P**sed Off

[RobotRooster]

It does not matter how much i lov my beardie Bo i cannot escape the fact why certain people want the selling of exocic pets banned.

everything i use = bad, not good or could eqaul in death can't you see why people want the selling banned?

everything for beardies companies sell are apparently bad i find this highly unlikely but it just makes me sick that i cannot give my beardie a natural looking enviroment.

i want to use sand, but for some reason i can't because of impaction, now i can understand with cacli-sand how it can cause this but with other sand it does not really make sense. a beardie may catch some up while catching a cricket but i fon't feed inside the closure and when a beardie tastes its surroundings i cannot see getting trapped in its gut, it cannot build up as there needs to be a chunk of it to make it trapped into its digestive system.

i want to use sand not towels, shelf liner or paper it seems unfair on my beardie to see it have nothing compared to the great outdoors

please is there a way i can use sand?

if no then i don't see how there is a valuable agument on why the selling of beardies should be kept legal. even though i and many of you love your beardies so much.

 

[Theresa20]

My beardie has been on sand for over five years, never had any problems with impaction. I think a lot of the advice we hear about proper care is based on opinion. Also, just because it happens once or twice or even 100 times doesn't mean it will happen every time. I understand what you mean about wanting our pets to be comfortable like they would in the wild, but unfortunately these are not wild animals. They have been domesticated and now need different care than they would in the "great outdoors." Are you having problems with your dragon, or is this just a thought that has been troubling you in general?

 

[GoFast]

so because you shouldn't use sand, selling a bearded dragon should be illegal? With all due respect, that is the most ridiculous statement ever. that would be like me saying dogs shouldn't eat peanut butter so selling them should be illegal :dontknow:

 

[xbluex]

When they are older it is not as much of a danger to keep them on sand. I have 2 and they are both on sand. My female has been on sand since I got her because she was an adult already, my male has been on sand for about a year, he was about 8 or 9 months when I switched him over. Before that he was one paper towels and tiles. Only one of my reptiles actually gets sand in his mouth(my berber skink) but he immediatly starts to spit it out and I dont think he's ever actually swallowed any. My beardies and my uro all lick stuff but never lick or 'taste' the sand, only the rocks and walls and logs.
It's not good for them to be on sand when they are so small because they have a much higher risk of impaction and death due to impaction.
Most of the things they sell for reptiles that people tell you is bad it really is bad. Alot of the things like heat rocks, under tank heaters, calci sand, pine, cedar, ect, got started years and years ago before people knew much about these animals. It took alot of trial and error, and probably thousands of hurt, sick, and dead reptiles to find out what we know now. How many people do you think had heat rocks and had a beardie or other reptile die or get seriously burned before the word started going around that they are bad? The pet shops still sell these because people still buy them. If there is money to be made they dont care about what could happen to your animals. And what is even worse is that they have people in every pet store who dont know what theyre talking about, and giving out horrible advice that will kill hundreds, if not thousands, of reptiles.

if no then i don't see how there is a valuable agument on why the selling of beardies should be kept legal. even though i and many of you love your beardies so much.

Dogs were once wild, they had to fend for themselves, and there are many reports from centuries ago about wild dogs killing people. Now if a dog is in that situation it's concidered animal cruelty. Should the selling of dogs be illegal because we are not giving them their natural environment and letting them fend for themselves?
Another thing to concider is the fact that beardies in the wild don't live on the type of sand we have for them. From what I've been told by members here and on other sites that live in or by beardies natural environments, there is very little loose sand on the ground, it is all hard compacted clay type dirt, while the sand most people use is loose play sand. Therefore tiles are really the closest thing to being natural for them. I keep mine on sand because they seem to like it more, they all like to dig and make little holes in the sand for their bellies to rest in, I dont feed inside the enclosure and I don't keep water inside either so that minimizes the risk.

 

[RobotRooster]

so because you shouldn't use sand, selling a bearded dragon should be illegal? With all due respect, that is the most ridiculous statement ever. that would be like me saying dogs shouldn't eat peanut butter so selling them should be illegal :dontknow:

companies don't sell peanut butter especially for dogs, while companies sell "bad products for beardies" honestly reptiglo apparently bad because it irritates the eyes yet they are still sold, compact bulbs do something bad also but still sold, calci sand is sold and is a cause of impaction and all these are sold by companies for the use of reptiles, yet many people will go blindly buying these products often recomended by shops unknowingly knowing about the "causes"

for a dog it would be the quivelent of giving a dog a staple diet of dairy milk recomend by a shopkeep, which is very harmful.

