the vet has done a god job. And it's really a plus that Kevin is doing pretty well and still has an appetite considering his circumstances.

 

[KevinsMama]

Yes I realized that Ellen and corrected myself in the post just above yours. I believe the xrays are in a different thread.

Yes, they are in a different thread, the first thread she posted...I apologize, I didn't see your correction, my bad. I just wanted to make sure that no one thought it might be a good idea to remove the splint or ask the vet to do so, not with a fracture like that. It's a nasty break, though it is a clean break, I didn't see any splintering or fragments, so it should heal with no issues at all. It's just going to be a rough first week or two for everyone involved. He's doing quite well considering the injury he has.

A lot of people don't realize that the main reason that orthopedic surgeons operate and put hardware in to most fractures anymore, even small, non-displaced fractures that 20 years ago they would have just put a cast on and taken off after 4-6 weeks, is to minimize the extent of the arthritis that the patient will inevitably suffer from in their later years. That goes for reptiles, birds, dogs, cats, etc. too. So this Herp Vet that Kevin was taken to seems like a very knowledgeable, experienced reptile vet, thank God. It's nice to see a vet who knows what they're doing for a change, lately it's been out of control....

Thank you. I found the vet off herpvetconnection.com & even tho Google said there was several "exotics" vets around me, the look of that one was much better. They asked all the right questions & looking at his health report card, they checked for all the right things. It actually says it is imperative he stays in the splint, even when it starts to slide, just bring him in to redo it. She is even not gonna charge for an office visit, just the $20 for the bandaging. I see so many mixed things on splitting vs. Not splitting & it just adds to my stress.

I did make notes today so far on his behavior before h after medication dose & it is pretty obvious it's affecting him some way. Just not sure if it's good or bad. He moves MUCH less & gets darker & his eyes get droopy like he's like FML right now lol. My husband swears it's just relief from the pain.

I am being an obnoxious worry wort, but I am just so terrified hes gonna slip downhill from infection or stress or who knows what else so I'm hovering too much lol. Especially after a whopping $160 vet visit for a $60 lizard! All my friends & family are treating me like I'm psychotic for taking a lizard to the vet! And honestly, I'm a little shocked myself. He has turned into an extremely expensive pet. But I am completely in love with him, the little booger! I just don't think I can handle losing him right now. Especially after the way I reacted when I hurt him. Called my husband at work screaming crying h my 9yr old daughter was trying to comfort me! Crazy lady here!

I really think I'm just gonna back off a while & give him his space. He's eating very well & no black beard so I'm sure he's just adapting & healing.

Should I maybe fashion him some kinda hide to go in & rest when he's feeling drowsy? He has nothing in there but one of my shirts folded in the corner (pooped on his blankie this morning lol) so he just goes to the corner & lays down. Poor guy...

 

[EllenD]

Awe, he's going to be just fine. He definitely needs the splint, actually the splint is greatly reducing the pain he's in because it's keeping the leg from moving around. And yes, it's definitely the Metacam making him drowsy and act weird, but it's a good weird, lol. I know it doesn't seem that way, but your husband is correct, he's relaxing and is not feeling any stress right now because of the pain relief from the Metacam. Pain causes stress on them, and this fracture would cause severe pain, so right now everything you're describing that he's doing is not only normal for the situation, it's a good thing. All good things. The fact that he's eating and has no black beard is just added proof that he's feeling good, and is out of discomfort and stress. He's doing extremely well.

You can certainly put a hide in for him, though honestly I'd wait until a week has gone by because he shouldn't be moving around much at all for the first week, and if you put a hide in there and put him in it, if he wants to come out he may struggle to move to get out of it. After the first week of this it will be much less stressful for him and for you, for right now I'd just let it the way it is, he needs the UVB light and the heat right now anyway. It sounds like he's quite comfortable right now actually, so I'd just roll with it. Keep talking to him softly and let him know you're there. poor little guy is probably still a bit shaken from the entire ordeal, but I can't express how good he's doing, most dragons wouldn't be eating anything right now due to both the pain, the stress from the entire event, and then the pain meds. So he's doing extremely well.

And yes, they grab onto your heart pretty quickly, they have their own little personalities, to me they are just as much a part of my family as my 2 dogs and my 4 parrots are. Yes, they only cost $60, but they give back a priceless relationship, that's for sure.

And hang on to that Herp Vet, you have no idea how hard a good one is to come by. Most people have to settle for an "exotics" vet, which simply means they are a general vet who is "willing" to see pets other than dogs and cats. That's it, they have no extra education or training in reptiles, birds, rodents, etc. and they often cause more problems than the poor dragon has before they ever walked into their offices. So grab onto that Herp Vet and do not let go!!!!