1000 Phoenix Worms Decomposed

[Seifer]

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Hello Everyone,

Last week I bought a starter kit (100 phoenix worms) to see how much my beardie would like them... Well let's just say he went through them all in a matter of a day pretty much.

So this Monday(24th) I ordered 1000 and unfortunately unlike the last package I received they were already DECOMPOSING! I opened the containers and I almost threw up due to the fowl stench. I have emailed Phoenix Worms but due to me getting ready to move I could not email them as soon as possible. I am hoping they will still do a replacement considering I had emailed them a little after the five hour limit they give us.

I kept watching for USPS and upon arrival I grabbed them, they were in the mailbox for a very minimal amount of time. Also to my dismay unlike the starter kit there was barely any mulch.

Also on the USPS box in small letters it states "Please keep cool", I'm sorry but for live feeders that just seems unacceptable. I'm hoping Phoenix Worms will go by there word and send a replacement otherwise I will never do business with them again.

 

[Claudiusx]

They don't look like anything is wrong with them to me... At least not from the pictures alone.
Now, I don't know what exactly they feed their BSFL over at Phoenix worms, but they are magots, and basically eat compost, so you can't really expect them to smell too good.

Are they moving and active?

-Brandon

 

[Seifer]

The starter kit i received they did not smell at all, they weren't grey looking either. I've had them sitting on my counter in a house that is 76 degrees inside. They have not moved at all some of them even had white blobs on them that covered a 1/3 of their body which from what i read is the bacteria.

I understand mistakes happen but I've been waiting for this order. My beardie will not touch crickets so the past two days I've fed him wax worms and baby food. I don't want to have to feed him wax worms much longer due to the high fat content but I don't know what else to do cus he will not touch crickets at all and all i find at pet stores are wax worms, superworms(which he isnt big enough yet) and dead reptiworms.

 

[Seifer]

Well, already received a response and I will no longer be doing business with Phoenixworms.com

They stated due to their policy they can not replace the worms. Even though their location on monday where they shipped Phoenix worms(Tifton, G) was also over 85 degrees.I'm so disappointed because those were going to be used as the primary source for feeding.

I know they were dead way prior to arrival due to the stench.

 

[Claudiusx]

Sorry that you are disappointed. Are you sure you can't still feed off what you have?

You could always try out reptiworms too and see if you have a better experience.

-Brandon

 

[Seifer]

They smell very bad I would be afraid to even feed these to my beardie. Quite honestly I wouldn't want any animal or even another bug to eat these.

I've heard rumors that Petco and Petsmart can order Reptiworms to their stores is this true?

 

[Claudiusx]

Im sure, but why go through a middle man? They have to make a profit too. You can get them much cheaper just buying them from the reptiworms site.

http://www.reptiworms.com/24-large-reptiworms.html?sid=5gi9crh7qgp9a00o5l043nkov7

-Brandon

 

[Dr. Phoenix]

Like other producers of live insects, we publish the terms of our live guarantee on our website. In addition, the following information is prominently posted beside each item that is sold on the order page:

IMPORTANT SHIPPING INFORMATION: Please check the weather forecast for your area before submitting an order. We cannot guarantee live arrival if your daytime temps are below 35 or above 85 degrees. However, if you want your package held at the post office for customer pickup, please tell us this on the "special instructions" page of the order and we will label accordingly. Note: We cannot be responsible if the post office fails to hold the package. Please read "Our Policies" for terms of our live arrival guarantee.

The temperature at Seifer's location today was 108*F. He did not choose to pick up his package at the post office and his worms did not survive riding in a mail truck for 5+ hours. Mail trucks and mailboxes become like an oven when outside temps exceed 85*F. That is why we post shipping guidelines prominently.

We are not happy when a customer has a bad experience and we always try to resolve issues as needed. However, we cannot assume responsibility for a bad outcome when a customer completely ignores posted weather guidelines.

Craig Sheppard, Ph.D.
President, Insect Science Resource LLC
Emeritus, University of Georgia
http://www.phoenixworm.com

 

[skateanddonate]

I got my intro order today. I was worried about them because we are in the middle of a heat wave. High today was 117°. I was sweating the 3 days of shipping across country. They arrived in good shape although there was a smell in the box, but I couldn't find any dead ones in the container.

I have a PO box and picked them up this morning as soon as they opened. Meaning the truck comes from Vegas, 75 miles away, so when tracking said they had arrived at my post office I went and asked the lady to look for the box rather than wait till 1pm when all the mail has to be sorted. Stupid because the post office was actually cooler than my house.

I thought higher temperatures in the 90° range NOT 100+ makes them grow?

I am worried about the lack of compost on the larger orders.

Was the compost dumped out before you took the photos?

How are the large orders shipped? Meaning are they divided into the same size containers? Or are a larger number than 100 all in the same container?

I'm wondering if lack of compost would contribute to lack of moisture killing them in the 3 day priority mail shipping time if the 1000 are all bunched together?

This is the second post I've seen about bacteria and am nervous, but want to order more because crickets just can't stand the heat to be shipped--even overnight.

Given the different nutritional value of Phoenix worms vs crickets, does that mean you can feed less worms than crickets?

 

[nmcnick]

I got my intro order today. I was worried about them because we are in the middle of a heat wave. High today was 117°. I was sweating the 3 days of shipping across country. They arrived in good shape although there was a smell in the box, but I couldn't find any dead ones in the container.

