RaineKoenig
Member
I have connected my initial post with a post I did explaining her physical situation in depth and with pictures. I'm also leaving it where it is, just adding it here too. P.S; I wrote this being very tired and corrected some mistakes and typos.
This is not a “right now” emergency, but I think it’s appropriate for this section, if not I apologize and let me know or move the thread.
This is going to be long, so please be patient with me, she’s a rescue and I’m near desperation with her/him. I want to explain every detail. I am in no way a reptile expert, I don’t want any more lizards than this one, and I only got her because she needed a rescue. I really did research those questions before posting so I’m very sorry if I’m one of those annoying people.
I’m also very, very tired and exhausted so I might be scattered everywhere and English is my third language.
The Bearded Dragon in question is at least 5 years old (minimum).
She/he is in a 250G terrarium, well ventilated but retains proper heat. Basking area is 105 to 108 (it stays put). I keep him/her on tiles covered with newspaper. She has a cold end and a warm end. The cooler end is 75 to 85 and the warmer end is 85 to 95. For the basking area I use a 100 watt (UV-B) bulb (I would usually use “full-spectrum”(?) but in this case I think she/he needs more ) or else the basking area gets too cold. It’s the only heating I use and the temps are kept constant. She is near a window so she gets a lot of natural light without boiling up. The humidity in the room where she is kept varies from 35% to 45%. I give her “baths” every three days. The cooler part of the enclosure is much darker too so she has a “hide”.
I have removed anything that can get in her way except for the “basking log” and “bark divider” (just a log which semi separates the tank from warm the spot to the cooler darker spot).
Now I got him/her a few months ago, she’s a rescue from “private owners” not a pet shop; I won’t go into too many details, but the people that kept her made me sick. I’m mostly a Tarantula and Fish person (yey for having different types of enclosures!) so I called up a vet when I got her for an emergency appointment and also pointers on how to keep her.
She was SEVERLY malnourished (as in probably not fed in AT LEAST 6 months, no water bowl either…), very lethargic and could not move at all, her upper limbs were swollen and you could make out every single bone in her. When I was trying to feed her she couldn’t move. It looked like someone stepped on her, she also had very long claws (or nails?) with very old food stuck to them, and her mouth was crusted with old food, her nose was blocked, her ears seem “collapsed”, she has many missing fingers, the “eye socket” (area around her eye?) was blue-ish and she was unable to open her eyes. She was flat it looked like someone stepped on her; I mean, I could continue; but I won’t. It was bad, I checked around the net, and honestly, I have not seen a lizard in that bad of a shape (that was still alive). I have to say though; her general color/appearance wound/scar/stress marks wise is perfect.
Long story short, vet gave me care-giving pointers, calcium shots then liquid calcium and told me to give her a rich and varied diet. No parasites, no internal injuries or blockages… Basically she was in “okay” physical health (she was not, but I don’t know how to put it). The vet even told me I should consider euthanasia on the spot. I told her no, and she gave me the consult/scans and tests for free with liquid calcium and some vitamin paste.
It took me over 7 hours (even more; I’m not even exaggerating) to remove the **** off her fingers. Some of them where stuck together because of the food, they were literally fused; I couldn’t make out what was the lizard and what wasn’t. I had to soak her and gently remove it, I had to use a scalpel at some point (I got access to pretty much any medical tools and autoclaves and dry heat ovens and anything you could imagine) fortunately I did not harm her in anyway. It was hard because the food/crust seemed to be part of her, no difference between herself and the crap. She bled at some point (not because of the scalpel, just the manual removal – but just a tiny amount) I soaked her fingers/hands/legs in a mild saline solution and rinsed it off.
Alright, so for the first two months I was feeding her with a syringe 3cc at first of freshly gut loaded mashed crickets (ever tried to put those in a blender?) calcium and vitamin boosts; twice a day. A week later I was giving her 3ccs three times a day until I got to 3ccs four times a day. Then I upped to 4ccs four times a day and so on until she could eat on her own.
I figured that if she was that malnourished, without a heat lamp, no water or anything, I couldn’t just flood her with food, her metabolism wouldn’t take it.
