Rep-Cal Juvenile Bearded Dragon Food
- Thread starter delfiend
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You can get tiny little superworms??? And baby beardies can eat them??? 
Glad I found that out!! I read in a couple places that superworms should only be fed to adults, but hey, I'm open for different opinions!
I currently am selling my old phone on eBay (as I just got a new one), and since it's a dual touchscreen phone (like, the ONLY phone) with lots of accessories, I'm hoping to make a little bit of money off of it. If I do, I can be more open about the sort of live food items I buy my beardie. If anyone's interested, you can message me and I'll give you the link!
@icelore, what do you feed your phoenix worms? I read the article here on raising them, but it seemed a little messy. :? Could you feed them like, Nature Zone's Total Bites, which are a gel water + nutrients in one sort of thing?
Glad I found that out!! I read in a couple places that superworms should only be fed to adults, but hey, I'm open for different opinions!
I currently am selling my old phone on eBay (as I just got a new one), and since it's a dual touchscreen phone (like, the ONLY phone) with lots of accessories, I'm hoping to make a little bit of money off of it. If I do, I can be more open about the sort of live food items I buy my beardie. If anyone's interested, you can message me and I'll give you the link!
@icelore, what do you feed your phoenix worms? I read the article here on raising them, but it seemed a little messy. :? Could you feed them like, Nature Zone's Total Bites, which are a gel water + nutrients in one sort of thing?
seems everyone has confused superworms with mealworms. mealworms are the ones that are high in chitin and should only be fed to adultsdelfiend":1h7p3v06 said:You can get tiny little superworms??? And baby beardies can eat them???
Glad I found that out!! I read in a couple places that superworms should only be fed to adults, but hey, I'm open for different opinions!
I currently am selling my old phone on eBay (as I just got a new one), and since it's a dual touchscreen phone (like, the ONLY phone) with lots of accessories, I'm hoping to make a little bit of money off of it. If I do, I can be more open about the sort of live food items I buy my beardie. If anyone's interested, you can message me and I'll give you the link!
@icelore, what do you feed your phoenix worms? I read the article here on raising them, but it seemed a little messy. :? Could you feed them like, Nature Zone's Total Bites, which are a gel water + nutrients in one sort of thing?
icelore
Juvie Member
Whatever you feed them, it has to be wet enough for them to burrow into it, and have enough structure that they won't suffocate. Any kind of fruit and grain mixture that is the consistency of wet sand will work. Last time I had them I tossed some stale heals of bread in the blender and ground it up, mixed it will milled oats, and wet it all down with veggie puree. I didn't have a ton of worms, so I just put them in a tupperware container and left it on the window seel. It didn't mold or anything, and I changed the mix out after a week. It wasn't as messy as I thought it would be actually, and only took like 5 minutes to set up. The worms got fat pretty quick, but unfortunately my beardie wasn't very fond of them because he only eats things that move fast so he can hunt them.delfiend":222is8zo said:
Lot of people on this forum say not to feed even supers to juvies.wulfie":222is8zo said:seems everyone has confused superworms with mealworms. mealworms are the ones that are high in chitin and should only be fed to adults
Lot of people on this forum say not to feed even supers to juvies.[/quote]wulfie":1jvxl5hp said:seems everyone has confused superworms with mealworms. mealworms are the ones that are high in chitin and should only be fed to adults
I'm not even going to get into this debate as it's already been thoroughly covered in another thread: viewtopic.php?f=45&t=194272&start=15#p1555131
icelore
Juvie Member
Clearly there was no debate as I didn't voice an opinion. Kinda had to argue something when you don't know what I think, wouldn't it?
Regardless, people can debate in other threads, but there is no definitive answer, because in the end, it's everyone's personal ideas. There is no on omnipotent person who can definitively answer all the questions or "law down the law" - unless there is concrete proof of certain things, people are going to just try and figure things out for themselves as best they can.
