I'm at a loss...Adult dragon issues

[Drache613]

Hello Jill,

I would get the first one as it is capsules with powder in it. You can just get a small amount of powder & sprinkle it on the food or into the slurry, whichever is more convenient.
How is he doing today?
Please keep us posted on him. I hope he is feeling better soon.

Tracie

 

[Mustashio]

**UPDATE**

Tuesday April 22nd
Took him to the vet today. I take him to Southview Animal Hospital in Inver Grove Heights, where Twin Cities Reptiles store takes all their reptiles. Dr Godinez is the reptile expert there and has seen Tashi since he was only a few months old. She didn't think Tashi was going to make it back then, but he pulled through. I'm not so sure about this time unfortunately.

The vet is very concerned about the puffy swollen R front leg. This morning when I brought him in his r foot was pretty swollen and completely flaccid. He is no longer pulling away when I touch it, it just hangs there. He will use it to walk though when he chooses to. However, with the addition of his other symptoms (vomiting, drinking a ton, fuzzy urates and loose stools, not eating or hunting anything unless it is syringe fed) she said she is leaning more and more towards kidney issues. The new lab has cheaper tests, but the blood test for the kidney function is $100. I asked the vet, if it is kidney issues then what do we do, and she said "comfort care". I am devastated I then asked her if we found out it wasn't kidneys, then what. She said then she would look at his heart. And if it was his heart, there isn't anything they can do about that either. I bawled all day Tuesday and just snuggled with him the rest of the night.

The vet did give me some Reglan to help with gastric motility and see if we cant help with the regurgitation and vomiting. She said that if/when he drops 35% of his weight, that's when it will be time to worry. She did think it was odd though that she is seeing swelling in his limb and that it is only ONE limb. Usually she sees swelling of the eyes with fluid retention from kidney issues. I'll hold onto the thread of hope that it is something else, but I'm not all that optimistic. I'm absolutely beside myself and have to prepare my kids for the worst.

Wednesday April 23rd
I had to work 3:30am-3:30pm today and I tried to stop in and see how Tashi was doing. He's just sitting up on his basking log, looking about. When I got home, I gave him his meds and then managed to give him 6ccs of baby food chicken. Then I put him in the bath. As soon as he hit the water, he dunked his head and mouth under and began drinking like mad. He's only started drinking in his bath over the last couple months, but he was ravenous today trying to get to the water. He drank a bit and then almost immediately pooped. I cleaned his bath out and then filled it up again so he could have a soak after a long day yesterday. When I put him back in the bath he suddenly freaked out and started jumping out of the water in a frenzy! The water was not too hot and I have never seen him like that! He loves his baths! I pulled him out, wrapped him in a towel and went to bring him to his viv, and he threw up again. This time there were small bits of wax worm in it. Now...he hasn't been offered any wax worms in over a week, and he has been pooping daily. Where is this coming from??

THEN! Well when I pulled him out, I saw what I thought was a piece of chicken/food on his swollen foot, but when I wiped it away it came back again. I realized he had somehow opened a wound and punctured one tiny scale and it was oozing pus. Not a ton, but enough where I think it relieved some of the pressure because he didn't mind me messing with it. I immediately called Dr. Godinez to ask her about this (and of course I took pictures too!) and she was shocked. She said she was going to give me a script for an antibiotic and some pain meds and see if that isn't what is going on. I am going to pick those up today (Thu) after I bring my kids to school. Tashi's lights arent even on yet, but last night he did climb down off his basking spot and nuzzle himself into a dark corner under his hide. He was definitely walking like that limb was hurting but I'm sure it was sore.

I'm in such a tail spin right now! I don't even want to leave the house for fear something is going to happen to him while I'm gone! If he gets through this and it ends up being a bad infection, I'm going to be the one in the hospital! This dragon is a tough cookie! Like a cat with 9 lives! I don't want to get my hopes up too much though because he could still have kidney issues. Ugh! I am beside myself right now!

Oh, by the way, kbro, I was at the Vitamin World yesterday to see what they have for bee pollen and saw the ones you mentioned above. They also had a large jar of granules, but I decided to wait until we get him settled with antibiotic and pain meds, as now he is on 4 different meds, and I don't want to add any more until I know if he will keep things down! On a side note though, Tracie could you tell us how much to give per day? I'm not sure how much is in one capsule, but perhaps it says on the bottle?

