Phoenix vs. Repti worms

[Nixiemaiden]

I am getting ready to order some of one of these but not sure which way to go. I tried the intro cup of Phoenix worms and it went great. It shipped from Georgia priority mail and I am in Florida so it was very quick. I noticed that reptiworms are much much cheaper but in my experience with priority mail from far away states, I have had things take longer than 2-3 days. I had something shipped on a Tuesday and I didn't get it until the following Wednesday for example. So if I ordered from reptiworms I would have to get next day shipping which they don't have a price for on their site. I am really just trying to find out what would be more economical.

Also as a side thing...I still have like 1,000 crickets to feed him so I am doing combination. Worms during his feeding time where I have limited time and crickets when I have more time. If I continue to do this I can stop dusting the crickets correct? I am still doing the multivitamin 2x a week on his salads and gut loading the crickets with orange cubes, yellow gel, and leftover greens.

Also today it looked like he had cricket parts in his poop?

Sorry for so many side topics.

 

[trinity040400]

I order reptiworms and I also live in Florida. I order on Thursdays since thats when I get paid, they only ship Monday thru Wednesday. Last time I got my order Wednesday.

Maybe the cricket legs mean either you temps are not high enough or you are feeding to close to bed time.

 

[Beardednoob]

They are the same thing both are black soldier fly larvae. This would be a personal choice in my opinion.
Ad for the undigested insect parts, I would go back over the UV and basking set up.
What UV are you using? How close can your dragon get to it? Is it obstructed?
How are you measuring the basking temperature? What is it reading?

Did you perhaps feeder him without the proper 2+ hours before lights out?

 

[Nixiemaiden]

Ok thanks. I will try an order with reptiworms and see how it goes.

As for feeding times...yesterday he did not have any crickets because I just got the Phoenix worms and he was going to town on them. He still had 8 or so crickets left in the about to be fed container so I fed him those today around noon time along with about 20 Phoenix worms.

At 5, I found the poop with the cricket parts in it. His basking temp is 103 and I have seen him basking today...also he always poops on his basking rock or right in front of it...this poop was on the cool side of the tank...I wonder if he just didn't bask enough after he ate? Hmm.

 

[Beardednoob]

What thermometer are you using to get the basking temperature? What UV source are you using? How close can he get to it? Is it obstructed?

If this is a one time occurrence I wouldn't worry too much about it, if it happens again in the next week or so then there may be something else wrong.

 

[Nixiemaiden]

I have an infrared gun and I have one of the digital probe ones as well. According to the gun it is 103.

For the uv source I have a reptisun 5.0 24 inch tube (I think 20 gal tank)...it is on top of the screen lid but I have a reflector. He can get within about 4-6 inches of it if he wants too...he usually hangs out on the far side of his hammock which is about 85 degrees and 8 inches from uv tube. His basking spot is 8 inches from uv tube. I just checked on him and he is in the middle of his hammock which is 6 inches from uv.

I do plan on replacing with a reptisun 10.0. I read on here that it is better so I asked my vet and she said this one would be fine for now and when I go to replace it after 6 months to get that one instead. Hopefully that is accurate because this one is only a few weeks old and I would hate to throw out a good bulb...these things are expensive!

 

[Beardednoob]

If she continues to have digestion issues you may want to first try to up her basking spot to 105-110°F, if this still doesn't fix it then I would consider the UV source. :wink:
But, to reiterate, one time, I wouldn't worry.

 

[Nixiemaiden]

So just as a follow up with this I got my reptiworms today and I think I will be sticking with Phoenix Worms unless I am making a mistake here.

The shipping time was the same for both, both were held at the post office.

I ordered the small size of both...the reptiworms are like three times the size which is great if you aren't feeding a baby. These worms are just a tad longer than the space between his eyes so I am not sure if they are safe to feed.

Second...when I got my Phoenix worms they were so lively. I did not have one dead one at all. The reptiworms are just not lively at all. I think that half of them might be dead but I don't know how to tell. They have been at room temperature at least since 3 am when they got to my post office...but a lot of them still aren't moving. If I pick them up with tongs and put them back down they seem to puff out a little but other than that no movement. I would say 75% of them are just still and the rest are wiggly. If they are dead do I need to separate them out? Are the live ones still safe to feed to my boy?