I have a PO box and picked them up this morning as soon as they opened. Meaning the truck comes from Vegas, 75 miles away, so when tracking said they had arrived at my post office I went and asked the lady to look for the box rather than wait till 1pm when all the mail has to be sorted. Stupid because the post office was actually cooler than my house.

I thought higher temperatures in the 90° range NOT 100+ makes them grow?

I am worried about the lack of compost on the larger orders.

Was the compost dumped out before you took the photos?

How are the large orders shipped? Meaning are they divided into the same size containers? Or are a larger number than 100 all in the same container?

I'm wondering if lack of compost would contribute to lack of moisture killing them in the 3 day priority mail shipping time if the 1000 are all bunched together?

This is the second post I've seen about bacteria and am nervous, but want to order more because crickets just can't stand the heat to be shipped--even overnight.

Given the different nutritional value of Phoenix worms vs crickets, does that mean you can feed less worms than crickets?

If you get the 1000 pack, it is divided into 500 per "box", so you get two "boxes". I'd still feed as much or more worms than crickets especially if you get mediums since they are usually smaller, but that's just me.

 

[Seifer]

I thought higher temperatures in the 90° range NOT 100+ makes them grow?

I am worried about the lack of compost on the larger orders.

I live in Arizona as well, so it was hot out, but the sample order I first received the Phoenix Worms were completely fine and almost full with composite. None of them had bacteria either but when ordering 1000 from them I ran into issues as stated above

Was the compost dumped out before you took the photos?

I opened the box and the composite was already all the way that low. I did not want to dump them to see how much composite was in there but I can tell you 500 in each container they definitely all couldn't get under the composite. I think this is a large reason as to why they died, the only thing I did was open the containers almost vomited due to the stench and then took pics. So how you see it in the pics is how I got it.

I'm wondering if lack of compost would contribute to lack of moisture killing them in the 3 day priority mail shipping time if the 1000 are all bunched together?

There is two containers with 500 in each, I am betting due to the lack of composite was the cause of death because like I said the first sample order I received i had to actually dig with my finger to find them.

This is the second post I've seen about bacteria and am nervous, but want to order more because crickets just can't stand the heat to be shipped--even overnight.

Given the different nutritional value of Phoenix worms vs crickets, does that mean you can feed less worms than crickets?

You feed as many as your bearded dragon will eat, Black soldier fly larvae alone is so much better for your bearded dragon due to the nutrition vs the lack there of in crickets. I still don't believe the way Phoenix Worms handled the situation was correct so I will no longer support them. I would actually suggest you to order through reptiworms.com same type of worm just a different diet.

If you get the 1000 pack, it is divided into 500 per "box", so you get two "boxes". I'd still feed as much or more worms than crickets especially if you get mediums since they are usually smaller, but that's just me.

I'm not sure if your talking boxes as in per se usps or the containers but if your talking about the boxes I only received 1 with 2 containers stacked in together and 1 piece of crumpled up newspaper to keep them from moving.


Also just to note I filed a dispute through paypal, I'm not sure what the seller told paypal but paypal ended up refunding what I was charged. So I would also suggest if you do continue to order, order through paypal so if you end up with dead worms and the seller doesn't want to negotiate at least on a replacement or partial refund then you can dispute the action. Using temperature guidelines as a policy just doesn't seem right, I'm sorry but during the summer what state isn't above 85 degrees?

Also considering the fact that Georgia gets hotter then 85 degrees also very humid during the summer then I'm just unsure how a company can use that as a policy. The unfortunate thing is Phoenix Worms lost a customer that was willing to only buy their feeders as a staple, so rather then offering at least one replacement and earn money from me in the future they decided to point fingers automatically at me so now they have lost future business as well as the money I paid in the first place due to paypal siding with me.

Very Respectfully,

Seifer

 

[Claudiusx]

I don't really think it was right to file a dispute with paypal.

It mentions very clearly about temperatures on the site but you decided to order anyways. That should be on you, not the company.

-Brandon

 

[skateanddonate]

It is the lack of response from the company, that is keeping me from ordering more. I mean if they replied to my questions I would be satisfied.

However, they defended themselves. Then left it at word of mouth. Rather than answer the questions of a concerned prospective buyer.

Honestly, the customer service at most of the feeder distributors is not good.

 

[nmcnick]

Sorry, 1000 per box, 500 per container. For some reason was having a hard time thinking of the right word, sorry bout the confusion.

 

[ashleyelsha]

I always had my phoenix and reptiworms held at the post office, and I called the post office prior and let them know I was expecting something that needed to be kept out of the heat.

That being said, one of my orders of phoenix worms that I picked up from the post office was all rotten just as you described. The smell was awful, and I am a nurse, so I can tolerate a LOT of bad smells, but it made me gag. When I emailed phoenix worms and explained that they had been held at the post office I got a replacement of healthy phoenix worms mailed out to me and they were all good.


EDIT- also note that I live in florida and it is very hot here.

I would also like to mention that when i ordered from reptiworms i did not have them held at the post office and they sat in my mailbox all day because I forgot I had ordered them and they were all very active with no odor whatsoever. So you might want to give reptiworms a try.

Also be aware that most feeders won't guarantee live arrival when it is this hot.