Ozma's legs aren't working properly.

[Shekibobo]

I moved about two weeks ago, and since then, Ozma (approximately 2-year-old female) has seemed pretty happy with the new setup. She's been active, eating lots, and even seems to get along well with the cat. However, just today, I noticed a twitch in her back legs. I immediately started to worry, as I've read that is a symptom of metabolic bone disease - a very serious problem. I immediately went out and bought a new UVB bulb, which I hadn't been using because of the loss of appetite that her previous UVB bulb (ReptiGlo 10.0) had been causing.

As soon as I saw this, I went to the store, bought a Zilla T8 Fluorescent bulb, as all the stores around seemed to stop selling reptisun. I also picked up a bottle of Zilla calcium supplement food spray, a 150W zoomed basking spot lamp (her previous one was only 50W), and a dropper for the supplement.

After I got home, I gave Ozma a bath where she pooped quite readily (saved it in a ziplock for a potential vet visit), and let her sleep wrapped in a towel for about a half hour. But I also noticed that she is really struggling to use her hind legs. Her front arms seem to be working alright, but every time she tries to use her back legs, they twitch erratically and seem to have very little strength. When she was crawling around on my belly after her bath, she tried to turn around and her legs just ended up getting dragged behind her.

I sprayed her lettuce and carrots with the calcium supplement and hooked up the new lights, and gave her a few drops of the calcium supplement from the dropper. I'm terrified and worried. I found out about a vet nearby through PetCo that supposedly treats bearded dragons, and I'm hoping to set up an appointment this coming week.

Is this treatable? Is it too late for her to recover fully? She seemed to be doing just fine a couple days ago, but has definitely been moving less the last couple of days. Am I responding to this properly? Please help, I'm freaking out here.

 

[Dragoon]

It could an impaction.

 

[Shekibobo]

It could an impaction.

Could it? It's been a couple days since she had pooped and she did feel a bit bloated today when i picked her up, but like I said, after I put her in the bath, she pooped after floating for only a couple of minutes.

I don't know what that pink thing is wrapped in white junk, but it was really solid - all the other parts of her poop seemed fairly squishy, but that thing was just a solid, unsquishy, but smooth, clump. Almost shaped like an egg. If she was impacted, and that was the cause, would she have recovered by now? I'm no expert, but it just doesn't seem to me that impaction fits the symptoms.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

No most likely it is not an impaction, but calcium absorption related. Her stool looked normal, overall.
I hate to have to tell you this, but, the Zilla light is no better than the Reptiglo 10 is. The only tube bulb in the US that is worth a darn is the Reptisun 10 tube. You can get it for only around $20 here:
http://www.petmountain.com/product/reptile-fluorescent-bulbs/504983/zoo-med-reptisun-10.0-uvb-bulb.html

The Zilla spray is ok, but if she is having that much problem with muscular twitches, her levels are very low. You should dose it for her from a dropper or syringe instead of just spraying it on food, etc. Does it say what the milligrams are per milliliter on the spray bottle?
I don't know if they have changed the strength. If you can look on the bottle & then give me your dragon's weight, I will dose it for you to ensure she gets enough for her system.

How is her appetite?
If you get to the vets, they can do a blood test to determine her calcium levels for you.

Tracie

 

[Shekibobo]

No most likely it is not an impaction, but calcium absorption related. Her stool looked normal, overall.

I'm still wondering what that big pink thing is.

I hate to have to tell you this, but, the Zilla light is no better than the Reptiglo 10 is. The only tube bulb in the US that is worth a darn is the Reptisun 10 tube. You can get it for only around $20 here:
http://www.petmountain.com/product/reptile-fluorescent-bulbs/504983/zoo-med-reptisun-10.0-uvb-bulb.html

How do all these companies get away with making bad bulbs? And why do all the pet stores carry and recommend bulbs that are so dangerous to reptiles?

The Zilla spray is ok, but if she is having that much problem with muscular twitches, her levels are very low. You should dose it for her from a dropper or syringe instead of just spraying it on food, etc. Does it say what the milligrams are per milliliter on the spray bottle?

