Sick Bearded Dragon

[Smooty]

My BD is about 7-8 months old , recently we went to the vet and learning she had Calcium Deficiency with MBD.She is unable to walk(due to her hind legs not working). We assumed she developed this because of a faulty 10 uvb bulb which we since replaced with a new one (but replacing again with a tube bulb).
Shes been given medication of Calcium Gluconate for the passed 3 weeks and i've only seen her gain some weight back but some days shes been acting weak and not lifting her head up . She is still not eating on her own ,we have to force feed her and now recently the past couple days shes been puffing her beard and opening her mouth constantly like shes breathing through her mouth. I am worried that might be a respiratory problem , however there is no sound coming from her when she does it.I want to know how long does it take to see an improvement in her MBD and if her puffing/breathing is a serious issue.

Tank setup at the moment

40 gallon
10.0 compact Reptisun UVB bulb
150W Basking light
temperature:95-100 coolend:80-85
humidity:30-40%

 

[CooperDragon]

I think the compact isn't putting out enough UVB for her to process calcium properly. I suggest a higher output bulb that better replicates sunlight levels of UVB. A T5 tube sitting about 12'' above the basking site should do the trick. http://www.lightyourreptiles.com/22-t-5-ho-fixture-high-output-with-arcadia-d3-12-ho-bulb/ It may take a while for her to bounce back and start absorbing nutrients properly. I would offer her plenty of water as well as the liquid calcium. If she isn't eating on her own I'd try offering a calcium rich supplement. Maybe some critical care or even some collard greens ground up into a slurry.

 

[Smooty]

Thanks for the reply! I will try giving her some mashed up kale with her food and see if that brings her energy up, shes still not lifting her front end and is still puffing/opening mouth. I noticed too that she sometimes will eat her food and leave it at the end of her throat and i have to use water for her to swallow it.As for the light problem, I have ordered a Zoo med t5 UVB tube and hood which hopefully will come in next week.

 

[CooperDragon]

The ZooMed T5 hood is a good option. It ships with a 5.0 bulb though so you'll want to order a 10.0 bulb to replace it to get adequate UVB for a dragon. One like this if you got the 24'' fixture. https://www.amazon.com/Zoo-Med-26061-Reptisun-Fluorescent/dp/B00AQU8HAO/

I don't advise Kale on it's own. A better option to provide calcium is collard greens (or turnip greens) which are relatively calcium rich options. If she's having trouble swallowing (maybe she's just storing food in her beard for a bit which is common) then offering some water is good but I'd also just offer things in small quantities more frequently to make it easier for her to process.

 

[EllenD]

Hello, welcome to the forum, and I think we can help you out, but it's important that you get him under a very strong, adequate UVB tube immediately, as at 7-8 months old he doesn't have much longer to start reversing any of the damage the MBD has done. The key to stopping the progression of MBD, strengthening his bone density, and hopefully reversing as much as the physical damage/paralysis that is already done is getting a T5-strength UVB tube, at least 22" long, and that is at least a 10% or higher UVB (10.0 or higher) and allowing both this new 10% T5 UVB tube and his bright white basking bulb on for at least 13-14 hours every single day.

A lot of people don't realize that if a dragon has a calcium deficiency and the resulting MBD, it's usually not at all due to the dragon's diet or calcium supplementation at all, it's due to them being under inadequate UVB light, having their UVB light be obstructed by a mesh lid to the tank that is blocking 40% or more of the UVB light, or a clear plastic cover on the tube fixture that is blocking 100% of the UVB light, having the UVB tube too far away from the BAsking Spot/Platform (for a T8 strength tube it must be within at least 6", for a T5 strength it must be within at least 11"), or not replacing the UVB tube soon enough or not at all, based on the UVB decay rate of the tube (T8 tubes must be replaced once every 6 months, T5 every 12 months at most). Without adequate, strong UVB light, a dragon cannot manufacture their own vitamin D3, and in-turn cannot absorb, process, or use ANY nutrition they take in from the food they eat or the calcium or multivitamin supplements they are given, they simply excrete everything. This is why they also tend to lose a lot of weight, as they are not absorbing any protein, fat, calories, vitamins, minerals, etc.

