Beardie won't stop rolling

[ShannyBeard]

nevermind. Just looked at the pics. again. hmmm. It's possible there was already something really wrong with him. He looks extremly small for a 5-6 month old. My 2.5 month old is bigger/fatter. Maybe look into getting a healthy and big 4-5 month old dragon?! They will have a great start at life and be a little easier to care for.

I agree. Best bet would be a breeder holdback, as they were dragons that a breeder was keeping for themselves as possible future breeding projects. You would have a shot at getting a dragon that is already healthy. Be prepared to spend a couple of hundred dollars on one, but it's WORTH IT.

I'm really concerned that you don't put a new dragon into that viv without a very thorough disinfecting. You can search the kind of disinfecting that needs to happen for coccidia, which is really hard to kill. I think Yoshi had a very high level of internal parasites all his life. Super important to avoid that problem with any new dragon you get.

What else is there? Can't MBD cause stunted growth? Are there any genetic disorders he may have been born with? I'm not being defensive, but I need/want to know if I'm doing anything wrong.

I believe 100% that internal parasites were to blame. As long as you were feeding all the protein he could eat in a 10-15 minute period, and feeding enough, then it would have to be parasites.

 

[ShannyBeard]

Was typing my reply so didn't see your second one. His fecal came back clear, but I still plan on thoroughly disenfecting everything.

Then I don't know.

 

[mistyf]

I'm not sure if I want another baby or maybe an older juvie. I do know that my next beardie won't come from the pet store. I'd like to get one from a breeder on this forum. Unless they won't sell to me after this.

 

[Claudiusx]

I'm really sorry for your loss.

But lack of vitamins and calcium alone wouldn't cause a beardie to stay so small. Not eating would keep the dragon small. Especially if the fecal came back clean.

I am glad he is no longer suffering though, and do hope to see you back around here one day with a healthy dragon when you are better ready and prepared to take care of him/her.

RIP little Yoshi.

-Brandon

 

[mistyf]

Should I assume there are no genetic disorders that could have caused his small size, since nobody is agnologing that question? I know he was eating enough. I put around 10-15 dubia in his tank twice a day, and there were usually a few left 30 minutes later. I put them in a shallow dish that he could get in but they couldn't get out. So they didn't just escape.

 

[Drache613]

Hello Misty,

I am so sorry that you lost Yoshi! I know how devastating that is.
Sometimes they can be born with genetic issues which would cause them to be smaller than they should be despite good nutrition.
Unfortunately, sometimes the only thing that can give firm answers is an autopsy.

Tracie

 

[ChiefsDaddy]

Should I assume there are no genetic disorders that could have caused his small size, since nobody is agnologing that question? I know he was eating enough. I put around 10-15 dubia in his tank twice a day, and there were usually a few left 30 minutes later. I put them in a shallow dish that he could get in but they couldn't get out. So they didn't just escape.

The only other thing I could think of is that the dragon had adenovirus and was a failure to thrive. Either way, I would double check EVERYTHING in your husbandry just to be sure. Do some searching around this forum. And don't be afraid to ask questions. That's what we're here for and why places like this exist.

 

[mistyf]

Thank you, Tracie and CheifsDaddy. I doubt I can afford and autopsy, but I will look into it. I need to know that I didn't kill him.

 

[Claudiusx]

I would be cautious about using the same vet again.

I am shocked that any knowledgeable vet would see a 6 month old, 10g dragon and only do a fecal and not ask anything else.

-Brandon

 

[ShannyBeard]

Thank you, Tracie and CheifsDaddy. I doubt I can afford and autopsy, but I will look into it. I need to know that I didn't kill him.

If you can't afford an autopsy, I would go with a post mortem adenovirus test. Is that something that is even possible to test for after they are dead? Tracie would know this answer. She has that PATS link in her signature and has that website about the testing they do in Texas. If nothing else, I would do the AV test to find out if that is what your dragon had.

There are several different schools of though on AV and enclosure disinfection. I have heard people say that you can't kill AV by routine disinfection. Can you tell I just want to burn Yoshi's old viv? lol I know I keep bringing it up, but if he had some kind of illness, it's in that enclosure.

The 10 gram weight is driving me absolutely up the wall. I keep thinking there is no chance you had an accurate fecal result. And also, what veterinarian wouldn't bring to your attention his low weight? Unless the fecal was done when he was just a few weeks old, but you said you got him at 2-3 months old. So....you took this dragon in to see a vet and he was that small and underweight and the vet never said anything? See - that makes me not trust that vet or that fecal result. :?

 

[ShannyBeard]

I would be cautious about using the same vet again.

I am shocked that any knowledgeable vet would see a 6 month old, 10g dragon and only do a fecal and not ask anything else.

-Brandon

OMG Brandon, get out of my head. lol

 

[MissT]

Should I assume there are no genetic disorders that could have caused his small size, since nobody is agnologing that question? I know he was eating enough. I put around 10-15 dubia in his tank twice a day, and there were usually a few left 30 minutes later. I put them in a shallow dish that he could get in but they couldn't get out. So they didn't just escape.

The only other thing I could think of is that the dragon had adenovirus and was a failure to thrive. Either way, I would double check EVERYTHING in your husbandry just to be sure. Do some searching around this forum. And don't be afraid to ask questions. That's what we're here for and why places like this exist.

Could have been but again, 6months old and 10 grams seems extreme for a failure to thrive adeno positive dragon.
10 - 15 small dubia per day is not nearly enough for a growing baby. This is where I think the problem lay. A parasite issue could have made him not want to eat but, ultimately, having a fecal run would have ruled that out/allowed for treatment and he would have begun eating more. I believe the calcium and vitamins contributed to his weaknesses but, overall, I think the lack of food that he was eating played a major role in what happened to him.

As Shannon suggested, you could run an av test now. It would involve swabbing his tank - you can contact Tracie if you want to do this. TBH though, I honestly dont think this was adeno related.

I am sorry for your loss but I hope that you continue to roam around the boards and do all of the research you can before adding another dragon to your family.

 

[ShannyBeard]

Mistyf, was the enclosure that you had Yoshi in a used one or did you buy it new for Yoshi?

 

[mistyf]

I will look into the adeno test, and I will be using Dr. Shackelford in the future. Yoshi's tank was used, but I cleaned it thoroughly with a bleach/water solution. I also cleaned the furnishings with the same solution. All his bowls were new. I will be disposing of this tank and starting over if the adeno test comes back positive and there's no way to kill it completely.

 

[ShannyBeard]

If you haven't already been on the beautifuldragons website, you should go check it out. This is the page on disinfectants, and it's got some really good information. http://www.beautifuldragons.com/Disinfectants.html