Young dragon starts eating

[Duriel]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqkqvxi-S2g
Poor little guy (or gal?) spent most of the first two days hiding and refusing food. Then I moved him into a rubbermaid to feed (since his enclosure has somewhat offset slate tiles and they crawl under them). This clip only shows 2 because I started recording near the end of the frenzy. He ate 18 and then lost interest. Still doesn't like greens, even when I let some crickets munch on them in front of him. Just snatched the crickets. HOPEFULLY my 1000 baby dubia roaches show up tomorrow at my door, as I am getting tired of crickets. I also have 2 american toads, 3 common cricket treefrogs, 3 firebellied toads, 5 juvenile bullfrogs, and a puppy to feed (not bugs though, of course). I want to set a small slick bowl in his enclosure (and my many frogs') with roaches and just let him decide when to eat, in the comfort and privacy of his own little home. 20G long for now, as he is only about 6-7 inches. Drawing up plans for a 4'x'2'x2 or maybe 5'x'2'x2' that I will build a stand for (planning on wood doors down below to hold all supplies related to him out of sight). I am going to cut holes for a UVB and basking light and rig up a small near silent fan with 2 vents for ventilation. Even with a screen lid it seems to smell a bit stagnant in there, clean as it may be.

half of his current digs. Other side has a food bowl and half log (synthetic, as I had problems with real wood molding in my toad tank). Measured temps at the top of the basking area with an infrared laser thermometer. Initially, they were about 120, but my fixture has a dimmer switch (on 100W bulb) and I got it stable at 110 (less if he goes further down). Surface temps on slate tiles on basking side about 90, about 80 on cold side. For the moment the whole thing holds at 75 at night, but it may require some adjustment in winter.

I almost was going to get an Iguana, then I saw how hard it is to socialize them. Also spending more on a pet's food than I do on myself is a no go, and I read that I basically have to get it its own room when it's full grown, so no thanks.

 

[bunnyrut]

yay! it takes them a while to get used to new surroundings, but s/he will be devouring food in no time.

if the little one can't jump you can just leave the screen off. i use a lamp stand and clamps to hold the bulbs in place.

it shouldn't smell in there at all. the only thing that ever smelled were the crickets and the poop, and the poop didn't smell once it was cleaned.
what do you use to clean with? a vinegar/water mixture does great with disinfecting.

I almost was going to get an Iguana, then I saw how hard it is to socialize them. Also spending more on a pet's food than I do on myself is a no go, and I read that I basically have to get it its own room when it's full grown, so no thanks.

i had an iguana. i loved my little Iggy. i had to move and wasn't allowed to take him with me
the only reason i haven't gotten another one was because of how big they get. as long as they are handled everyday they are pretty mild tempered. although mine hated dogs...

 

[Duriel]

I've had him almost 3 days and he pooped twice (must be from eating well before I got him from a small pet store that had him in with 1 sibling, repticarpet, greens, UVB, basking light etc. They seemed to actually care, unlike petco with their wood chip substrate, adult crickets, and used to be 6, but now 2 emaciated dragons. Maybe they were adopted, but my guess is they died, as every 2nd-3rd time I go in there for crickets, there's a dead amphibian or reptile being devoured by crickets). Both poops were on the basking rock/cave thing (which is porous.. so I had to remove it to clean... I must be more careful in future though, as I put a pretty nasty scratch into the glass with this thing, which means when this guy graduates to a larger home, this 20G will never hold water.. can't risk a deuce bigalow moment).

It just smells kind of stale, like lack of air cycling. I turned my ceiling fan on and it seems to have dissipated. Or maybe I just got used to it. For example, my puppy is only about 12 weeks old and still has to urinate every 30-60 minutes. When I'm asleep or not home, I put her in a cage (she eats the carpet and my duplex is about 6 months old.. needs to remain perfect for me to get my deposit back). She ends up going in the cage and then laying in it, so for the moment I have to bathe her and clean the cage daily. She will typically avoid pooping in there for 8-10 hours, so that's a plus, especially because I saw tapeworm segments (which I was previously unaware were capable of individual movement... look kinda like moving flat noodles... speaking of which, never making flat noodles again) in her poop the other day (gave her the pill for it, but not sure how long it'll take to clear up). Anyways, I clean my enclosures with diluted bleach and rinse well. It's worked out great for 4 different species of frog (nothing fancy; see sig) and they are more sensitive to pollution.

He still has pronounced stress marks, but spends his time on the top of the rock looking up at the basking light with his eyes closed. Caught him lifting a leg for a few sec every so often. Is this normal behavior or should I dial down the temp a few degrees? As I said, the hottest point (not area, just the very tip) of the basking area is 110, decreasing steadily as you move the gun down. Because he is currently ignoring greens and won't touch a small water dish, I've been bathing him every day and misting him with water in the mornings. He doesn't lick it off his snout though. Some pools in the imperfections of the slate and he casually licks at it. He's still a little twitchy. I can handle him and he'll creep along my arm (tasting my arm hair.. for whatever reason). I don't let him go to my shoulder though, as I had him resting in my lap yesterday and he suddenly spazzed out and jumped to the floor. I was sitting so it was only about a foot and a half and it was carpet. He seemed fine, but I will be more cautious from now on.