It's awesome that you ordered the Reptisun T5 Hood and UVB tube, however, as Cooper already mentioned, that package comes with a Reptisun 5.0 T5HO UVB tube, which is only a 5% UVB tube, and not at all adequate for a Bearded Dragon, but rather meant for Tropical Reptiles who do not need such strong, intense UVB light. You'd have to have that Reptisun 5.0 T5HO UVB tube within at least 4" of your dragon's Basking Spot in order for him to get any adequate UVB light, and that's way too close for a T5 strength tube, or any tube, as it will cause eye damage. Not to mention it's pretty much impossible to do so in the first place.

So you must order the same length of Reptisun 10.0 T5HO UVB tube, I don't know what length hood you got, but if you order just a tube on Amazon.com, you can get a 22" Reptisun 10.0 T5HO UVB tube for $24 shipped. That's probably the cheapest place. You can order all sizes of the 10.0 T5HO UVB tubes on Amazon.com for similar pricing, the 34", the 46", etc. So either return the entire package from wherever you ordered it and just order both a Reptisun 10.0 T5HO UVB tube and then a matching T5-rated fixture with a Metal Reflector on Amazon.com (you can buy a 22" 10.0 T5HO tube and a T5-rated 24" fixture for it on Amazon.com for around $50 shipped for both), or just order the correct length 10.0 T5HO UVB tube from Amazon.com now and then just sell the 5.0 tube on Craigslist, eBay, or whatever you want to do with it and just keep the ZooMed T5 hood, it is a very nice hood. Either way though, you need the 10% T5HO UVB tube immediately.

Also, be sure to mount the 10.0 T5HO UVB tube within at least 11" of his basking spot/platform, replace it every 10-12 months, and keep it on for at least 13-14 hours every single day. Be sure that there is no clear plastic safety cover on the ZooMed hood or any other T5-rated fixture you may buy, as they block 100% of the UVB light (the ZooMed hood shouldn't have any covers on it, but you never know any more, I've seen stranger things lately). And then once he's under a 10.0 T5HO UVB tube that is mounted correctly (be sure to have his bright-white colored Basking Bulb right alongside the UVb tube, not end-to-end but rather right alongside each other, both over the Hot Side of the tank, and then move his Basking Spot/platform directly underneath both lights within the Hot Side of the tank, so that he gets both lights at the same time while basking. This is the closest way to replicate natural sunlight for him.

He should perk up in both appetite and activity level after a few days under the 10.0 T5HO UVB tube (the 5.0 tube will not have much effect unless you have it extremely close to him, just an FYI, also, the 5.0 UVB tubes have a much faster decay rate, so instead of having to replace the 10.0 T5HO UVB tube once every 10-12 months, the 5.0 must be replaced once every 6 months at most, usually people with Tropical Reptiles replace them between 3-6 months, however it's inadequate for your dragon anyway, so again, you need to get a 10% T5HO UVB tube immediately, can't stress this enough)...Hopefully he will soon start to show improvement in his movement as well, but he will not ever be 100%, unfortunately, but he can live a very happy, quality life if you are vigilant about his lighting, temperature zones, diet, and supplementation from now on...

 

[Smooty]

Thanks , yeah i ordered a 10.0 uvb bulb/tube to go with my hood its ''Zoo Med LF73 26054 Reptisun T5-Ho Terrarium Hood, 36" '' and ''Zoo Med 26062 Reptisun 10.0 T5-Ho Uvb 39W Fluorescent Lamp, 34" unfortunetely i have to wait until Wednesday to get them as i got them from Amazon(its sold out in our petstores) . As for the collard greens, is there a specific kind i should get? i read that kale was considered a good choice but if its not ill avoid it. I also ordered(again from amazon) something called reptaid to help her get her appetite back and boost herself up. This my first reptile, so im new to a lot of things and constantly looking up ways to get her feeling better faster >.<

 

[CooperDragon]

Wednesday is fine. That bulb should serve you well for at least a year. Set it about 12'' above the basking site for best results.