I was also giving her some bio/natural/un-processed cat food in tiny doses for her to gain at least some mass (VERY sporadically, usually a tiny bit mixed with blended veggies and crickets).
Fast forward to now! Good news! After 5-6 months she can “walk” (well crawl), she’s more alert, eats live crickets (but I have to hand feed them to her she can’t catch up), the swelling in her limbs went considerably down. Her stool is healthy; her mouth also seems to have a yellow-ish healthy color to it. She eats (hand-fed) crickets and goodies (mashed veggies and sometimes super-bio healthy natural cat food for some fat once every two weeks). I blend her food to tiny bits, it’s mooshy and I boost it with calcium and vitamin paste. And I keep her hydrated. I also give her daily stomach massages, just to make sure the digestion and all goes well, in case her body is still not used to food. I also get her bio baby food (butter squash); she eats much better than me. I have also inspected for mites or anything else.
I also gently physically “rehabilitate” her, her limbs were stiff and swollen, the swelling went down, and so I gently bent and unbend her limbs (VERY gently) with luck she will regain more independent movement.
(She seems to drag herself around with minimal limb movement.)
She drastically improved; she seems much more alert and is able to move, with “stiffness” in her limbs, but moves none the less. If the state she was in, I mean I still can’t believe it. She could NOT move, not even open her eyes, now she wiggles like crazy when I need to move her!
P.S; The vitamin paste is done on spot depending on the specific needs of the lizard/animal.
Now, I got a few problems with her, and before stressing her with a trip to the vet I thought I would post them here, if you have pointers to what might be wrong with her please let me know! These are persistent problems and I would like some input!
1-When she eats she seems not to be able to swallow, she seems almost distressed (keep in mind the food is very fluid).
2-She violently moves her head banging herself on the enclosure walls and seems agitated. They’re not spasms or seizures; she seems to control the movement.
3-She sometimes seems to have food “stuck” in her mouth, but it’s not compact or tight, it just seems as if she didn’t swallow everything (it might be related to her banging her head, but it doesn’t seem like it); The food just kind of floats in her mouth.
4-Her ears seem… Smaller. The ear holes seem not to hold their shape.
5-Sometimes she moves her head sideways (synonym of infection) but she has none, been checked, I checked, some friends checked. We went through stool samples, scrapings, checked out every inch of her body, no parasites, fungi or mites.
6-She has NO teeth. It’s not much of a problem with the liquid food and she seems to chug the cricket’s problem free although I think I will start putting them in the blender. I’m scared she swallows them. Can the teeth grow back? Any input?
7-This is NOT an option I want to think about, but personally, do you think she can still have somewhat of a quality life even with those problems or should I… Put her down?
8-Does she have a chance of physically supporting herself on her limbs, she crawls and drags herself with the little arm movement she has, but can keep her head up, but the rest is flat against the ground?
9-Any chance she will keep getting a bit better?
10-Any ideas on what else I could feed her/him? Any particular foods one wouldn’t have thought about? I heard soy (?) yogurt but I’m very unsure.
11-Anything else I can do to make her comfortable? (Like a… I don’t know what lizards like, some gentle ocean sounds soundtrack) or something?
12-There’s a part in her mouth, which I guess would be her gums, it would be the “lining” of her teeth, the tissues is yellow-ish/translucent and I see some swelling; suggestions?
And feel free to post personal notes and comments. I do have pictures, but at this point I think it’s useless, I really don’t want to be posting her across the net (unless it’s REALLY necessary – but I personally don’t think it is). I’m not a doctor, but I do have certain knowledge and experience (mostly in humans though ) and I don’t know anything about reptiles.
(PS, yes I do have a life and a very, very full time career haha! – I just prefer saving a life than making a few bucks; okay more than a few but oh well, job won’t go anywhere.)
Alright, let's try this picture thing!