I gave her some of the calcium solution from a dropper last night. The bottle says:

For use in animals with calcium deficiency: Administer 3 dropps orally every day. Consult a veterinarian in cases involving extreme metabolic bone disease (loss of movement in rear limbs, inability to close lower jaw, fractured or broken limbs due to calcium loss).

I don't know if they have changed the strength. If you can look on the bottle & then give me your dragon's weight, I will dose it for you to ensure she gets enough for her system.

Guaranteed Analysis:
Calcium (Min)................1700 ppm

How is her appetite?

As of yesterday, she was still eating lettuce and crickets, but is having a much harder time moving around her cage. She still likes to perch and I think she has a hard time getting down from her perching spots. She hasn't yet eaten any of the lettuce and carrots I cut and sprayed for her yesterday, but she had already eaten by the point I put together her salad.

Here's a picture of her in her cage as of today, to show the setup I've got for her.

Both of the spotlights are reptisun, I'm working on replacing the UVB. The water is in there, but she never drinks it.

Thanks so much for your help.

 

[Shekibobo]

So, I gave Ozma another dose of the calcium from a dropper. And she has one hell of a bite. She ended up biting down on it and shattering the tip of the dropper. From the looks of it, there were a couple of pieces that shattered off, and I only found one of them. I think they kind of went all over the place, so I'm really hoping they just went really really far. She seems okay - but would she act strangely if she had broken glass in her mouth?

I've definitely learned a lesson here. Gotta get a plastic dropper and find out exactly how much of this stuff I should be giving her rather than just the "three drops" as the bottle suggests. Very subjective.

Any advice on this new and unsettling development? Or the original issue? She's still having trouble with her legs.

 

[Shekibobo]

I bought a new plastic syringe-style dropper for Ozma's calcium supplement. She ate two orange pieces today that I know of before I had to leave for the day. She still has the shaking and weak legs. I'm calling the vet tomorrow afternoon. Hopefully I can afford a visit. Otherwise I guess I'm just going to need to keep going on this treatment.

This is still an open issue. Does anyone have any experience or other advice they can give me? I still can't believe how quickly this all seemed to set in.

A little more information regarding Ozma:

How old is your dragon?
About 2 years old.
How long have you had your dragon?
Since October 2008.
How long is your dragon?
She's about 16 inches long. Might be considered longer, though, as the tip of her tail had been lost as a baby.
What is the sex of your dragon?
Female.
What size enclosure do you have your dragon in?
50 gallons - 18"x18"x36"
What type substrate do you have on the bottom of your tank?
Ceramic tiles.
Do you use UVB lights?
Currently using a Zilla T8 while awaiting delivery of a ReptiSun 10.0. Used to use a ReptiGlo 10.0, but stopped a few months ago as it was causing her to lose her appetite.
If so, Is it a coil, compact, fluorescent tube, or Mercury Vapor bulb?
Fluorescent tube, 18".
What is the brand name and number of your bulb? Wattage (if MVB)?
15W, I think.
How old is your UVB bulb?
Brand new.
How close can your dragon get to the UVB?
Within 6".
Do you use a separate basking bulb? What kind and what is the wattage?
Yes, I have two basking bulbs. One is a 60W ReptiSun, the other is a 150W reptisun.
What are the basking temps?
Around 105-110F on the 150W side, about 80 F on the other.
What is the cool side temp?
Around 70-80F in the cooler spots.
Do you take the temps with a stick on thermometer, a digital thermometer with a wire and a probe end or a temp gun?
Temp gun.
Where exactly are you taking your basking temps?
On her body, on the heat rock, on the wall-mounted logs.
Do you use a heat rock or heat pad?
No.
What do you feed your dragon? Please be specific.
Mostly I feed her crickets. I haven't been dusting them lately, and I greatly regret it. Otherwise I mostly feed her red romaine lettuce. Occasionally I will feed her strawberry pieces. Today, I successfully fed her a couple of orange pieces. She usually doesn't eat when I put in carrots, though I'm thinking about just using mixed veggies in her oranges and lettuce.
How often do you feed and what time do you feed (morning, afternoon, night)?
I usually put in some veggies in the afternoon, crickets probably around the same time. I usually let some extra crickets crawl around in there for her to snack on. We don't actually have a regular feeding schedule, but I'm changing that in light of her recent condition.
Do you gutload (feed) your crickets, worms, etc?
I thought I was. Apparently either I wasn't doing it correctly or it simply wasn't enough to do that.
Do you use vitamin or calcium supplements? What brand(s)? How many days a week do you use each of them?
I do now. I used to do the dusting thing, but haven't done that in a while. I recently started using Zilla Calcium Supplement spray (1700ppm) and spray that on her veggies every day. I'm also feeding a few drops of that to her through a syringe once a day to help get her calcium up.
Is your dragon having regular bowel movements (poops)?
She was having little ones every day with good regularity. For a long time it was pretty sporadic, though. A couple times a week, maybe, she'd have really big bowel movements. She pooped about two days ago during her bath, and the sample is posted above.
Do you bath your dragon? How often?
Not as often as I should. Probably once every two weeks. Again, trying to change that.
Do you mist your dragon or offer water other than in the bath?
I offer a dish of water regularly, but I've never actually seen her drink. I don't spray. She's never drank while in her bath.
Does your dragon share an enclosure with another dragon?
She's my only dragon.
Have you gotten a vet check and fecal done?
Never been to a vet with her.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