Regardless, people can debate in other threads, but there is no definitive answer, because in the end, it's everyone's personal ideas. There is no on omnipotent person who can definitively answer all the questions or "law down the law" - unless there is concrete proof of certain things, people are going to just try and figure things out for themselves as best they can.
you actually did voice your opinion:
wulfie wrote:seems everyone has confused superworms with mealworms. mealworms are the ones that are high in chitin and should only be fed to adults
and your reply was:
Lot of people on this forum say not to feed even supers to juvies.
and I'm not going to start a flame war over this, especially considering that supers/mealworms, etc, weren't even in the OPs thread and I'm not hijacking this one
wulfie wrote:seems everyone has confused superworms with mealworms. mealworms are the ones that are high in chitin and should only be fed to adults
and your reply was:
Lot of people on this forum say not to feed even supers to juvies.
and I'm not going to start a flame war over this, especially considering that supers/mealworms, etc, weren't even in the OPs thread and I'm not hijacking this one
icelore
Juvie Member
Read what you just wrote - I said "A lot of people on this forum say not to feed even supers to juvies." Where exactly in that statement is my opinion? That was a statement of what other people think. Reading comprehension is useful to avoid putting words into other people's mouths.
The reason I was wondering was because LLLReptile feeds their babies mini mealworms, and I'm going to buy my beardie from them. And no, they haven't had any impaction problems.
I know there are plenty of opinions on whats best fed to babies and what's best avoided, but ultimately its up to me as the owner as to what my baby will eat. And I feel that as long as I provide adequate basking temps and follow the space between the eyes rule, the baby will be fine eating mealworms or superworms.
And wulfie, there was no opinion in that statement. Saying "A lot of people on the forum say not to feed supers to juvies" is no different than saying "A lot of people in New York say they don't eat gluten in their diet." They're both simply factual statements.
I know there are plenty of opinions on whats best fed to babies and what's best avoided, but ultimately its up to me as the owner as to what my baby will eat. And I feel that as long as I provide adequate basking temps and follow the space between the eyes rule, the baby will be fine eating mealworms or superworms.
And wulfie, there was no opinion in that statement. Saying "A lot of people on the forum say not to feed supers to juvies" is no different than saying "A lot of people in New York say they don't eat gluten in their diet." They're both simply factual statements.
So, @icelore, I'm buying some different powders from BeardedDragon.co, specifically Alfalfa powder, Bee Pollen powder, and Orange Juice Powder (all Human Grade). The Bee Pollen, in particular, is
And the Alfalfa powder is good too.
For feeding Phoenix worms, do you think I could grind up some bread, mix with one of these powders or two, wet it into a mash, and serve? And should I put that in a dish or use as substrate? The How To on this site uses organic bread and baby food as a substrate/food that they burrow in and change out constantly. Um, yuck...? :? As soon as a feeder insect gets high maintenance, my mom says NO MORE! To the specific feeder, that is.
I mean, every other feeder is pretty straight forward (except silkworms). You just house them, feed them some cheap chow, give them some water cubes, and a stack of egg cartons, and maybe a heat pad for the roaches, and done! Change food every few days. That's it. The phoenix worms are so nutritious that really want to feed them to my lil beardie, but right now I don't feel prepared enough to keep them.
Have I got the basic concept? Mashy sort of food in a dish in a tubberware container/kritter cage on windowsill? Change food every few days?
They say that
And the Alfalfa powder is good too.
For feeding Phoenix worms, do you think I could grind up some bread, mix with one of these powders or two, wet it into a mash, and serve? And should I put that in a dish or use as substrate? The How To on this site uses organic bread and baby food as a substrate/food that they burrow in and change out constantly. Um, yuck...? :? As soon as a feeder insect gets high maintenance, my mom says NO MORE! To the specific feeder, that is.
I mean, every other feeder is pretty straight forward (except silkworms). You just house them, feed them some cheap chow, give them some water cubes, and a stack of egg cartons, and maybe a heat pad for the roaches, and done! Change food every few days. That's it. The phoenix worms are so nutritious that really want to feed them to my lil beardie, but right now I don't feel prepared enough to keep them.