Thanks ladies for all your support! It is so comforting to know someone else understands what my family is going through! I'll keep you updated.

Jill

 

[beardie parents]

Wow, I understand how scared you are for his health. I am posting so I can find it easier to keep track of him. Only God knows what's really wrong with him, for sure. I hope he gets better soon. I hate to hear about beardies dying. There have been to much of that lately.

 

[kbro]

Oh wow, I'm such a sap I started crying. I really hope he pulls through this for you. It would help if you knew what was actually going on. I think gout can do that with the leg but I thought that usually more than one is affected and I don't know about his other symptoms. I hope Tracie has some input for you with the news about the pus from the leg.

I would be nervous about adding anything more as well since he is on all the meds. What other 2 besides the antibiotic and pain meds (Tracie might want to know all names and dosages anyways so since I got here first I thought I would ask)? Something seems to have helped get things moving for him. But I would think the bee pollen wouldn't affect too much, definitely when he is done with the antibiotics I would get something to help boost his immune system and I think the bee pollen helps with that. I strongly suggest a probiotic when done with the antibiotic as well to replace the good gut bacteria. Poor mustashio, from what I have read about him he is a fighter.

I really wish I had more knowledge of health issues so I could help more. I've been trying to research more and more but there aren't many sites or books that go in depth into health that I've found except veterinary books.

Just keep believing in him and never loose hope he can pull through and so can you. Lots of love and positive thoughts.

 

[kbro]

Wow, I understand how scared you are for his health. I am posting so I can find it easier to keep track of him. Only God knows what's really wrong with him, for sure. I hope he gets better soon. I hate to hear about beardies dying. There have been to much of that lately.

There do seem to have been quite a few. I lost Loki New year's eve suddenly. Now Deb just lost her Rubio on easter and there have been so many more.

 

[kbro]

So the best thing I do have as a book for health issues is the Merck/ Merial manual for pet health home edition but it only has so much. It says "a sick reptile should be kept at a temp near the upper limit preferred by the species to improve functioning of the immune system. Reptiles are unable to produce a true fever, but when infected with bacterial agents they move to warmer area's in their environment to create a behavioral fever."
There is more too, I will keep reading and put anything else I find might be useful.

If you don't mind, where did you get him? If you don't want to post it here please send me a private message, I'm curious.

Edit: I almost forgot they made it available online, it offers a little more info on reptile health issues, but not as much as I would like. It's still a good read and has many different animal species in there as well. http://www.merckmanuals.com/pethealth/exotic_pets/reptiles/introduction_to_reptiles.html

 

[Mustashio]

Thanks so much you guys!

I will definitely take a look at the Merck! I am a paramedic so I am pretty familiar with the "human" Merck manual and it can be very helpful!

The four meds he is on are the following...
1. Panacur (don't know the dose because the came in prefilled syringes. Only 0.3ml) The vet gave him this a month ago when he first threw up. Had a fecal done at that time and it was negative, but since he was not eating on his own, she said he was acting like he may have had some worm or parasite so we decided to treat it just in case. He had this when he was real little because he was loaded with parasites and worms from the pet store (BTW kbro, he was a PetSmart baby, but I got him at the Maplewood store. $150 in vet bills the very first month because of the worms, but PetSmart reimbursed me for all of it since he likely got it from their store) He is being given the panacur once every 2 weeks for 4 doses. He just got his 3rd of 4 doses on 4/22.

2. Reglan 3 units (.03ml) once a day to promote gastric motility. Vet said we are going to try this to help with the regurgitation and vomiting that he has been doing every so often. He doesnt vomit every time I feed him, and he poops nearly every day but we wanted to see if that would help with his vomiting.

