All he can eat buffet!

[MissCutiePatootie]

Hey guys!!!

Little over a month ago, I blessed myself with a beautiful super citrus, partial trans - 66% het hypo baby boy!

He was born on October 15, 2014. And he's starting to eat like a little piggy now! Which makes me happy! But not my wallet after the holidays! Lol.

This is him last week!

He's about 9 1/2 inches long in that picture and 31 grams. I actually need to measure him again today to see how much he's grown...

I need some cost effective tips for feeding him. He eats 2-3 meals a day and I'm all about providing variety! So far I have bought him...
500 small crickets - Only probably fed off half of them to him before they died. If that. I was constantly cleaning out the bin it felt like too.
500 small dubias - Really love dubias! But he's eating 50+ dubia a day now! Too expensive to not add variety to the mix!
100-150 medium BSFL - I really love these as well! He's a little picky about them. Tries to avoid eating the black ones but I always offer those first. A little more extra work for me as I have to rinse them off before I feed them to him every time or he won't touch them. Most of the time he will only eat roughly 10 of them before losing interest.
50ish waxworms - He loves these of course but I only give him one or two when I hold him as he does seem to have a little bit of an attitude and I'm trying to build up trust..
300ish small superworms - He likes these about as much as he likes the crickets and dubias. He eats more of the dubias/crickets than superworms though and he poops 1-3 times a day. Food seems to be moving through him constantly lol.

I hate the smell of crickets and they die off faster than I could feed them to him. But because of the money issue, I'm considering buying him another 500 crickets. I also just purchased 10 adult female dubias and 3 adult males. I'm hoping to build up my dubia colony slowly without breaking my bank! Which is another reason I want to go with crickets again so I can slow down on how much I'm feeding out of the dubia colony. I'm hoping to just keep adding to the colony every month or so until they start breeding and producing enough young for me to not have to anymore. I'm new to this though so any tips or pointers for the dubia project would be greatly appreciated!

Also, if anyone knows of some good feeder suppliers, please link them to me! I've been looking around a LOT trying to find the best bang for my buck! And if you have any suggestions about what I can do as far as his diet goes, lmk. I just wanna add that he does get a fresh salad daily and yes, he eats it on top of all the insects. Bottomless pit this one is!

Almost forgot, does anyone have any good roach chow recipes? I kind of made my own based on what I had in my cupboards and fridge. Lol I want them to eat all of what I offer them with minimal waste and gutload them with something very nutritious for my little growing one!

 

[CooperDragon]

It sounds like he's happy and well fed! You're offering a very good variety, but I definitely understand how the costs can add up. Long term, your best bet is probably to get that dubia colony built up and self sustaining. In order to do that, as you said, you may need to rely on crickets for a while as well as replenishing your roach stock now and then. I found that I was able to keep crickets alive for just about a month, not usually more. I'd order 1000 small crickets (3/8'' usually) and let them grow up in a 20g tank with mesh top living in cardboard tubes. In the winter months I found that the die off was very high until I put in an under tank heater mat. The increased temperatures (high 70s vs mid 60s) in the tank made them much happier and lively. I ordered the crickets from Premiumcrickets and I get worms from Linda's Gone Buggie. A lot of folks have different methods of feeding their bugs. I just feed my roaches leftover veggies and they seem pretty happy with that. I just replenish with fresh veggies every day or two and they go to town. Same thing with my superworms. They live in a bin of feed and I just put fresh greens on top for them every few days.

 

[MissCutiePatootie]

Thank you for responding Cooper!

I'm a little confused on what to do about the crickets :?

Last time I got a batch of 500, 3/8 inch crickets.
I kept them in a big bin with cardboard tubes and egg crates.
They were kept in my reptile room that stays at a constant 75 degrees F.
I fed them flukers cricket feed/gutloader, flukers water crystals that are also "infused" with calcium and any scraps from my dragons salad.

They still died so fast! And the smell was horrible. I wanted to just toss them many times.

Did I do something wrong with them?

I'm really not used to having to keep feeders around like this. As my other dragon of 8 years was an adult and preferred her veggies mostly.

 

[CooperDragon]

The bin and temperature sound fine to me. It could have been the gutload that did it. I've had bad luck with the flukers orange cubes in the past so I switched to feed them only veggie scraps and some of the grain based feed from PremiumCrickets along with plain water crystals for hydration. When I had problems with the gutload, it seemed like some of the crickets just died and got mushy. Other crickets looked like they were trying to grow and shed but died halfway through the shed. It's possible that something in the gutload prevents them from living for an extended period. I'd try switching the food and see if you have better luck.

 

[MissCutiePatootie]

Thanks again Cooper!

I will try feeding them the roach chow I made instead this time around.