 

[Theresa20]

so because you shouldn't use sand, selling a bearded dragon should be illegal? With all due respect, that is the most ridiculous statement ever. that would be like me saying dogs shouldn't eat peanut butter so selling them should be illegal :dontknow:

companies don't sell peanut butter especially for dogs, while companies sell "bad products for beardies" honestly reptiglo apparently bad because it irritates the eyes yet they are still sold, compact bulbs do something bad also but still sold, calci sand is sold and is a cause of impaction and all these are sold by companies for the use of reptiles, yet many people will go blindly buying these products often recomended by shops unknowingly knowing about the "causes"

This is why it is important for owners to do their research before buying a pet. Just because it's on the shelf doesn't mean you have to buy it.

 

[RobotRooster]

if no then i don't see how there is a valuable agument on why the selling of beardies should be kept legal. even though i and many of you love your beardies so much.

Dogs were once wild, they had to fend for themselves, and there are many reports from centuries ago about wild dogs killing people. Now if a dog is in that situation it's concidered animal cruelty. Should the selling of dogs be illegal because we are not giving them their natural environment and letting them fend for themselves?
Another thing to concider is the fact that beardies in the wild don't live on the type of sand we have for them. From what I've been told by members here and on other sites that live in or by beardies natural environments, there is very little loose sand on the ground, it is all hard compacted clay type dirt, while the sand most people use is loose play sand. Therefore tiles are really the closest thing to being natural for them. I keep mine on sand because they seem to like it more, they all like to dig and make little holes in the sand for their bellies to rest in, I dont feed inside the enclosure and I don't keep water inside either so that minimizes the risk.

some people want the selling of dogs illegal e.g. PETA but i do not agree with that, the reason why dogs are not wild no more is because their natural enviroment has disapeared due to houses, and in the past they were consider rats as the only place they were found when their natural enviroment dissapeard was the streets of london and as such.

i am just really annoyed, there always seems to be an argument on both sides on the use of such products. a lot of people have seemed to use sand for beardies since when the beardies were babies but others seem to have impaction apparently from the sand. neither side is bias and it makes it awfully difficult to choose the right products for my beardie.

 

[RobotRooster]

so because you shouldn't use sand, selling a bearded dragon should be illegal? With all due respect, that is the most ridiculous statement ever. that would be like me saying dogs shouldn't eat peanut butter so selling them should be illegal :dontknow:

companies don't sell peanut butter especially for dogs, while companies sell "bad products for beardies" honestly reptiglo apparently bad because it irritates the eyes yet they are still sold, compact bulbs do something bad also but still sold, calci sand is sold and is a cause of impaction and all these are sold by companies for the use of reptiles, yet many people will go blindly buying these products often recomended by shops unknowingly knowing about the "causes"

This is why it is important for owners to do their research before buying a pet. Just because it's on the shelf doesn't mean you have to buy it.

everything on the shelf is considered bad for beardies, and many people who do research ask the shopkeeper

 

[Theresa20]

everything on the shelf is considered bad for beardies, and many people who do research ask the shopkeeper

That's simply not true. There are many items that you can purchase at pet stores that are completely safe for your dragons. And not everyone is an *****. Look at all the people who are on this site trying to find the correct care information for their pets? I think this argument is getting pretty silly.

 

[RobotRooster]

everything on the shelf is considered bad for beardies, and many people who do research ask the shopkeeper

That's simply not true. There are many items that you can purchase at pet stores that are completely safe for your dragons. And not everyone is an *****. Look at all the people who are on this site trying to find the correct care information for their pets? I think this argument is getting pretty silly.

its not an argument i just want natural substrate, want to know how many people use sand

 

[Theresa20]

In that case, I apologize! Hopefully you can find what you are looking for. Good luck in your search.

 

[BarkAtTheMoon]

My, My, My. Hope you have a good cardiologist. Do you let everything get you so upset? Take a deep, cleansing breath. Count to ten. Now then. First, try to realize that loose sand is not natural for Inland Bearded Dragons, which is what most of us have and I assume you have. Pet stores have a "reptile aisle" and most manufacturers don't differentiate between all the different reptiles because they don't want to lose a sale. If a consumer is willing to buy a loose sand intended for a desert reptile and put their eucalyptus forest reptile on it, well, so be it. You can't sue them for an unhappy beardie.
What you do with your viv is up to you. Don't get upset about it. But don't do your beardie a disservice either. And don't query "Bearded Dragon habitat" on the net cause most of what you get is crap. It's no wonder the Aussie's are so protective. We're not worthy yet. Use query terms that will get you real information about where beardies live in Australia. You'll be surprised at what you find. They are not desert reptiles. Arid does not necessarily mean desert. It simply means low moisture, or low humidity. Their primary habitat is the eucalyptus forest. You want to talk about getting upset? You want to talk about natural? Nothing is sadder than all the beardies being kept in enclosures with no branches to climb and no where to go, and nothing to do but lie on the ground. This is not natural. Given a choice, you won't catch a healthy, happy dragon on the "ground" unless it's hungry and on the hunt. This is how I know mine are hungry. Their instincts tell them it's too risky to just hang out there and/or sleep there. In the wild, it could get them killed by a predator.
If you're really a natural freak, then forget the sand. Think forest. A natural basking rock. It keeps the nails trimmed naturally, it holds heat (check it with a temp gun to make sure it doesn't hold it too well), and they like the feel of it. A couple of large branches that will hold his weight even when he's as big as he'll get. A couple of plastic plants to hang in the back. I made and mounted a platform on the end of one of my branches out of a smaller, pliable branch and hid it in the plant and my beardie sleeps on it. He feels hidden, safe, and secure.
Do some real research. Make a difference in a beardie's life. Be part of the solution. He'll love you for it.
Jessie