3. Smz/Tmp oral suspension 0.2ml once a day for 14 days. I'm guessing this is the antibiotic.

4. Metacam (1.5mg/ml) Give 7 units (.07ml) once a day for pain and inflammation.

I gave him a nice bath this morning and he soaked for awhile before pooping. It softened his wound enough to get a little more pus to ooze out. He is letting me touch and push on it to get some out ever so gently and doesn't seem bothered by it but he does favor it when he walks around and he prefers to have his swollen limb bent behind him. Must be more comfortable that way. This afternoon I gave him some green beans (baby food) without using the feeding syringe, but just letting him lap it off his nose and occasional small squirt in his mouth. He seemed to like that. Oh, and I haven't yet, but I will definitely do some probiotics too. We did that last time and it definitely helps. I usually just use plain greek yogurt. Took him out to see if he wanted to walk around a bit and he was very alert and seemed eager to move to wherever he wanted to be. Its weird cuz aside from a little bit of a wiggle walk and the obvious sore on his paw he doesn't really act like he is sick...aside from not feeding himself that is! Of course he is also going through a bit of a shed to the top of his head and his eyes which I'm sure is also irritating him. Poor guy...his body has terrible timing!

I have been taking pictures and I will post them later tonight after I get back from my kiddos school event. I will keep you all updated. I truly sincerely appreciate all of your support and kind words for my fighter. He is a trooper!

Jill

 

[Mustashio]

PHOTOS

In this one you can see the difference between his front limbs. His right one is a bit more swollen. This is before the scale burst with pus.


This has been his typical urates/poo lately. Keep in mind it is in water.


Still time to cuddle...this is the day the vet told us it was likely kidney issues.


This is the day (Easter I believe) when he vomited a nearly whole hornworm that likely was in his gut for days despite daily poops. When he threw this up, I hadnt offered him hornworms in at least 5 days, let alone think he actually ate one!


Here is the first day that I noted pus coming from the burst scale on his foot. Not a lot of pus, but if I pushed his foot and flexed it like toward the ceiling, more would come out.


This was today after a little more pus was released and he had healed over a bit.


Still my handsome guy, climbing about and checking things out!

 

[beardie parents]

I'm far from an expert in medicine of any kind, but I can't help wondering if his health issues were because of the obvious infection in that foot. I hope that's all it is. Kidney issues will keep you crying for days.

 

[Drache613]

Hello Jill,

Are you going to get a blood test done on him? That would definitely help with seeing how the kidneys are functioning.
Sometimes with gout, it will start in just one area, but eventually spread. He doesn't have any other signs or symptoms of kidney issues. His eyes are swollen or other limbs aren't right now either.
The medications that you are giving should be fine for him right now. Be sure to keep him well hydrated as well as continuing with the probiotics, too. He will definitely need them now.
I am happy to hear that he was more active though. Is he still throwing up today?
You can use some antibiotic ointment on his hand to help clear that infection up, too.

Let us know how Mustachio is doing! We are all pulling for his recovery.

Tracie

 

[AHBD]

Hi Jill...I'm so sorry you're having these problems. I remember Stashi from his baby days and when you first posted as an adult that he wasn't eating on his own. I know this is tearing you up....hopefully he will get through all this. A couple of suggestions.....when he drinks in the bath, gently pull his head up before he chugs down a large amount of water. Even healthy beardies sometimes suck down too much water too quickly and the vomit it up. Just let him have a little at a time, along with a bit extra with his baby food concoction. Then I would be really leary about pain meds., if he does have a kidney problem these could add to it. He may not be in alot of pain at all, but more like discomfort.

Again, my heart goes out to you and my hope is that he gets better.! And he still looks like a very dashing dragon.

 

[kbro]

I agree about a blood test because if it happens to be gout antibiotics wouldn't help at all (right?). I believe there is a way to do a culture or some type of test on the pus at least, but the blood test and that are probably similar in price and the blood test will give you more info. I would call the vet and talk about it, if they don't want to do a test I personally would call somewhere else for a second opinion (como animal hospital in St. Paul or valley view in Burnsville have some good reptile vets, although expensive).

I am very glad he is still somewhat active and he still looks pretty alert and handsome as always.

 

[Mustashio]

The reason we didn't choose to do the blood test is because the vet told us that if it was his kidneys, there isn't anything they can do for it. When I asked if we did the test and found out it wasn't his kidneys, then what. She said then she would look at his heart. I then asked her if it was his heart if there were anything we can do about that and she said no. I do trust her and she was totally willing to do the test, but my hubby and I decided not to at that time. Keep in mind that was before the pus incident, so now I'd be interested in it perhaps if there are other options and he doesn't get cleared up a bit with the infection. I will ask her about whether or not they can culture the pus. I gave him a bath again today, and there was quite a bit more pus that came out. About 3-4 drops about the same size as the picture. It is still quite yellow. Ironically his urates have been more formed, but still a bit yellow. Perhaps the Reglan is doing some good? He did drink a bit in the bath but I didn't let him gulp too much. Then gave his meds, put some antibiotic on his wound and snuggled awhile and put him back on his basking spot. He then was really restless and looked like he was going to regurgitate, but nothing ever came up and he kept it down.