Let me put you into context;
I got her in Feb. 2011. She was flat, and I mean flatter than she is now, it was unbelievable; under half and inch thick. When you touched her stomach, there was no consistency, it was caved in. Her pelvis bones (?? humm, the two bones before the tail?) were very highly visible. As you can see she also has a few missing fingers (on all limbs). Her "ear canal" (the outside "bridge" of the ear?) seems collapsed, but at least now you see something, it was completely closed off. The skin on her lower eyelid (?? under her eye?) was very blue. She was limp, did not open her eyes, could not open her mouth, did not move and did not fight back when I was picking her up. The upper limbs were swollen to I guess 3 times their normal size and her lower limbs were skinny and bony. Her nose was plugged up, very deeply it took me about 45 mins to gently get all the **** out of her nose. Her fingers (mostly on the upper limbs) were fused together in a very solid, old gunky crust which deformed her nails/claws permanently (this is just my guess). It took me OVER 7 hours to clean all that **** (literally it was ****) off it was a mix of faeces and old food, over layer of more faecal matter and more food, and more faeces. I mean, her "hands" were a ball of crap. You wouldn't believe it. I used scalpels, hemostats, hypodermic needles, warm saline solution, medical towel and gauze to remove all that. It was hard something I had to manipulate the fingers and I could tell she was in discomfort because with the little energy she had she actually moved. Her joints were stiff but a bit flexible.
I stayed up all night once because I was SURE she was dying, then two weeks later same thing. I didn't want to leave her alone.
Now:
She's 17.5 inches long, I just measured her. She's a bit dirty she needs her bath tomorrow, I fed her and she has a tendency to plunge into the food, which is a good thing, she seems to "hunt" it, and she's very alert with crickets but just can't run after them she's too slow. She can semi walk/crawl she has movement (but limited) in her limbs, I wish she could actually get herself off the ground, at least she can move her head. She can actually pulls herself on her basking log. She's clean (!!!) unless she tackles bug soup and food I have to clean her off right after of the next day. She ALWAYS has fresh food in her cage. She moves and wiggles like an eel (I have eels actually haha) when I pick her up. She poops! Her poop has a very good consistency and she can actually lift her tail up when she goes to the bathroom. Thinking about it, her limbs and joints ARE much more flexible and she seems to be in no discomfort when I examine her.
Sorry for the pictures with my finger in it, I think she likes me so I have to bug her a bit for her to open her mouth (touch her on the side of her mouth).
If you look to your right side on the picture, inside her mouth on the bottom half, between her tongue and lips/jaws, the is some white soft tissue which seems to have some minor swelling. She doesn't have teeth so maybe is the irritation and friction when she eats? Any ideas?
You can also note some swelling in the same area. It seems to be soft tissue to me, but I am completely unsure. I have No experience with reptilia.
On this one she is dirty, it was after a meal and I let her bask instead of taking her for a bath right after. I have noted that the beard and neck area seem to be too skinny and there's a significant lack of health. As you can also see, but not as well, her ear bridge/canal seems collapsed or lifeless.
Her basking log was dirty (she is a VERY messy eater and food ends up EVERYWHERE so I wash it before going to bed when she doesn't use it, sorry for that) this was a week or so ago, after a cricket feeding. As you can see (the focus is off her limbs though) the loose and surplus of skin which is present after the most part of swelling went down.
As you can see here; the surplus of skin is still present. I assure you she looks much better than she did. You can see how the upper part of her arm has no noticeable swelling but the lower part of the arm still has swelling present. She has no mass and it is quite tender and seems almost perfectly healthy to the touch.
This is her in a relaxed position without any interference on my part; note the dessicated lower limbs and the thickness of the upper limbs. Let me comment that her lower limbs were much, much skinnier when I got her, that's after 5 months of daily care. Also her pelvic (two bones at the tail) are less prominent and barely noticeable.
Here you can clearly see the damaged cause after starvation. Those limbs are noticeable less stiff but still lack weight.
Here you can clearly see her ears and profile features. Her jaw is uneven with the lower jaw being more prominent. I'm not sure if this is normal. You can see the collapsed ear bridge.
Here you can note how thin she is, but she gained a lot of thickness in the last few months and her stomach has more consistency to the touch. This is her usual "upright" position.
Here is a picture showing how much she can actually lift herself of the ground, it's not much, but it's progress, although I'm not sure how much more, if any, she will be able to make. She can independently move around with some effort and some difficulty.