I think I will remove the screen (lamp came with a clamp) as he seems unwilling or incapable of jumping that high. I'm mostly concerned about fire, as the lamp is discoloring the mesh on the lid. It's a halogen bulb and according to my temp gun, reaches almost 200 degrees at the bulb socket (when I move it, I have to turn it off and hold it by the cord or I will burn myself for sure. On an unrelated note, I picked up a canister filter system for my bullfrogs, as the tank hanging ones seem to dislike anything that's not a full aquarium... messy little buggers they are!

 

[bunnyrut]

It just smells kind of stale, like lack of air cycling.

i am not sure what is causing that, maybe try smelling different items in the viv to see if something is retaining the scent. i've put oatmeal in a stocking and put it in the viv. it absorbs the moisture and reduces the humidity. it also absorbs the smell, which means it will start to smell after a while.

He still has pronounced stress marks, but spends his time on the top of the rock looking up at the basking light with his eyes closed. Caught him lifting a leg for a few sec every so often. Is this normal behavior or should I dial down the temp a few degrees?

as a baby, he will keep those stress marks for a while. they start to lighten up after a few months, but it's normal.
if he has his toes up in the air that means the surface is hot.
if he is moving his arm in a circle that's arm waving, babies and submissive adults do this.

Because he is currently ignoring greens and won't touch a small water dish, I've been bathing him every day and misting him with water in the mornings. He doesn't lick it off his snout though.

very few dragons actually drink out of the dish. the mistings and baths will keep him hydrated, plus they get water from their food. you could probably just get rid of the dish unless you want to try to train him to use it. some lay in it, others poop in it, lol.
for the greens, some breeders say they drop pieces in the viv when they are feeding crickets. this usually makes the beardies think it is live food and go after it.

He's still a little twitchy. I can handle him and he'll creep along my arm (tasting my arm hair.. for whatever reason). I don't let him go to my shoulder though, as I had him resting in my lap yesterday and he suddenly spazzed out and jumped to the floor. I was sitting so it was only about a foot and a half and it was carpet. He seemed fine, but I will be more cautious from now on.

yeah, they are fast little buggers! the slow down (or rather, get lazy) when they get bigger. i've only been able to handle them for minutes at a time at that age. I've stood in the middle of the room while Mr Dargon ran all over my arms and up and down my back.
holding him in your hand in the viv is always safe, he can't get far if he runs!

 

[Duriel]

The dish is one of those fancy looking plastic rock water dishes you get from pet stores. Had an extra one for whatever reason so I cleaned it and he inherited it. Been using it to hold greens (but initially I had basically a forest of them in it... will use less as he so far is ignoring them). Going to test it out as a roach container when they get here (hopefully tomorrow... they shipped Monday and I don't know how well they tolerate shipping. A cold front in the area has brought night temps down to around 60). The side slope almost straight up and it's about 1/2" deep (roaches bought are <1/2" nymph dubias) and feels slick to me, but may have pores I can't see that they could dig into. Either way, I've got some small stainless bowls I KNOW they won't climb out of. I'm just hoping to get a use out of this water dish (the toad tank already has 2... 1 for each toad. When the 3rd was in there, they would just dirty it up and not really soak, so it was just more daily cleaning for me. Bleh) I wish he'd poop in the water dish. Much easier to clean than his basking rock/cave thing.

(Image was taken vertically with an iphone, then rotated 90 degrees as for some reason all iphone pics show up rotated on my comp. Let me know if it appears vertical or not.. sometimes it will display vertical, sometimes 90 degrees off. I have no idea why)

Yeah I will dial the temp down another hair tomorrow (he's lights out for the night, nuzzled up in the small cave) and see how he finds 105 degrees peak (tip top of the rock) temp (current is 110). It definitely doesn't look like waving; more like a little too toasty. He must be on the razor's edge of comfort though, as he only seems mildly displeased with it and has no discoloration or anything on his hands.

 

[Duriel]

Got my dubias today. As far as I can tell, none of the 1070 died, but I didn't shake out the newspaper ball they were living in... because... ONE THOUSAND SEVENTY. Hard enough getting them to let go and shake into my bowls.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BA32irv9z_M
He ate 19/20 (the 20th used him as a ladder and hid under a tile.. I'll fish him out tomorrow as Fridays are the day I clean every tank out anyway). Going to feed him again in about an hour and see if he finishes another 20 or gets full. The toad tank didn't fare as well with a dish. The obese toad noticed it first and ate them all (didn't count... but it was more than 20). I guess I'll be letting them roam in the tank for the toads. Not sure about the bullfrogs. I nestled the dish into the dirt on their land side, but I don't think they can see below them (it's how I sneak up to take pics... otherwise they see me and hide). We'll see if the count goes down (must be 40 or so in there... 4 growing bullfrogs. The 5th died, which I expected as she had already absorbed her tail but was 1/3 the size of the others, 2 of which still had a nub). I'm hoping they find them, as they have some mondo grass that bugs like to hide in, so roaches roaming probably won't work out. The firebellied toads responded well when I moved them from their hiding spots so they were facing the dish.

As an aside, are roaches as dumb as crickets when it comes to water? I could probably let them roam the bullfrog tank if they don't try to reenact The Happening like the crickets do (seriously awful movie btw).

 

[Drache613]

Moved by Moderator from General to Feeding

 

[Duriel]

Sleeping with head tucked into a small opening. The flash on my camera makes him appear to have vivid coloring, but he is pretty standard. Never had much interest in "breeds", as they seem to just add cost.

He has gotten very fat from a heavy diet of dubia roaches and 5 waxworms the other day as a treat. Still ignores anything that isn't meat.