Sick Beardie Mystery - Call Dr. House

[vonedaddy]

I will try to make this long story short.

About two months ago my 4 year old beardie (Dax) started to lose his appetite. I thought it was burmation even though it was later than normal. When he gets ready for burmation he usually stops eating for a day or two then retires to his hide and does his thing for a month or so. This time he stopped eating, but never retired. He stayed awake, though lethargic. I tried different things like changing his diet up to get him to eat.

I started to get concerned when he started losing weight and you can see the bones in the base of his tail.

1st Vet visit - 5-6 weeks ago:
Vet did bloodwork, stool sample, etc and could not find anything conclusion. Slightly high calcium levels, slight dehydration, but nothing more. Gave me an antibiotic (Fortaz 200mg/ml) to inject him with 0.06 mls every 3 days for 30 days (10 injections). He also gave me some high calorie food to syringe feed him with.

2nd Vet visit - 3 weeks ago:
After syringe feeding him (it is always a fight), bathing him every other day for hydration, and raising the night time temps for 2 week it looks like he gained a bit of weight back, but still will only eat the occasional horn worm. Still very lethargic and only occasionally moves around after a bath or some handling.

3rd Vet visit *diffenrent vet - 1 week ago:
They cannot find anything wrong still and told me to stay the course.

Husbandry:
I have a 6x2x3 enclosure. Around 82 degrees on cool side, 90 on the warm side, and around 97-100 at the basking spot. I have a 4 foot HO T5 bulb under the bottom of the lid and a high intensity solar glo UVA/UVB over the basking spot.

At this point I have spent over $700 on vet visits and seeing no improvement. I am hoping someone here can give me some pointers. I really can't afford another vet visit.

Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[KarrieRee]

I would ditch the solar glo UVA/UVB over the basking spot and get a regular bright white basking bulb - and make sure your taking basking temps w/ a digital probe thermometer and make sure the T 5 is approx 12-15 inches from the basking decor piece and the bulb is not old meaning over 12 months old --- start w/ the lighting and the basking temps first - since every thing else has been ruled out from your vet it sounds like -- I am not a fan of All in Ones and I know distance will play a key in that what wattage is the bulb and how old is the Solar Glo - I think I have heard they were good bulbs but like I said I am not real savvy on them - I know some others on here are -- tell us what the distance is and what the wattage is and see if that could be the issue here -- but me I would go to a regular bright white basking bulb ---
Karrie

 

[vonedaddy]

The HO t5 is about 28 inches from the floor and about 15 from the highest point of the basking spot.

The SolarGlo is an 80W and its abut 10 inches from the basking spot directly under it.

What basking bulb do you recommend?

Here is a pic of the enclosure:

 

[KarrieRee]

How are you taking basking temps? No stick ons they are inaccurate--?
Karrie

 

[vonedaddy]

I have a infrared gun for checking basking temp and I have two thermometers on the back wall for ambient temps.

This is the gun I have:
https://smile.amazon.com/Etekcity-Lasergrip-Thermometer-Temperature-Non-contact/dp/B00DMI62HM/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=infrared+heat+gun&qid=1588700576&sr=8-2

 

[KarrieRee]

Yep good gun so your getting basking temps w/ that---- ok so we need some others to give you some ideas of what could be wrong-- Tracie would be the one to advise she's our vet mod on here- if you have the vet visits copies of blood work etc post them she can help
Karrie

 

[vonedaddy]

Yep good gun so your getting basking temps w/ that---- ok so we need some others to give you some ideas of what could be wrong-- Tracie would be the one to advise she's our vet mod on here- if you have the vet visits copies of blood work etc post them she can help
Karrie

I don't have them, but I will call and see if they can email it to me in the morning. They are closed now.

Thanks so much!

 

[AHBD]

Hi there, can you post a few good body shots of Dax ? To show his body condition because they can go off food at times without actually being sick. The Solar glo is not the problem, I've used them as well as Powersun bulbs, they don't cause any problems unless too close using a high watt. Yours is only 80. I would possibly suspect that your t5 bulb is kind of far away and is possibly getting older. BTW, is your t5 a Reptisun or Arcadia ? Because there was a thread a while ago that claimed that some
Reptisun t5's were putting out very weak uvb. They were either silver tipped ends from a certain batch or gold tipped. Other than that it might just be a mood right now, at times they just go through these stages. Sorry you spent so much money, especially on injections of antibiotics when there was no reason for those.