This is not a “right now” emergency, but I think it’s appropriate for this section, if not I apologize and let me know or move the thread.
This is going to be long, so please be patient with me, she’s a rescue and I’m near desperation with her/him. I want to explain every detail. I am in no way a reptile expert, I don’t want any more lizards than this one, and I only got her because she needed a rescue. I really did research those questions before posting so I’m very sorry if I’m one of those annoying people.
I’m also very, very tired and exhausted so I might be scattered everywhere and English is my third language.
The Bearded Dragon in question is at least 5 years old (minimum).
She/he is in a 250G terrarium, well ventilated but retains proper heat. Basking area is 105 to 108 (it stays put). I keep him/her on tiles covered with newspaper. She has a cold end and a warm end. The cooler end is 75 to 85 and the warmer end is 85 to 95. For the basking area I use a 100 watt (UV-B) bulb (I would usually use “full-spectrum”(?) but in this case I think she/he needs more ) or else the basking area gets too cold. It’s the only heating I use and the temps are kept constant. She is near a window so she gets a lot of natural light without boiling up. The humidity in the room where she is kept varies from 35% to 45%. I give her “baths” every three days. The cooler part of the enclosure is much darker too so she has a “hide”.
I have removed anything that can get in her way except for the “basking log” and “bark divider” (just a log which semi separates the tank from warm the spot to the cooler darker spot).
Now I got him/her a few months ago, she’s a rescue from “private owners” not a pet shop; I won’t go into too many details, but the people that kept her made me sick. I’m mostly a Tarantula and Fish person (yey for having different types of enclosures!) so I called up a vet when I got her for an emergency appointment and also pointers on how to keep her.
She was SEVERLY malnourished (as in probably not fed in AT LEAST 6 months, no water bowl either…), very lethargic and could not move at all, her upper limbs were swollen and you could make out every single bone in her. When I was trying to feed her she couldn’t move. It looked like someone stepped on her, she also had very long claws (or nails?) with very old food stuck to them, and her mouth was crusted with old food, her nose was blocked, her ears seem “collapsed”, she has many missing fingers, the “eye socket” (area around her eye?) was blue-ish and she was unable to open her eyes. She was flat it looked like someone stepped on her; I mean, I could continue; but I won’t. It was bad, I checked around the net, and honestly, I have not seen a lizard in that bad of a shape (that was still alive). I have to say though; her general color/appearance wound/scar/stress marks wise is perfect.
Long story short, vet gave me care-giving pointers, calcium shots then liquid calcium and told me to give her a rich and varied diet. No parasites, no internal injuries or blockages… Basically she was in “okay” physical health (she was not, but I don’t know how to put it). The vet even told me I should consider euthanasia on the spot. I told her no, and she gave me the consult/scans and tests for free with liquid calcium and some vitamin paste.
It took me over 7 hours (even more; I’m not even exaggerating) to remove the **** off her fingers. Some of them where stuck together because of the food, they were literally fused; I couldn’t make out what was the lizard and what wasn’t. I had to soak her and gently remove it, I had to use a scalpel at some point (I got access to pretty much any medical tools and autoclaves and dry heat ovens and anything you could imagine) fortunately I did not harm her in anyway. It was hard because the food/crust seemed to be part of her, no difference between herself and the crap. She bled at some point (not because of the scalpel, just the manual removal – but just a tiny amount) I soaked her fingers/hands/legs in a mild saline solution and rinsed it off.
Alright, so for the first two months I was feeding her with a syringe 3cc at first of freshly gut loaded mashed crickets (ever tried to put those in a blender?) calcium and vitamin boosts; twice a day. A week later I was giving her 3ccs three times a day until I got to 3ccs four times a day. Then I upped to 4ccs four times a day and so on until she could eat on her own.
I figured that if she was that malnourished, without a heat lamp, no water or anything, I couldn’t just flood her with food, her metabolism wouldn’t take it.
I was also giving her some bio/natural/un-processed cat food in tiny doses for her to gain at least some mass (VERY sporadically, usually a tiny bit mixed with blended veggies and crickets).