Have I got the basic concept? Mashy sort of food in a dish in a tubberware container/kritter cage on windowsill? Change food every few days?
icelore
Juvie Member
You've definitely got the basic concept of giving them a slurry/mash to live and burrow into. I have no idea if it will work with those products though. lol I'm not sure if some kind of fruit/veggie is essential to their growth or just a convenient moisture additive for the grain.
My only thought would be this -
1) The additives powders are great, but why would you spend extra money on them when using baby food to grow the worms would be much cheaper? I can see if you fed them special stuff a day or two before giving them to your dragon to gutload, but just to give them to eat while they fatten up seems harsh on the pocket book! I use additive powders for my feeders as well, but they way I have mine set up is that the bulk of my insects get table scraps and cereal, and as I take them out of the "bulk tank" and into my "hey, you're going to get eaten this week" tank, there is higher quality food in there that includes any additives so that I'm sure what I've paid good money for goes -into- my dragon and isn't just used to help the bugs grow. That's just how I work it though! I'm on a super tight budget so I try to make every thing count.
2) Unless you are using a considerable mount of powder, you're really just wetting down bread with water. This seems to be another argument for baby food.
3) Unless you are mixing your bread with something else, you don't need to grind it down. I just did mine that way because it was stale and I was mixing it with oats.
I agree with you that keep them does seem to be much more of a PITA then other feeders. This process is just optional though, you can always just feed them as is. I think because they are so small and a bit pricey that people decided to fatten them before feeding to increase cost effectiveness. When I lived at home my mom was very critical of the time I spent maintaining my critters as well and tried to limit anything high maintenance. As long as you do the work yourself, hopefully it won't be a problem for you.
Alfalfa extract and bee pollen are two really, really great products. I would use them in such a way that they are going directly into your dragon to make sure s/he gets the best benefit from them. I use bee pollen as well, and give my dragon a blueberry or piece of mango (his favorite foods) a few times a week with some on it, or in a bit of strawberry puree. He's got a bit of a sweet tooth and loves fruit, so it's a nice treat for him and I can regulate the amount of supplements he's getting in that way. Again, that's just how I work it and I'm sure opinions and methods may vary!
I think in the end, worrying too much about one kind of feeder to putting yourself through a lot of hassle is not the most effective use of time. Providing a balanced diet with lots of variety is going to serve your dragon just as well, if not better, as slaving over the "perfect" feeder food, and save you headache as well. Remember, any time that you don't spend fussing over fiddly insects can be spent with your dragon instead!
My only thought would be this -
1) The additives powders are great, but why would you spend extra money on them when using baby food to grow the worms would be much cheaper? I can see if you fed them special stuff a day or two before giving them to your dragon to gutload, but just to give them to eat while they fatten up seems harsh on the pocket book! I use additive powders for my feeders as well, but they way I have mine set up is that the bulk of my insects get table scraps and cereal, and as I take them out of the "bulk tank" and into my "hey, you're going to get eaten this week" tank, there is higher quality food in there that includes any additives so that I'm sure what I've paid good money for goes -into- my dragon and isn't just used to help the bugs grow. That's just how I work it though! I'm on a super tight budget so I try to make every thing count.
2) Unless you are using a considerable mount of powder, you're really just wetting down bread with water. This seems to be another argument for baby food.
3) Unless you are mixing your bread with something else, you don't need to grind it down. I just did mine that way because it was stale and I was mixing it with oats.
I agree with you that keep them does seem to be much more of a PITA then other feeders. This process is just optional though, you can always just feed them as is. I think because they are so small and a bit pricey that people decided to fatten them before feeding to increase cost effectiveness. When I lived at home my mom was very critical of the time I spent maintaining my critters as well and tried to limit anything high maintenance. As long as you do the work yourself, hopefully it won't be a problem for you.