 

[RobotRooster]

In that case, I apologize! Hopefully you can find what you are looking for. Good luck in your search.

don't apologize in some case at the start i think iwas looking for an argument because i was annoyed but since i calmed down im not quite sure why i started like i did, but thanks anyway,

i just want to use something not meant for a kitchen floor

 

[RobotRooster]

My, My, My. Hope you have a good cardiologist. Do you let everything get you so upset? Take a deep, cleansing breath. Count to ten. Now then. First, try to realize that loose sand is not natural for Inland Bearded Dragons, which is what most of us have and I assume you have. Pet stores have a "reptile aisle" and most manufacturers don't differentiate between all the different reptiles because they don't want to lose a sale. If a consumer is willing to buy a loose sand intended for a desert reptile and put their eucalyptus forest reptile on it, well, so be it. You can't sue them for an unhappy beardie.
What you do with your viv is up to you. Don't get upset about it. But don't do your beardie a disservice either. And don't query "Bearded Dragon habitat" on the net cause most of what you get is crap. It's no wonder the Aussie's are so protective. We're not worthy yet. Use query terms that will get you real information about where beardies live in Australia. You'll be surprised at what you find. They are not desert reptiles. Arid does not necessarily mean desert. It simply means low moisture, or low humidity. Their primary habitat is the eucalyptus forest. You want to talk about getting upset? You want to talk about natural? Nothing is sadder than all the beardies being kept in enclosures with no branches to climb and no where to go, and nothing to do but lie on the ground. This is not natural. Given a choice, you won't catch a healthy, happy dragon on the "ground" unless it's hungry and on the hunt. This is how I know mine are hungry. Their instincts tell them it's too risky to just hang out there and/or sleep there. In the wild, it could get them killed by a predator.
If you're really a natural freak, then forget the sand. Think forest. A natural basking rock. It keeps the nails trimmed naturally, it holds heat (check it with a temp gun to make sure it doesn't hold it too well), and they like the feel of it. A couple of large branches that will hold his weight even when he's as big as he'll get. A couple of plastic plants to hang in the back. I made and mounted a platform on the end of one of my branches out of a smaller, pliable branch and hid it in the plant and my beardie sleeps on it. He feels hidden, safe, and secure.
Do some real research. Make a difference in a beardie's life. Be part of the solution. He'll love you for it.
Jessie

thank you for writing that, apreciate it

 

[xbluex]

so because you shouldn't use sand, selling a bearded dragon should be illegal? With all due respect, that is the most ridiculous statement ever. that would be like me saying dogs shouldn't eat peanut butter so selling them should be illegal :dontknow:

companies don't sell peanut butter especially for dogs, while companies sell "bad products for beardies" honestly reptiglo apparently bad because it irritates the eyes yet they are still sold, compact bulbs do something bad also but still sold, calci sand is sold and is a cause of impaction and all these are sold by companies for the use of reptiles, yet many people will go blindly buying these products often recomended by shops unknowingly knowing about the "causes"

for a dog it would be the quivelent of giving a dog a staple diet of dairy milk recomend by a shopkeep, which is very harmful.

It is very confusing to know what to get and what not to get. It's this way with any pet you'll ever have. How do you know which dog or cat food is best? Some of the dog foods out there have no nutritional value what-so-ever. They sell pine and cedar bedding for rabbits when most people know that the fumes that pine and cedar put off when they get wet is very harmfull. They sell those tube things for rats and hampsters telling the buyer its perfectly safe and fun, but if the animal is too big they could get stuck in it. There are like 100000 different types of bird food, but some arent good for certain birds. You just have to do the research and know what you want before you go. I don't listen to anything the petshops tell me. Once I was in a petsmart checking out the baby beardies (not even 6 inches long) and the 'reptile expert' - you know, the guy who comes up who knows everything there is to know about every reptile in the store- tells me, 'They make wonderfull pets, especially if you have children. You can feed them people food-I feed mine pizza sometimes- and they will never get bigger than they are right now'