On an off topic note...my son's friend and his family had a bad fire in their house last night and it is uninhabitable so we had house guests last night. And did I mention I'm supposed to run my first 5K tomorrow and its my hubby's bday on Sunday? Yep....nothing major going on around this house! Ugh!

Will update again later today. Thanks again everybody! And thank you AHBD for all your good advice and for remembering Tashi from his younger antics. I seriously don't know what I would do without this board. You guys are absolute lifesavers!! Thank you!

 

[kbro]

Wow, you are busy and the reptile show is at the state fair this weekend if you didn't know, I put a thread in the reptile show section, there is a Amazon local deal 5 tickets for $20 I think ($8 a piece if you buy at the show). Your poor friends, what happened, was anyone hurt?

I'm glad he was able to keep things down this time, I hope that keeps up. The testing is best, otherwise if anything were to happen you may always wonder if there was something you could do, just for piece of mind. If it's something you can't do anything about you will know what you can do best for comfort care if anything. Testing the pus would only tell you if it is in fact infection where as a blood test will tell you about the kidneys, if the uric acid is high, infection present (I think) as well as other info.

 

[Mustashio]

***An UPDATE on the UPDATE!!

The swollen leg: This has pretty well cleared up completely now. A few more days of pus that then turned into more of a pasty yellow goo, and then he was okay with that. However, one day in the bath I was wiping it and the whole scale came off! It was a small hole almost and I could virtually look inside his foot! I kept up with antibiotic ointment on the wound itself and it has been fine since. Doesn't seem to bother him. Guessing the antibiotic is working. Oh, his toenail completely fell off too one day! Weird! All in one piece and there is a new little stub growing under it. What next??

The rest of the updates I will do daily cuz it is easier for me to summarize as I write down a diary of his food/poop/health every day. Here goes...

Monday 4/28
Gave meds then a soak in the bath. He seems irritated and does a thick swallow like thing that looks like he is regurgitating and then smacks his lips and licks like he is swallowing it back down. While in bath he literally dove for the water trying to drink drink drink. Even as I pulled him out he was pushing his head down trying to climb out of my hand to get to the water. Walking much better. Increased his temps at basking spot to 108-110. Fed greek yogurt, green beans and vitamins via syringe. Vet said 8-9cc's a day is fine.

Tues 4/29
No bath today, urates only in viv were very crystalized, though it was dry from being under his basking light. Gave meds and then gave 2cc of a Flukes appetite stimulent gel that I got from PetSmart. It is very gooey and brown gel.

Wed 4/30
Pooped in viv, then gave bath in afternoon and had small urates only. Took him out and let him roam while I drew up his meds. Turned around and he puked up copious amounts of blackish brown sticky liquid (? likely the appetite gel from yesterday??) There was also 3 small chunks of hornworm in the vomit again! The last hornworm he was even offered --let alone ate-- was back on 4/17! I gave him his meds later in the afternoon and he did a funky swallow thing like he looks like he is going to throw up, but then smacks and licks his lips like he swallowed it back down. I didn't dare try and feed him anything. Called the vet, she had left for the day, message for her to call me tomorrow.

Thu 5/1
I worked all day today and when I came home at 4pm there was another large puddle of brownish black vomit in his viv. No worms seen this time. I did manage to give 4cc of turkey with calcium via syringe. Vet then called back and I explained situation, and she is miffed. Said not to feed him for 24hours but to let him drink as much as he wants. Ugh! So worried about my boy.