Fast forward to now! Good news! After 5-6 months she can “walk” (well crawl), she’s more alert, eats live crickets (but I have to hand feed them to her she can’t catch up), the swelling in her limbs went considerably down. Her stool is healthy; her mouth also seems to have a yellow-ish healthy color to it. She eats (hand-fed) crickets and goodies (mashed veggies and sometimes super-bio healthy natural cat food for some fat once every two weeks). I blend her food to tiny bits, it’s mooshy and I boost it with calcium and vitamin paste. And I keep her hydrated. I also give her daily stomach massages, just to make sure the digestion and all goes well, in case her body is still not used to food. I also get her bio baby food (butter squash); she eats much better than me. I have also inspected for mites or anything else.
I also gently physically “rehabilitate” her, her limbs were stiff and swollen, the swelling went down, and so I gently bent and unbend her limbs (VERY gently) with luck she will regain more independent movement.
(She seems to drag herself around with minimal limb movement.)
She drastically improved; she seems much more alert and is able to move, with “stiffness” in her limbs, but moves none the less. If the state she was in, I mean I still can’t believe it. She could NOT move, not even open her eyes, now she wiggles like crazy when I need to move her!
P.S; The vitamin paste is done on spot depending on the specific needs of the lizard/animal.
Now, I got a few problems with her, and before stressing her with a trip to the vet I thought I would post them here, if you have pointers to what might be wrong with her please let me know! These are persistent problems and I would like some input!
1-When she eats she seems not to be able to swallow, she seems almost distressed (keep in mind the food is very fluid).
2-She violently moves her head banging herself on the enclosure walls and seems agitated. They’re not spasms or seizures; she seems to control the movement.
3-She sometimes seems to have food “stuck” in her mouth, but it’s not compact or tight, it just seems as if she didn’t swallow everything (it might be related to her banging her head, but it doesn’t seem like it); The food just kind of floats in her mouth.
4-Her ears seem… Smaller. The ear holes seem not to hold their shape.
5-Sometimes she moves her head sideways (synonym of infection) but she has none, been checked, I checked, some friends checked. We went through stool samples, scrapings, checked out every inch of her body, no parasites, fungi or mites.
6-She has NO teeth. It’s not much of a problem with the liquid food and she seems to chug the cricket’s problem free although I think I will start putting them in the blender. I’m scared she swallows them. Can the teeth grow back? Any input?
7-This is NOT an option I want to think about, but personally, do you think she can still have somewhat of a quality life even with those problems or should I… Put her down?
8-Does she have a chance of physically supporting herself on her limbs, she crawls and drags herself with the little arm movement she has, but can keep her head up, but the rest is flat against the ground?
9-Any chance she will keep getting a bit better?
10-Any ideas on what else I could feed her/him? Any particular foods one wouldn’t have thought about? I heard soy (?) yogurt but I’m very unsure.
11-Anything else I can do to make her comfortable? (Like a… I don’t know what lizards like, some gentle ocean sounds soundtrack) or something?
12-There’s a part in her mouth, which I guess would be her gums, it would be the “lining” of her teeth, the tissues is yellow-ish/translucent and I see some swelling; suggestions?
And feel free to post personal notes and comments. I do have pictures, but at this point I think it’s useless, I really don’t want to be posting her across the net (unless it’s REALLY necessary – but I personally don’t think it is). I’m not a doctor, but I do have certain knowledge and experience (mostly in humans though ) and I don’t know anything about reptiles.
(PS, yes I do have a life and a very, very full time career haha! – I just prefer saving a life than making a few bucks; okay more than a few but oh well, job won’t go anywhere.)
Alright, let's try this picture thing!
