Need a Beardie vet in SW Ontario ASAP!!!

[binger]

Hey guys,

I think I need to get my baby boy to a vet, but the only one I've heard of in my area has a HORRIBLE reputation! I'm in Guelph, kinda close to Kitchener / Waterloo / Cambridge area.

He went limp in the tub today, I thought he was dead!!! His eyes looked dead, he was completely lifeless, and I couldn't tell if he was breathing. I took him out, massaged him, and held him... after 20-30 seconds he opened his eyes and his beard was BLACK... he started breathing heavily, making some grunting noises, and I just sat and held him in his burrito. After 5-10 minutes, he seemed ok, so I put him in his viv, kept an eye on him, and everything seemed fine. I've read this has happened to a couple other people, but nobody seems to know the cause.

I'm just really freaked out. He's only willing to eat hornworms, which, at $2 each, isn't realistic for me. He doesn't want his salad, crickets, or even superworms. He turns his head to all of them. He used to eat TONS before brumation, but the past two weeks, he really seems dis-interested in his food. Maybe he's just spoiled, but I need him to start eating normally... for his health, and my wallet. He should be eating lots of greens now, from what I've read. Over the past week, I've put everything I can think of into his salad, including Raddichio, rosemary, snow peas, green beans, strawberries, apples, banannas...I even tried feeding him some warm Squash babyfood from a feeding syringe. He licked at it for a minute, then walked away.

Now the usual questions:

How old is your dragon? 1 year, 4 months (approx....was a rescue)
How long is your dragon? 16 inches
What size enclosure do you have your dragon in? 4x2x2
What type substrate do you have on the bottom of your tank? Stone Tile
Do you use UVB lights? Yes
If so, Is it a coil, compact, fluorescent tube, or Mercury Vapor bulb? Fluorescent Tube
What is the brand name and number of your bulb? Wattage (if MVB)? Repti-Sun 10.0
How old is your UVB bulb? 3 Months
How close can your dragon get to the UVB? 5-7 Inches
Do you use a separate basking bulb? What kind and what is the wattage? 100w SunGlo Tight Beam
What are the basking temps? 101-105f
What is the cool side temp? 79-85
Do you take the temps with a stick on thermometer, a digital thermometer with a wire and a probe end or a temp gun? Laser Temp Gun
Where exactly are you taking your basking temps? Inside the enclosure, on basking surface
Do you use a heat rock or heat pad? no
What do you feed your dragon? Please be specific. Used to eat crickets, dandilion greens, superworms... now, only Hornworms
How often do you feed and what time do you feed (morning, afternoon, night)? greens in morning, worms in afternoon
Do you gutload (feed) your crickets, worms, etc? Crickets yes (used to), worms no
Do you use vitamin or calcium supplements? What brand(s)? How many days a week do you use each of them? Rep-Cal Phos. free with D3, and Flukers Repti-Vitamin --- since he's eating so infrequently, I'm alternating them when he does eat.
Is your dragon having regular bowel movements (poops)? Almost daily in the viv, but smaller than usual. Always poops in the tub.
Do you bath your dragon? How often? every 2-3 days
Do you mist your dragon or offer water other than in the bath? if he's gaping, he gets a mist.
Does your dragon share an enclosure with another dragon? Not since 2 weeks ago...just after brumation, they mated, and we seperated them.

Thanks in advance!

 

[ErinMeetsMachine]

i wish your beardie gets better soon! and stops being picky...

 

[Tigg]

Your best bet would be to make the drive to Toronto. High Park Animal Hospital is absolutely great with BD's!!

 

[Grommet]

Hi Binger! How is your beardie doing? Were you able to track down a vet within feasible driving distance? Any luck getting your beardie to eat? Your enclosure sounds spot on, so I don't think it's something you are doing. Has he been acting this way since you separated him from the female? Perhaps he has relocation stress, or is upset that the female is gone. I hope he calms himself over the next week, if you haven't gotten him to a vet for an exam and fecal by then. Is his poo firm or loose?

Hand feeding is your best bet at this point. Collard greens are much easier than mustards for hand feeding because they are firm enough to slip between you beardies lips (gently). Once you get your beardie chewing you can place a few more pieces (one at a time, and make sure they are small) in his mouth. Smaller worms like phoenix or butterworms are easy to place in mouth using this technique as well. Another option is to make a slurry with canned pumpkin, apple sauce, baby food, crickets, and greens, calcium, vitamins - or any other food that ok for beardies, the softer the better when they're sick. Try the syringe, or a spoon, and if you can't get him to lick it off, you can GENTLY put the syringe in your beardies mouth. Perhaps a jumpstart formula would be helpful also, I hear beardies really like the stuff.

Keep us posted with updates!
Kailin

 

[binger]

Hi Binger! How is your beardie doing? Were you able to track down a vet within feasible driving distance? Any luck getting your beardie to eat? Your enclosure sounds spot on, so I don't think it's something you are doing. Has he been acting this way since you separated him from the female? Perhaps he has relocation stress, or is upset that the female is gone. I hope he calms himself over the next week, if you haven't gotten him to a vet for an exam and fecal by then. Is his poo firm or loose?