 

[Beardednoob]

To tell if one of the worms or more are dead, they are just very soft and squishy, same can be said for any dead worm. Very limp, if it has dried out it will be very hard in texture. The ones that are just staying still most likely are just a rouse to fool you or would be predator, or are in shed or stasis for metamorphosis.

 

[Nixiemaiden]

To tell if one of the worms or more are dead, they are just very soft and squishy, same can be said for any dead worm. Very limp, if it has dried out it will be very hard in texture. The ones that are just staying still most likely are just a rouse to fool you or would be predator, or are in shed or stasis for metamorphosis.

Should they be safe as long as they aren't dried out then? Also does the same size rule apply to these? I fed him a couple of the smaller ones but not sure if he can eat the bigger ones...not sure if the same rules apply to these as to crickets. If they are safe to feed though that would be awesome because based on the size of these compared to the phoenix worms he would probably only be able to eat like 20 of these.

 

[Beardednoob]

To tell if one of the worms or more are dead, they are just very soft and squishy, same can be said for any dead worm. Very limp, if it has dried out it will be very hard in texture. The ones that are just staying still most likely are just a rouse to fool you or would be predator, or are in shed or stasis for metamorphosis.

Should they be safe as long as they aren't dried out then? Also does the same size rule apply to these? I fed him a couple of the smaller ones but not sure if he can eat the bigger ones...not sure if the same rules apply to these as to crickets. If they are safe to feed though that would be awesome because based on the size of these compared to the phoenix worms he would probably only be able to eat like 20 of these.

Being a soft bodied feeder no the rule doesn't apply as it does with crickets. How long is your dragon?
Yes they are safe as long as they are not dried out, I also wouldn't feed the dead ones either, if you have any.

 

[Nixiemaiden]

Being a soft bodied feeder no the rule doesn't apply as it does with crickets. How long is your dragon?
Yes they are safe as long as they are not dried out, I also wouldn't feed the dead ones either, if you have any.

All of them are soft and squishy though...even the ones that are obviously alive. So I have no idea how to tell if they are dead. If I take them out and put them in a bowl without a lid will they dry up if they are dead? Will they die if they aren't already dead if I do that? These guys are really tricky. I had one that I thought for sure was dead and I took it out and put it on the lid and kept poking at it and after a few minutes, it started wiggling. Other ones that felt exactly the same squishiness from my tongs didn't. Stupid worms. I should probably try to separate them anyway. Does reptiworms do anything different to make their worms dormant before shipping? I am just wondering because the phoenix worms I got were moving like crazy.

He is about 8 inches and 26 grams.

 

[Nixiemaiden]

The worms weren't dead they were just being tricky. Today I opened up their container and it looks like a bunch of them shed? It looks like there is worm skin all over the place. Do they do that? I also have one that turned black...I tried feeding it to Pouncey but he didn't want it. I think it might be dead dunno though. They definitely did not send me small ones though.

Now my next problem arises. I still have about 300 crickets and he wants no part of them. I put him in his bin for 15 minutes with the crickets (not all 300 of them..about 20 like normal) and he just stood there uninterested. He is a baby so I didn't want to withhold so I gave him some worms and he devoured them. He kept taking breaks to go bask but then would run back to the bowl to get more worms. It was funny.

But is there a way to get him to eat crickets again? He still ate the crickets with the Phoenix worms so I don't get it. This is the first time I put him in his bin and he wouldn't eat a single cricket. He always eats at least a few :-/

 

[trinity040400]

Yes the reptiworms do shed, I think it means they are growing. If they are black they are getting ready to turn into flys. The black one are higher in calcium though so they are really good to eat. If you are going to keep them for a while you should try to cool them down though to slow their growth. I ordered 1000 3 weeks ago and have not had 1 die or turn into a fly yet.

 

[Nixiemaiden]

Yes the reptiworms do shed, I think it means they are growing. If they are black they are getting ready to turn into flys. The black one are higher in calcium though so they are really good to eat. If you are going to keep them for a while you should try to cool them down though to slow their growth. I ordered 1000 3 weeks ago and have not had 1 die or turn into a fly yet.

He won't eat the black ones...it is weird. I think it is because they aren't all wiggly like the other ones. Looking through them I found a few more black ones and put them in with him and he ate all except for them.

I unfortunately do not have a way to cool them down. I was expecting small ones so wasn't really prepared for this. I was planning on getting a wine fridge or a mini fridge with a thermostat override just... not yet.