Kale is OK when it's included in a varied diet. Collard greens, turnip greens, mustard greens, dandelion greens, and bok choy are also good options. I like using different kinds of squash, bell peppers and green beans too. Here is a good list to reference for salad ideas http://www.beautifuldragons.com/Nutrition.html

 

[Smooty]

I got my hood and light today, im wondering if i should remove the screen cover , its a fine mesh ,the same material as a window screen. only problem is i heard it blocks some rays and i have a cat(who has jumped on the screen before and i have to put pillows on it to keep her from it), also want to know if there is a specific location on where i should put the light(middle/front/back)

 

[EllenD]

If you have a cat you need to keep it totally away from the dragon tank, regardless of the lighting or anything else, especially if he shows any interest in the tank, which they all eventually will and do. They break into tanks, chew through mesh lids, turn tanks over, and most of all they taunt and completely stress dragons out just by sitting within their sight and looking at them. Your dragon just being able to see a predator like a cat is enough to stop him from eating and cause enormous health issues, forgetting that usually if a cat is allowed even in the same room as the dragon's tank is in it eventually results in either a very badly injured and mamed dragon or a dead dragon. It could take a day, a week, a month, or years to happen, but it ALWAYS happens. The owner comes home to a turned over tank or an empty tank with no signs of disruption, then finds pieces of their dragon or a dead dragon that has been tortured to death on the floor somewhere. I cannot tell you how many dragons have been killed by cats, either directly or indirectly by stress and a loss of appetite.

My best suggestion to anyone that has a reptile or amphibian, a rodent, etc. and a cat is to keep your small pets in a room with a latching door that is ALWAYS SHUT AND LATCHED AT ALL TIMES, AND HAVE THAT ROOM COMPLETELY OFF-LIMITS TO ALL CATS AT ALL TIMES. This is the ONLY way that this situation works. Cats are innately natural predators, it's not the cat's fault at all, it's their nature and we force them to be tempted all day long. If it seems I'm being overly-dramatic, I'm not, I'm so tired of seeing posts about dead dragons due to cats, and much worse are the posts about how someone found their dragon missing body part, missing eye balls, having horrible slashes and chunks of flesh missing, etc.

And just as an FYI, this always seems to happen to people who are the first to say "No, my cat loves my dragon, he or she is very gentle and loving and would never hurt another animal, I've kept them together in the same room for 2 years with no problems, etc.". It can and will happen at any time, and even people who put heavy, locking, wooden tops on their dragon tanks still end up with a horribly stressed-out dragon or a tank that was completely overturned off of a stand or table. So the only thing that is 100% full-proof and that doesn't end in heartbreak and trauma is to keep the Bearded Dragon in a room with a door that latches and has to be opened with the door knob, and that is totally off limits to all cats at all times. They shouldn't see each other at all. Ever.

As far as the T5 light goes, it must be over the Hot Side of the tank, right alongside the bright-white colored Basking Bulb so she gets both lights at the same time while basking (replicating natural sunlight), and within at least 11" of your dragon's basking spot/platform. A 10.0 T5HO UVB tube can sit on top of a mesh lid, it still blocks at least 40% of the UVB light, but they are still strong enough to penetrate adequate UVB light to your dragon on the other side of the mesh lid as long as they are within at least 11" of the basking spot/platform as already stated. I only have one glass Exo Terra Viv with a mesh lid (the other 2 are large, wooden enclosures), but I've been using the 22" and 34" Reptisun 10.0 T5HO UVB tubes for years over the mesh lid without an issue. That being said, just as an FYI for anyone else reading this, any and ALL T8 strength UVB tubes must be strapped to the underside of any mesh lid, as none of them are strong enough to penetrate adequate UVb light to your dragon on the other side of any mesh lid. (The strongest T8 UVB tube I know of is the 18 watt 10% Arcadia T8, and it too must be underneath the mesh lid, not on top...)

 

[Smooty]

Sad Update: She passed on this afternoon, found in her tank with her mouth open,black beard and she pooped herself. Been very upset(been crying for an hour now), we fed her and gave her medication this morning but it seemed like she might've had some other issue i wasn't aware of, i did everything possible to try and get her better. Just wish i knew what it was so i don't let it happen again

 

[CooperDragon]

I'm sorry to hear that =(. I know it's really hard to lose a dragon. It could have been an underlying issue. They are quite good at hiding illness by design. Often until it's too late to help them, unfortunately.