Praziquantel vs Fenbendazole for Tapeworms w/

[Menolly07]

I have a seemingly healthy 3.5 month old male dragon whose fecal float showed a small amount of pins but an EXTREMELY high amount of tapes. My question relates to the use of medication. Normally it seems there's a tendency to treat with Panacur (fenbendazole) in instances of parasites. However, with it being that the case of tapeworm is my primary concern and it being more geared for the tapes I'm wondering if I should try that first then go with the Panacur later on? Has anybody had experience rounding two medications before? I DO plan to treat with lactose free acidophilus during treatment and after.

My approach would be to hit for the tapeworms, give him a break then hit for the pinworms. My worry is that the tapeworm infestation is SO high that it may be better to aim with a medication SPECIFICALLY geared for that parasite even though it does nothing against the pinworms. I do plan to rerun a fecal float after the tapeworm medication has had time to work. I want to recheck everything before medicating for the pinworms. Right now he is having firm stool, good urate but a lot of moisture with his poops. It stinks to high heaven, no surprise, but other than that I wouldn't think he was infested if I hadn't taken his poop apart. The segments are actually visible in his stool to the naked eye, obviously. Eggs are visible under the microscope.

He is eating very well and still putting on weight. I attribute this to his age. There's no signs of lethargy, so, despite him seeming healthy, I'm still considering this an emergency given the potential for a downward turn.

Basically, I'm looking for advice, experience with one medication vs the other.

Did you find fenbendazole (Panacur) adequate to treat a severe tapeworm infestation, or do you feel it would be better to go the alternative route and treat the tapeworm first with praziquantel first then return to the pinworms later?

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

I would treat the tapeworms first, since the levels are so high. Once these levels of tapeworms come down, the pinworm levels may level themselves out & you might not even need to treat them once the Praziquantel round is finished.
The acidophiliz is perfect, it will help a lot while she is on the meds.

That is great he is eating so well despite the levels being so high. Since he is doing so well, that is why I think one medication for now, would be plenty to start with. At his age, his system should metabolize the meds pretty quickly. I would keep his daytime basking temperatures increased slightly to help with his immune system.

Tracie

 

[Menolly07]

Tracie,
I have a CHE, do you think I should keep his nightime temps elevated as well or leave them be? We're wonky weatherwise. It's been cooler lately, even a frost warning last night here in Eastern PA! Inside I've been safely about 75°f, but I'm wondering about keeping him up even more to encourage a good gut Flora bloom too.

I figure he'd just sleep since it'll still be well below the 100° range, only 80°ish. And no light, obviously, since it's the ceramic.

I really hate these tapes. The Panache would be fine save that it's not as effective against Common Tapeworm. He's just got it so bad that I really wasn't sure I shouldn't focus on the tapeworm first. I was leaning that way, sometimes I just need another person's read thru to match up.

I feel better being more hands on anyway. Nothing says dragon fun like fecal floats and a vet who willingly encourages self education.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

The ceramic heat emitter is fine to use, to get the temps up just a little bit to 80 or so. It would help him out a lot at least while he is on the meds.
I really think that once the tapeworm levels fall that the pinworm levels will naturally drop on their own, or at least they should.
How is his appetite today, still munching his insects?

Let me know how he is doing.

Tracie

 

[Menolly07]

Oh my God yes.... He has no issues. I'm feeding him hornworms in addition to the silks (both from Mulberry so I know they're clean). Horns are a high water content worm that I got some of those when this started so I would have yet another way to get moisture into him. He ate three fat ones today.

I'm waiting on the Med to come. I am not pleased that I had to wait, but there was no place to go over the holiday weekend. Emergency vets all said that they were unsure. I never thought about emergency care for the herps. Apparently there is none whatever!

I've got Pedialight in his baths as another precaution. He thinks it's his birthday. He's also getting baby food with food safe diatemateous earth mixed in.

 

[Menolly07]

Tapeworm free!!! We're going to take a break and then go after the pinworms. So far so good. Luckily the appetite has stayed pretty great. We've added dubia and Faranth LOVES them. Oh, that's another thing. Seems he's a she.... :roll:

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

That is great she is doing so much better. So you think that he is actually a female?
I am happy to hear the appetite is doing well also. At least the treatment for tapeworms are over. Are the pinworm levels high?

Tracie

 

[Menolly07]

Yup, we think female. What happened originally is we thought female at six weeks. Then the small mound actually formed a divot/dimple and seemed to be developing into hemipenes! The mound elongated, the dimple seemed to be opening and at about two and a half months we thought we had a male dragon, changed her name and figured she was a he.... Well, cue us back to now, at four and a half months, the mound has devolved back to a condensed and very feminine looking shape.... We're going to be five months on July 14th, so we're thinking it's safe to call us mistaken in the initial determination of male in the first place and just think it was a quirk. A funny quirk, but since she never developed a complete display of hemipenes and a lot of people we showed photos too laughed and said, "Yup, and I can see why you saw it heading that way, but it never QUITE got there," we're thinking that she just thought it would be funny and played a wee trick on us.

As to the Pinworms... They're not at a dangerous level. For instance, the actual worms themselves aren't visible in her poop. I run my own fecals and have Panacur on hand for Odahviing (the year and a half old). I ran her latest fecal and didn't find a terribly high concentration of ovum. However, they were enough so that she definitely will need to be wormed. They're easily findable in the sample at 100x. I'm not comfortable running back to back. I plan to give her two weeks, rerun a float and assess how concentrated they are to determine whether to give her the high dose or the low dose of the Panacur (reweigh her naturally, since she's a growing girl).

As it is, I sequester the two dragons from anything involving crossover contamination. Bathtime doesn't even happen in the same tubs. I bleach out and rinse between bathings with three to one spray, but I'm still neurotic about it. Luckily, with Faranth being small still, she's on newspaper and in a glass tank. She's on a rock hide and basking spot as well. Easy to keep sanitary. She poops in the bath every morning, my husband bathes her as he's getting himself ready for work. Our system is down pat from the tapeworms.

Still have lots of the Benebac left. She did so well with all of that, and I understand the Praziquantel is pretty tough on the system. She didn't enjoy it. The first day was rough. We'd give it to her first thing in the morning so she'd have lots of heat and basking to get it in and through her system while her metabolism was high to cycle it through her tract to where the parasites were. She definitely did not want to eat that first day or the second. She was RAVENOUS the third, and she went nuts for the dubia by then.

She seemed to crave contact more the first two days and was more stand-offish the rest of the time. She's not terribly cuddly yet in general but for later in the day at near bedtime. However, the first day she was very cuddly, preferring to be held on my chest and tucked under my chin. Lots of soaking and water drinking the first two days. Benebac, extra veggies (which she eats with zero issue, miracle of miracles!) and a lot of extra buggies by day three plus normal vit and calcium made it pretty easy going. It did take the whole time to wipe them out.

I figure two weeks, weigh her, do a float to access her infestation levels and choose high vs low dose on the Panacur then go from there with nighttime CHE off in the interim then turned back on while dosing her for the extra metabolism kick. She went on her basking spot to sleep because that's where I aimed the CHE. It didn't seem to offer any ill effects as far as I could tell, stayed about 87 degrees or about there at night. I figure, why mess with it? It didn't hurt, right?