Strange "gulping" (Pneumonia)

[MikeN]

Hi Tracie,

I think the ear looks more or less normal now, but there is definitely a swollen ball in his mouth, where the jaws meet. I'll try to take a picture tomorrow, he is sleeping now, and he actually had a good day, nice and quiet, he ate well, and did not display any signs of discomfort other than occasional gulping. I now think that it's been related all along - his trouble swallowing, head shakes, all that...
And yes, his eyes look good, and in fact, if I didn't see the growth in his mouth today, I'd almost think he's back to how he was before it all started.
Is an abscess in the mouth a big problem? Is it easily curable? And what could cause it?

 

[Drache613]

Hello Mike,

Yes, some pictures would be helpful. I don't see that in our dragons, or not that I have noticed. If it is an abscess, then we need to get that taken care of quickly. Where is it located, in the back of his throat or on the gum area?
Things that cause abscesses are sometimes immune system suppression, an injury to the mouth of some type, or cancer related or other viral related problems.
I hope he is doing well today!
At least he seems to be in good spirits!

Tracie

 

[MikeN]

Hi Tracie and all,

I'll be posting updates every other day now, just not to clog the forum too much
Our visit to the new vet went well I think - aside from it costing me $200+ again The vet seems knowledgeable and thorough. He said Leo has stomatitis, (and not too much actually), but no abscess, so he prescribed some Baytril-based ointment to put on his jaws daily. I can not vouch for sure, but from what I saw in his mouth while feeding him today, the swollen tissue seems either gone, or greatly reduced. We are also back on Baytril for 30 more days, but only every other day now. I am finishing up what was left from the last course, and then will be giving him what the vet said is the same medicine that is normally given by injections, except I am to give it 0.15ml every other day orally. They also gave Leo some vitamin shots - A/D mix and B in two separate shots. Some interesting info I learned is it is best not to inject reptiles on the tail or any other lower parts, as the drug goes straight into their kidneys then, which is not good for them. So he injected Leo on the upper back, where his shoulders meet, and it bled a little, which they used to check his blood sugar, as the previous test seemed high. But it was normal this time, so diabetes has been ruled out.
Overall, the vet thought Leo was in good condition, he just needs to have his immune system boosted to get rid of any sickness for good. So we may be going in for more vitamin shots in a week or so.
And today he looked great, was very alert and active, walked a lot, and licked his mix well, but he still prefers to hide in the back and be hand-fed, as opposed to eating himself. I exchanged the Zilla fixture for Reptisun 10.0 and started using it today.
The vet also said that soaking would help a lot with stomatitis, but Leo still freaks out in the tub, so I decided to do it every 2-3 days, and in very shallow water, and substitute the fluids orally as much as I can. I guess the worst is behind us, I just can't wait till he's able to eat by himself again and wonder what I could do to help.

 

[Drache613]

Hello Mike,

Well, that is great he seems to be doing better now.
Make sure you continue to give the probiotics as long as he is on the Baytril so it isn't too hard on his system. At least it was caught in time before it became a systemic infection. He should be perfectly fine with some TLC now.
Try getting some bee pollen to help his immune system.
I feel the lighting most likely contributed to the initial problems, but he should be able to pull out of it pretty soon. It sounds like he is doing pretty well right now.
The vitamin shots should be good for him, to help boost his immune system. The best area to give shots is the upper arm & the hamstring area. That is good his blood sugar was normal this time.
I hope Leo responds well under the Reptisun 10 tube bulb & regains his strength soon. Go slowly with the baths & maybe he will become more comfortable in the water.

Tracie

 

[MikeN]

Hi Tracie,

We took some photos of the strange growth in Leo's mouth, which is unfortunately not gone, I guess I just didn't look closely the last time. I am posting them here as well as direct links, because the forum seems to re-size higher resolution photos:

Direct links:
http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm278/bx-me/growth1.jpg
http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm278/bx-me/growth2.jpg

It looks a little yellower in real life, I wonder if it's pus-filled. I reread the description of stomatitis (mouth rot) at beautifuldragons.com and his refusing to eat or drink by himself seems to check out. Please look and see what you think of it.

Otherwise, he seems perkier and if it wasn't for this growth and not eating, I'd almost think he is completely healthy. He ate sweet pea pods for the first time in his life today and loved them, and he stayed at his basking spot (after being put there after the sun outside) for quite some time, and he walks more or less normally now, no longer pulling himself along.

 

[Drache613]

Hello Mike,

How is he doing?
That is very odd in his mouth. However, I wouldn't classify it as mouth rot though, it looks much different than that. Is it hard or soft to the touch, or can you tell?
So, overall he is doing pretty well & is active?
Is he eating anything right now?


Tracie

 

[MikeN]

Hi Tracie and all,

I haven't posted in a few days, mainly because there hasn't been much to post. Leo seems overall improved, no more gasping for air, very little gulping other than when being fed and swallowing food, but still not eating on his own and mostly hiding behind the tree. He eats well enough when hand-fed and seems to have no problem swallowing. Still a little bit of that strange "suckling" when given water. He didn't freak out at all during his bath today, and I actually saw him stick his face in the water and apparently drink. I kept the water low enough as not to get into his ears though.

Unfortunately, I cannot tell if the lump in his mouth is hard or soft, but it seems slightly different now - darker and narrower (?) - as if it shrank a bit, but still too early to tell if there's any real improvement. Now, I wanted to ask about mouth rot - regardless of that lump, there seems to be some of that whitish cheesy stuff on the teeth close to that lump. It seems small and thin, so I have a hard time figuring if it's indeed those "plaques" that beautifuldragons.com describes, but if it is, how do I tell, and remove them?

We finally ran out of the original Baytril, and started the new batch, which is the injectable kind, but the vet prescribed to give 0.15ml of it orally every other day. I guess we'll see how it works. Actually, I am starting to wonder if/how will we know to stop? Another x-ray? More blood tests?