Do you know your dragon's weight? If so, I will dose her accordingly. How is she doing today?
I am sorry she is still having so much trouble getting around.
There is no regulation on the reptile lights in the reptile industry so that is why they can put out poor quality lights. It isn't right but they manage to get away with it. I think since you were using the Reptiglo 10 previously, that has contributed to the lower calcium levels now. The Reptiglo 10 is not a very good light, either. Now, the Zilla, so her system just has not been able to absorb the calcium properly.
Once you get the Reptisun 10 tube bulb on her, you should begin to see a marked difference, along with the calcium daily. Please get me her weight as soon as possible so we can treat her for metabolic bone disease.
Great that you got a plastic dropper, they are somewhat notorious for biting off the ends of droppers & syringes! I hope that she did not get any small pieces of glass into her system. Unfortunately you will just have to wait it out & make sure she has plenty of fluids & food in her to help anything pass through. Perhaps none got into her system, we can hope!
This is very treatable & can be reversed to where it will not cause bone deviations. Hopefully it has been caught in early stages right now, but the proper light & calcium is crucial to her survival. The muscular problems are due to neuromuscular lock up because without adequate calcium stores her nerves & muscles cannot fire properly & will seize up & freeze.
I keep forgetting to mention the urates, & the pinkish color. It appears to be just urate buildup which is fairly common with them.
Please keep us posted & do get me her bodyweight so we can get her on the proper dose of calcium immediately.

Tracie

 

[zebraflavencs]

I would like to address her diet as well , if I might... Romaine, carrots, and other leaf lettuces just don't do the job really..
This is a great list I use as a guide :
http://www.beautifuldragons.503xtreme.com/Nutrition.html
You can use Green coded for daily foods, and Black for treats 1-2 times a week.
Hope this helps out.

 

[Shekibobo]

Thanks, I've already started addressing the diet issue. Romaine is out, collard and mustard greens, green beans, and squash are in. I wasn't aware that those were so readily available and also so cheap! I've learned quite a bit in the last couple days.

 

[zebraflavencs]

That's great to hear ! You can also grow most of those in a large pot right outside your door. I tend to grow most of my dragons' veggies in raised gardens, pots and in my greenhouse so I don't worry what chemicals might be used from shops, groceries.

 

[Shekibobo]

I've definitely been thinking about it. Seeds are on sale all over the place right now. I'll start researching that pretty soon.

 

[Drache613]

Hello Josh,

How is Ozma doing today? I hope he is active & eating for you today. Keep us posted.
How did he take the calcium, does he seem to like it?

Tracie

 

[Shekibobo]

I gave her some calcium this morning, she seemed to like it. But I haven't been home all day and won't be home until late tonight, so I don't really know what's going on today. She didn't eat anything yesterday, but I left her some food this morning. I'm going to call my girlfriend and see if she's noticed anything today.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

I hope she is doing well today. Great that she is taking the calcium well, also. Please keep us posted on her. Maybe her appetite will pick up soon, also.

Tracie