Hand feeding is your best bet at this point. Collard greens are much easier than mustards for hand feeding because they are firm enough to slip between you beardies lips (gently). Once you get your beardie chewing you can place a few more pieces (one at a time, and make sure they are small) in his mouth. Smaller worms like phoenix or butterworms are easy to place in mouth using this technique as well. Another option is to make a slurry with canned pumpkin, apple sauce, baby food, crickets, and greens, calcium, vitamins - or any other food that ok for beardies, the softer the better when they're sick. Try the syringe, or a spoon, and if you can't get him to lick it off, you can GENTLY put the syringe in your beardies mouth. Perhaps a jumpstart formula would be helpful also, I hear beardies really like the stuff.

Keep us posted with updates!
Kailin

I haven't been able to find anyone closer than Toronto, which is over an hours drive.... so I'm still looking. If I have to head to Toronto, I will..but hopefully won't have to.

He's been glass dancing constantly, basically all of this behaviour has been since they were seperated... I'm hopeful it's a mating season behaviour, or something related to the seperation... and I'm hopeful it will end soon! His poops are fairly firm and regular, but smaller than normal. I've tried squash babyfood in a syringe, and he licked it a few times, but then walked away.... I hate the idea of forcing the syringe into his mouth, but if I have to, I will. He's been very fussy and hasn't really enjoyed his snuggles lately, so it'll be a chore to feed him.

I have a tube of the appetite stimulant, but he licks it once and runs away... I've never seen a pickier eater!!! He ate one hornworm yesterday, but that was all I saw. He COULD be nibbling his veggies when I'm not around, but it really doesn't look like it.

I'll update if anything changes.
Thanks!

 

[Grommet]

Thanks for the update!

Can your dragons see each other in their separate tanks? Even a glimpse or a reflection, a mirror that is showing the male the female? That could be causing the activity. Does your dragon get to run around your house. That might help get a bit of his energy out ("glass dancing" is my dragons way of saying, "LET ME OUT NOW!!!!")

Do try collard greens before the syringe. The slip very easily between your beardies jaw and will allow you to place more in his mouth while he is chewing. It is a chore, but when your beardie is back up to a good health, he will eat again on his own.

Try bumping up his baths to every day, to keep him hydrated as he's not eating greens which provide most of your dragons water.

Double check that your dragon is a male.... seems like a simple answer. If your beardie is a female, all the symptoms you have listed would lead to getting ready to lay eggs (loss of appetite, increased of energy, glass dancing, frantic). When you say the two "mated," are you saying that the other dragon is laying eggs? Female beardies can lay eggs without a male. They just come out infertile.

Just an idea.....

Kailin

 

[binger]

Thanks for the update!

Can your dragons see each other in their separate tanks? Even a glimpse or a reflection, a mirror that is showing the male the female? That could be causing the activity. Does your dragon get to run around your house. That might help get a bit of his energy out ("glass dancing" is my dragons way of saying, "LET ME OUT NOW!!!!")

Try bumping up his baths to every day, to keep him hydrated as he's not eating greens which provide most of your dragons water.

Double check that your dragon is a male.... seems like a simple answer. If your beardie is a female, all the symptoms you have listed would lead to getting ready to lay eggs (loss of appetite, increased of energy, glass dancing, frantic). When you say the two "mated," are you saying that the other dragon is laying eggs? Female beardies can lay eggs without a male. They just come out infertile.

Kailin

They're about 20 feet across the room from one another.... but I'll bet they can see each other.... I might beardie proof the room today and let him have a run. Should I let them roam together, or one at a time?

I'm happy to bath him daily, but he HATES it... always has. That little "episode" he had last week (read above) scared the heck out of me... so I'm nervous every time I bath him now.

As far as gender and mating... I've checked them, taken them to my local pet store (where my friend specializes in herp), and we're all about 90% sure that he's a boy and she's a girl.... and last week I caught him mating with her... he bit her by the neck, hopped on, and did his business with her... so we're pretty darn sure.

She's acting fairly normal, eating normally, doing a bit of glass dancing.... her usual behaviour. She does tend to sit at the front of her viv and stare across the room when he's dancing... but nothing to make me worry about her. I'm not sure what "normal" mating behaviour is for beardies, but from what I've read, this is the time of year they'll get their "urges".

 

[Grommet]

Yes, I would be nervous about the baths too - sounds like a very scary experience, and I do hope others post as to why your beardie had that episode. Keep up with the baths though. Use less water, make sure it's temped well, put down a towel or something your dragon won't slip around on, and perhaps let your beardie get his energy out before you attempt to bathe him so he'll be more likely to chill out. Only his vent needs to be covered, so if his upper body is raised, that's okay until he gets more into bathing in general. Sometimes, with Grommet (who also hated baths when I got her), I would let her rest her upper body on my hand while her rear stayed under water.... a little high maintenance, I know, but we are "slaves" to their whim!

I wouldn't be surprised if your male continues being stressed until you get the female away from his line of view. No, I don't think that now is a good time to let them run around together if his stress is affecting his eating habits. If you are able, house them in a different rooms altogether and see if that helps.

Do get to a vet about the pass out in the bath..... I hope someone else here will chip in with advice.....

Kailin