 

[vonedaddy]

Hi there, can you post a few good body shots of Dax ? To show his body condition because they can go off food at times without actually being sick. The Solar glo is not the problem, I've used them as well as Powersun bulbs, they don't cause any problems unless too close using a high watt. Yours is only 80. I would possibly suspect that your t5 bulb is kind of far away and is possibly getting older. BTW, is your t5 a Reptisun or Arcadia ? Because there was a thread a while ago that claimed that some
Reptisun t5's were putting out very weak uvb. They were either silver tipped ends from a certain batch or gold tipped. Other than that it might just be a mood right now, at times they just go through these stages. Sorry you spent so much money, especially on injections of antibiotics when there was no reason for those.

I have an arcadia and it's fairly new. It was purchased on Feb 16th (from pangea) and installed shortly after.

Here are some pics of Dax. I had to wake him up so he is a little grumpy. I tried to capture the base of him tail which looks really skinny to me. THANKS SO MUCH FOR ALL AND ANY INPUT!

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[AHBD]

Yeah, he is pretty thin , not incredibly but it is a concern that he's not eating. It will be helpful to post the blood tests, hopefully the glucose levels aren't too high. Do you use calcium with or w/out D3 ? D3 toxicity is a thing with some dragons if they have god uvb and are given too much D3. I'm just throwing these things out there to try to cover any slight possibility. Another thing is that some dragons become more active if given a digging substrate which can then cause their appetite to return.

 

[vonedaddy]

Yeah, he is pretty thin , not incredibly but it is a concern that he's not eating. It will be helpful to post the blood tests, hopefully the glucose levels aren't too high. Do you use calcium with or w/out D3 ? D3 toxicity is a thing with some dragons if they have god uvb and are given too much D3. I'm just throwing these things out there to try to cover any slight possibility. Another thing is that some dragons become more active if given a digging substrate which can then cause their appetite to return.

Used calcium withtout D3 2 days then wth d3 a day and cycle on and off.

As far as substrate he has been on this tile for almost 4 years now.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

He is a handsome boy, a little thin but not horrible yet.
The tank is lovely though! How close is the T5 Arcadia? The combination of the Solar Glo MVB
along with the T5 Arcadia should be fine. I agree with AHBD on the calcium with D3. Go ahead
& use just plain calcium without D3 since you are using a strong UVB. He most likely doesn't
need that.
I would definitely like to see the blood test results though. If nothing was seen on the blood tests,
he probably didn't need the Fortaz though. Injections are hard on them most of the time & so are
the antibiotics!
Which powdered food or supplemental food did the vet give you?

Tracie

 

[vonedaddy]

Hello,

He is a handsome boy, a little thin but not horrible yet.
The tank is lovely though! How close is the T5 Arcadia? The combination of the Solar Glo MVB
along with the T5 Arcadia should be fine. I agree with AHBD on the calcium with D3. Go ahead
& use just plain calcium without D3 since you are using a strong UVB. He most likely doesn't
need that.
I would definitely like to see the blood test results though. If nothing was seen on the blood tests,
he probably didn't need the Fortaz though. Injections are hard on them most of the time & so are
the antibiotics!
Which powdered food or supplemental food did the vet give you?

Tracie

I will stop using the D3.

Emeraid IC was the food supplemental they gave me. However I was never able to get the full 10ml into him. It was a constant struggle and he simply refused to open his mouth. When I finally get the syringe into his mouth he would but the plastic so hard it would crush. One time he even bit the little end of the syringe off. Thank god it came out of his mouth (see below).

I have tried every feeder possible to get him to eat. He was never a big greens eater but he would nibble every day along with some insects. For the last 4-5 weeks he wont touch anything except the occasional horn worm. I have dubias, pheonix worms, wax worms, super worms, and horn worms here.

As I said before, I really have a hard time syringe feeding him.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

Have you tried just dripping it onto his nose to try & get him to lick some food that way, or,
does that just not work?
I would consider getting a basic fecal done, just to see if his worm or parasite levels are a
bit elevated which could affect his appetite some.
How is he doing today?

Tracie

 

[vonedaddy]

Hello,

Have you tried just dripping it onto his nose to try & get him to lick some food that way, or,
does that just not work?
I would consider getting a basic fecal done, just to see if his worm or parasite levels are a
bit elevated which could affect his appetite some.
How is he doing today?

Tracie

Sorry for the late reply, my wife just has surgery so I cam dealing with this on both sides.

He is in his hide and hasn't come out for since yesterday morning.

The first vet did a fecal, do you think things changed?

If I put the food on his nose he just lets it sit there and dry up. He will take some water that way sometimes.

I don't know what to do at this point.