They hardly touched the water crystals that I gave them or the gutloader.

They did eat carrots and the scraps I threw in though! But I don't like like that it wasn't demolished either. Lol I wish they just ate every last bite before I had to take it out!

 

[CooperDragon]

I've found the roaches to be MUCH better at eating all of the scraps. I usually had to remove leftovers from the cricket tank after a day or two to prevent molding. They just aren't as good as composters I suppose. Please let me know if you have better luck after switching the food out. I wouldn't expect miracles, but based on my experience, I think they should last up to a month or so with maybe 30%ish die off.

 

[MissCutiePatootie]

Okie dokie! I will keep you posted for this next batch! Thank you for all your help thus far!

 

[thundersmommy]

I order my dubias from kfcfeeders. They came packaged well, with overcount. From the prices I have seen they seem to be the most reasonable. I've had them about a month now (ordered 2000, plus some XL ones to start the breeding process soon) and they are all healthy and alive.

I throw in some dog food for them and water crystals. Then I will put in some veggies as well. By the next day all the veggies are gone! I feel like I feed them as much as I do my dragons, but its worth it. I have seen an impressive growth in both my beardies since doing so.

Here is their link:
http://www.kfcfeeders.net/

HTH

 

[RedRoseVertigo0]

I ordered my dubia roaches from dubiaroaches.com. Great prices, shipping and customer service. The roaches arrived a day late, thanks USPS, but there was no die off. I just ordered another shipment and a breeding pair. They also come with a huge bag of roach chow, for free, that lasts for months. I also feed my dubia's veggie scraps.

 

[MissCutiePatootie]

Thanks for the suggested feeder suppliers guys! I did get the 10 female 3 male dubia I ordered. 25 females and 6 males were in the box! That was a nice surprise.

I have not had any success breeding them yet. I have witnessed courtship though! But a couple females dropped their oothecas.

I've started ordering my feeders from Daniel Morales who runs Godfather Feeders I believe it's called? I just ordered 1k small dubia and 30-35 hornworms and 30-35 silkworms for $58.99 shipped. I've read good things about him so I'm looking forward to seeing how my bugs come! He was kind enough to throw in a couple adults to help me get started with my own dubia colony by adding unrelated genes to mine too.

Dubiaroaches.Com is awesome! I ordered 600 BSFL when they were on sale for 20 bucks. I haven't bought any dubia from them though. I will have to so I can try their free roach chow! Thanks for telling me!

I have not tried KFCfeeders. I'll keep them in mind too. Seems like most people are out of stock in bulk purchases though. I'm glad I found someone who I was able to buy bulk from!

Thanks again everyone!

 

[coffeesnob]

Thank you for responding Cooper!

I'm a little confused on what to do about the crickets :?

Last time I got a batch of 500, 3/8 inch crickets.
I kept them in a big bin with cardboard tubes and egg crates.
They were kept in my reptile room that stays at a constant 75 degrees F.
I fed them flukers cricket feed/gutloader, flukers water crystals that are also "infused" with calcium and any scraps from my dragons salad.

They still died so fast! And the smell was horrible. I wanted to just toss them many times.

Did I do something wrong with them?

I'm really not used to having to keep feeders around like this. As my other dragon of 8 years was an adult and preferred her veggies mostly.

I noticed that when i sprinkle meal worms with calcium they die really quickly perhaps crickets do the same :? although some veggies contain calcium perhaps they can not tolerate it in its raw concentrated form. I am just wondering why there is a need to add calcium to the diet if we are feeding calcium rich foods :?

 

[Taterbug]

Calcium isn't as important to insects as to vertebrates, excess calcium in the diet long term is associated with higher mortality and poor reproduction. My insects will avoid high calcoum foods like collard greens, though the greens also have other compounds that could be a deterent as well.

I've not had insects die from the supplement powders but insects breath through holes in their bodies so perhaps if those get clogged they could die from it.

The water gel foods/supplelemts are not effective for food or calcium. They are mostly water by a huge amount (don't have he numbers rigt now) and even many of the dry foods are ineffective. I'd only use chows as a maintinence food for my breeding colony, not my feeders. Many vendors don't report the contents (proprietary e.e) and I havn't seen analysis of them or trials to show they are effective gut loads. For feeding my breeders in a pinch I'll use alfalfa pellets or frozen overstock produce.

For my feeders I opt for fresh veggies, no grains or animal/pet food.

Unfortunately even the highest calcium veggies we offer are not enough to offset how little calcium insects naturally have, and a diet exclusively of those veggies is not healthy. Dusting and gut loading helps to this end. Most common gutloading practices only supllement the nutrient content though (fresh veggies etc) There are diet formulas that can bring insects to an acceptable 1:1 ca ratio, but you'd want to research carefully before having high expectations.