lethargic dragon

[Beardo50]

Hey everyone first time on forum maybe someone can give me some insight to whats happening with my dragoon. I have a 4 year old male and he has gotten very lethargic/lazy in the last 6 months.He lays around on the bottom of the tank and doesn't use his basking area unless i put him there. He eats very little fruits and veggies or greens. stopped eating crickets years ago but has been eating superworms, the morphed beetles from the supers,hornworms, and i just got some dubia roaches which he gobbled up. Only defecates once a week in his bath. He is not losing weight and has no visible signs of infections or sickness. I have him in a 55 gallon sized enclosure with a sand mat for flooring. The temp under his heat bulb which is 150w is about 102 degrees and the cool end is 77 degrees. I have two high output 10.0 uvb bulbs across the top of the enclosure. I don't think its brumation as six months is a little long to be brumating. Any advice info is muchly appreciated.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

His set up sounds good. Which brand of the HO tube bulbs are you using & are they on top of the screen? Are they a 5% or a 10% T5? What type of basking light are you using, is it a bright white bulb or a red or other colored bulb?
Do you have a picture of your set up also as well as one of him too?
How often do you give calcium & do you give regular or plain calcium or calcium with D3?
Some can brumate for 4-6 months but if it's starting to go a little longer than that, I would maybe consider getting a fecal done on him. You could also take any hides/caves out also, if he goes in there, too for encouraging him to bask more.
Which greens/veggies have you tried for him? Adults can get quite picky sometimes I know & getting them to eat greens & veggies is a real challenge.

Tracie

 

[Beardo50]

Thanks for the reply drache613

The heat bulb that i'm using is a zoo med 150w basking bulb. The fluorescent tubes on top of the screen are also zoo meds t5 10.0. The calcium is with d3 and its (minor all 1) which i have been using for years with different reptiles with good results. I have been dosing once per week but he hasn't been eating very well so he probably isn't getting to much lately. As for the greens i have tried pretty much everything my grocery store has to offer including collards,dandy lion,kale,rapini,escarole,bok choy,swiss chard. As for fruits and veggies he rarely eats them but on occasion he will eat strawberries and apple. I would like to send pics but couldn't figure out how?

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

You can go here to post some pictures:

https://www.beardeddragon.org/useruploads/#new

The T5 Reptisun 10 HO light is perfectly fine, even being placed on top of the screen. How far away is it from him then?
As far as I know, the Miner-All should be fine for him. Are you in the UK or the states? Since he isn't eating much of anything, you can get some greens & mix them with the calcium & a little bit of apple or cranberry juice to make a slurry to feed him. Or you can try some chicken or turkey baby food mixed with squash or sweet potato baby food to feed him.
That is good he isn't losing weight though. Has he previously ever eaten greens or veggies or is this a recent behavioral change?
I would consider getting a fecal done on him to be sure he doesn't have worms or parasites. You could think about getting a blood test done too, just to be sure his kidneys & liver are doing fine.

Let us know how he is doing.
Tracie

 

[Beardo50]

The reptisun is 12" from his perch. I'm in ontario canada. I'm just wondering if its the lack of supplement in his food as like i said he hasn't been eating very much so he is not getting the calcium and minerals that he needs. He never was a good veggie/ green eater and i know they take to this later in life but he never really took to these things. He would pick and choose what he ate probably like all dragons. He would rather have live bugs than a plate of greens or veggies. I tried to get him on the commercial dragon pellets but he wouldn't touch them. I used to have a few years ago a powder you could mix with water which would put electrolytes and minerals back into them and maybe that's whats needed to get him back on the right track only problem is he doesn't drink when you drop on his nose in fact i have never seen this guy drink at all. I'm assuming he gets his moisture from his baths and whatever greens he does eat. He hates to be sprayed and my house is all electric heat so there is little to no humidity in the air. Having said all that they are desert reptiles and can go for long periods without moisture as they store it in their bodies. I don't know what do you think?

 

[Beardo50]

Well drache i went down to see my dragon today and he fell off his perch which i thought was weird. So i put him on the ground to run around as i usually do and he looked like he was drunk. His body started to roll to one side and he would flip around. When he walks he staggers back and forth like he cant keep his weight supported. I tried to pick him up and he flipped around almost to the point that he was on his back in my hands. He is banging into walls and seems to have lost his equilibrium? I am waiting for a fecal result but if there is anything in the mean time you can suggest to do it would be much appreciated. thanx for your help.

 

[CooperDragon]

That sounds pretty serious. I wonder if he has an inner ear problem or something worse. How far are you from Guelph? The University has a small animal clinic which may be able to do some advanced diagnostics.

 

[Beardo50]

I'm about 30 kilometers from guelph. I will check it out. Thanx again.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

OH my, poor boy! Were you able to get him to see a vet?
It was sounding like an inner ear infection/issue, or a severe vitamin deficiency or dehydration.
That is too bad he was falling off of his log like that.
The Miner-All should be sufficient for calcium. If however, he isn't getting much of that, then it could also be a calcium issue, too. You could consider getting him on a liquid calcium.
I hope that he is going to be ok. Let us know how he is doing.

Tracie

 

[Beardo50]

Just waiting on a fecal to come back. He actually seems better since i posted this but somethings definitely wrong maybe early signs of mbd or inner ear thing. He did have a fall off his perch so i am hoping he didn't break anything may have to get an x- ray too. Thanx for your concern and help ill keep you posted.

PS The guelph vet animal hospital cooper mentioned has some very bad ratings or should i say horror stories on the net so i think ill stay clear of that place. Not to many reptile vets in my area so ill have to do some research and see if i can find a good one. Thanx again.

 

[Beardo50]

Well good news, i had the fecal done and the results are negative for any parasites. He is still eating next to nothing but not losing any weight. Ive had him out a few times to run around on the basement floor and the equilibrium thing hasn't manifested itself? I have noticed he will go to a corner of the bathroom where the ceramic tile floor is and lay on the cold floor. This kinda made me wonder if he is having a hard time brumating in his enclosure. Any thoughts would be appreciated. thanx again.

 

[DaisyDragon123]

Did your vet run anymore tests besides a fecal?

 

[DaisyDragon123]

Why did it take so long to get a fecal result?

 

[Beardo50]

No real repti vets in my area. Had the fecal done by a mail in fecal test facility so it took some time getting it back. Also because he is not eating very much i had to wait to get a sample.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

That is good news he is not losing weight or have any parasites either.
Is there not a cool enough area in his tank for him to brumate?
If you don't have a cat or dog running around to bother him, you could make a little cardboard cave for him, with either shredded newspapers for him to scratch around in or a blankie. See if he likes brumating outside of his tank possibly? Of course, be sure it's safe & he can't get lost somewhere.
He isn't having any balance issues now??

Tracie