Fri 5/2
Woke up to find another huge pile of brown puke all over his viv. On the walls, under the decorations, seeping into the cracks of the tile...a mess. Also small poop and urates on basking spot. I took Tashi out to completely clean and disinfect his viv and then he did something I have never seen him do in the entire 2 years we have had him. His beard turned jet black. Then he would like contort his body and head like he was going to puke, but never did. His eyes looked sunken and he seemed very weak. My boys (ages 7 and 12) were home from school that day and I was bawling and telling them to say goodbye because I didn't think he was going to pull through. They each cried and we held Tashi for a long time. Tashi even wiggled his way up towards my neck to try and snuggle in, still black bearding. My oldest wanted to hold him and wrapped him in a warm towel which Tashi really likes (and apparently still does!) He held him for quite awhile and his black beard disappeared! This of course made my oldest son jump for joy and perhaps gave him some false hope, as I told him we still need to know that Tashi is very sick and we could still lose him. Once I got his cage all cleaned up and put Tashi back in his viv, he shook his head violently and threw up again, though this time it was a small amount. Black beard came back for a bit then went away. I put him on his basking spot and he pretty much stayed there the rest of the night...no more vomiting, but very weak. I'd pat his head and he'd look up at me and close his eyes. He knows we're here for him. I'm just hoping he isn't suffering and trying to hold on just for us. I'm so afraid of what I will find in the morning. The boys are going out of town with my hubby so they won't be home.

Sat 5/3
I was gone most of the day and left before Tashi's lights came on but he opened one eye when I touched him on the head. When I got back home around 4pm, he was still sitting on his basking spot where I had left him. I gave him a bath and let him soak and drink, but did not dare feed him.

Sun 5/4
I worked 16hours today, and unfortunately got home after Tashi's lights were out. No food or bath today, but no vomiting either. Hasn't black bearded either that I'm aware of.

Mon 5/5
Quick bath but no poop or urates. Fed 4cc green beans + 4cc turkey mixed with liquid calcium and vitamin powder. Seems to be a bit more perky today, and I gave his meds and he seems to be keeping it down today, but no poop.

Tue 5/6
Short bath and Tashi pooped right away. Urates were all white and poop was well formed. Best poop I've seen in months! Poop was very dark and black however which may indicate possible blood? Also the dark emesis could be blood? I'm not sure...I know that is true for humans! Gave him all his meds including his last dose of Panacur (which he was given back on 3/25 cuz he was acting like worms, but had a clear fecal). He has kept things down for the last 2-3 days even with feedings so that is good. Fed him more turkey and green beans with calcium using the feeding syringe. So far so good.

Wed 5/7
Gave meds, last day of antibiotic today. Bathed and had urates only which were very white and well formed with a little yellow end. Fed him 9cc of pumpkin mixed with greek yogurt and he kept that down.

Thu 5/8
Here we go again...Tashi was black bearding a bit this morning, but was pretty alert. Gave him a bath and he kept trying to jump out. He used to love his baths and now he seems irritated by them, always jumping out. I guess I should feel blessed he has the energy to try it??? Pooped in viv with stool half black and half green but well formed. Urates nice and white with sm yellow end. Other than the black beard he seemed okay. Then when I was trying to feed him some turkey and pumpkin, I no sooner got the syringe to open his mouth when he shook his head side to side and vomited dark brown sticky fluid again. It wasn't quite as big quantity as in the past though, but still very dark. Black beard remains. He is more alert than the last time he puked though and I wrapped him in warm towel and he contorted and did the sticky swallow a bit but didn't puke again.

I just don't get this...I'm totally lost on what is going on and what to do. Worse yet, my oldest son and I are leaving to go on a school trip on Monday and we will be gone for 3 days. My hubby is very worried because he does not know how to feed Tashi with the syringe and since Tashi wont eat on his own, putting vegi's in his cage probably won't work.

WHAT DO I DO??? This is such a roller coaster! So many tears and worried stress already! My family is a wreck over this sick dragon! To top it off, this morning on the way to school the boys and I saw a bunch of crows pecking at something and chasing something. We shooed them away and found it was a baby squirrel. It didn't look in too bad of shape and we scooped it up and brought it to the Wildlife Rehab Center a few blocks away. They said the baby squirrel looked pretty good and old enough where he will probably survive this. So it was nice to help out another baby, but now we have to hope our 2yo "baby" will pull through this crazy illness.

Again, thank you to all of you who are following this post and are offering such great support and words of wisdom. All we can do still is wait and hope for the best!

Jill