Alfalfa extract and bee pollen are two really, really great products. I would use them in such a way that they are going directly into your dragon to make sure s/he gets the best benefit from them. I use bee pollen as well, and give my dragon a blueberry or piece of mango (his favorite foods) a few times a week with some on it, or in a bit of strawberry puree. He's got a bit of a sweet tooth and loves fruit, so it's a nice treat for him and I can regulate the amount of supplements he's getting in that way. Again, that's just how I work it and I'm sure opinions and methods may vary!
I think in the end, worrying too much about one kind of feeder to putting yourself through a lot of hassle is not the most effective use of time. Providing a balanced diet with lots of variety is going to serve your dragon just as well, if not better, as slaving over the "perfect" feeder food, and save you headache as well. Remember, any time that you don't spend fussing over fiddly insects can be spent with your dragon instead!
Alright, thanks! For now I'll probably just keep the stupid little worms in their cup and feed them as they are. My beardie's gonna be a hatchling, after all. Here's my plan for my other feeders:
Buying Options (shipping included):
Mullberry Farms' Tiny Herp Combo: 300 small phoenix worms® and 1000 micro superworms ($30)
LLReptile.com:
- 500 any size crickets ($27) plus various quantities of Calci-worms, mealworms, mini mealworms, superworms, and waxwroms for dirt cheap.
- 50 small Dubia ($12)
Keeping Them:
Crickets:
-kept in a 18 gal, 25.5" 16.5" x 15.5" tall storage container w/ 6" x 12" fine screen stapled onto lid
-kept on shredded aspen bedding
-have a stack of egg cartons
-food: Fluker's High-Calcium Cricket Food mixed with alfalfa powder, and Zilla's Cricket Drink
Dubia:
-kept in a 18 gal, 25.5" 16.5" x 15.5" tall storage container w/ 6" x 12" fine screen stapled onto lid
-kept on shredded aspen bedding
-have a stack of egg cartons w/ heat pad underneath
-food: Fluker's High-Calcium Cricket Food mixed with orange juice powder, and Zilla's Cricket Drink
Phoenix Worms®:
-kept in a small Kritter Keeper or tupperware container
-kept on ???
-food: soft fruits and veggies/ bread soaked in baby food :?
Micro Superworms:
These are the one's I'm torn on right now. I don't know whether I should buy in smaller quantities so that my beardie can eat them before they're too big, or whether to buy the 1000 in the Tiny Herp Combo and just let them be cannibalistic but still have a source of water...
-kept in a small Kritter Keeper or tupperware container
-kept on wheat bran with Fluker's High-Calcium Cricket Food mixed in
-food: the bedding
Buying Options (shipping included):
Mullberry Farms' Tiny Herp Combo: 300 small phoenix worms® and 1000 micro superworms ($30)
LLReptile.com:
- 500 any size crickets ($27) plus various quantities of Calci-worms, mealworms, mini mealworms, superworms, and waxwroms for dirt cheap.
- 50 small Dubia ($12)
Keeping Them:
Crickets:
-kept in a 18 gal, 25.5" 16.5" x 15.5" tall storage container w/ 6" x 12" fine screen stapled onto lid
-kept on shredded aspen bedding
-have a stack of egg cartons
-food: Fluker's High-Calcium Cricket Food mixed with alfalfa powder, and Zilla's Cricket Drink
Dubia:
-kept in a 18 gal, 25.5" 16.5" x 15.5" tall storage container w/ 6" x 12" fine screen stapled onto lid
-kept on shredded aspen bedding
-have a stack of egg cartons w/ heat pad underneath
-food: Fluker's High-Calcium Cricket Food mixed with orange juice powder, and Zilla's Cricket Drink
Phoenix Worms®:
-kept in a small Kritter Keeper or tupperware container
-kept on ???
-food: soft fruits and veggies/ bread soaked in baby food :?
Micro Superworms:
These are the one's I'm torn on right now. I don't know whether I should buy in smaller quantities so that my beardie can eat them before they're too big, or whether to buy the 1000 in the Tiny Herp Combo and just let them be cannibalistic but still have a source of water...
-kept in a small Kritter Keeper or tupperware container
-kept on wheat bran with Fluker's High-Calcium Cricket Food mixed in
-food: the bedding
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