Let me put you into context;
I got her in Feb. 2011. She was flat, and I mean flatter than she is now, it was unbelievable; under half and inch thick. When you touched her stomach, there was no consistency, it was caved in. Her pelvis bones (?? humm, the two bones before the tail?) were very highly visible. As you can see she also has a few missing fingers (on all limbs). Her "ear canal" (the outside "bridge" of the ear?) seems collapsed, but at least now you see something, it was completely closed off. The skin on her lower eyelid (?? under her eye?) was very blue. She was limp, did not open her eyes, could not open her mouth, did not move and did not fight back when I was picking her up. The upper limbs were swollen to I guess 3 times their normal size and her lower limbs were skinny and bony. Her nose was plugged up, very deeply it took me about 45 mins to gently get all the **** out of her nose. Her fingers (mostly on the upper limbs) were fused together in a very solid, old gunky crust which deformed her nails/claws permanently (this is just my guess). It took me OVER 7 hours to clean all that **** (literally it was ****) off it was a mix of faeces and old food, over layer of more faecal matter and more food, and more faeces. I mean, her "hands" were a ball of crap. You wouldn't believe it. I used scalpels, hemostats, hypodermic needles, warm saline solution, medical towel and gauze to remove all that. It was hard something I had to manipulate the fingers and I could tell she was in discomfort because with the little energy she had she actually moved. Her joints were stiff but a bit flexible.
I stayed up all night once because I was SURE she was dying, then two weeks later same thing. I didn't want to leave her alone.
Now:
She's 17.5 inches long, I just measured her. She's a bit dirty she needs her bath tomorrow, I fed her and she has a tendency to plunge into the food, which is a good thing, she seems to "hunt" it, and she's very alert with crickets but just can't run after them she's too slow. She can semi walk/crawl she has movement (but limited) in her limbs, I wish she could actually get herself off the ground, at least she can move her head. She can actually pulls herself on her basking log. She's clean (!!!) unless she tackles bug soup and food I have to clean her off right after of the next day. She ALWAYS has fresh food in her cage. She moves and wiggles like an eel (I have eels actually haha) when I pick her up. She poops! Her poop has a very good consistency and she can actually lift her tail up when she goes to the bathroom. Thinking about it, her limbs and joints ARE much more flexible and she seems to be in no discomfort when I examine her.
Sorry for the pictures with my finger in it, I think she likes me so I have to bug her a bit for her to open her mouth (touch her on the side of her mouth).
If you look to your right side on the picture, inside her mouth on the bottom half, between her tongue and lips/jaws, the is some white soft tissue which seems to have some minor swelling. She doesn't have teeth so maybe is the irritation and friction when she eats? Any ideas?
You can also note some swelling in the same area. It seems to be soft tissue to me, but I am completely unsure. I have No experience with reptilia.
On this one she is dirty, it was after a meal and I let her bask instead of taking her for a bath right after. I have noted that the beard and neck area seem to be too skinny and there's a significant lack of health. As you can also see, but not as well, her ear bridge/canal seems collapsed or lifeless.
Her basking log was dirty (she is a VERY messy eater and food ends up EVERYWHERE so I wash it before going to bed when she doesn't use it, sorry for that) this was a week or so ago, after a cricket feeding. As you can see (the focus is off her limbs though) the loose and surplus of skin which is present after the most part of swelling went down.
As you can see here; the surplus of skin is still present. I assure you she looks much better than she did. You can see how the upper part of her arm has no noticeable swelling but the lower part of the arm still has swelling present. She has no mass and it is quite tender and seems almost perfectly healthy to the touch.
This is her in a relaxed position without any interference on my part; note the dessicated lower limbs and the thickness of the upper limbs. Let me comment that her lower limbs were much, much skinnier when I got her, that's after 5 months of daily care. Also her pelvic (two bones at the tail) are less prominent and barely noticeable.
Here you can clearly see the damaged cause after starvation. Those limbs are noticeable less stiff but still lack weight.
Here you can clearly see her ears and profile features. Her jaw is uneven with the lower jaw being more prominent. I'm not sure if this is normal. You can see the collapsed ear bridge.
Here you can note how thin she is, but she gained a lot of thickness in the last few months and her stomach has more consistency to the touch. This is her usual "upright" position.
Here is a picture showing how much she can actually lift herself of the ground, it's not much, but it's progress, although I'm not sure how much more, if any, she will be able to make. She can independently move around with some effort and some difficulty.
Nhà Cái Cá Cược Trực Tuyến Đáng Chơi Nhất 2024
