Lethargic all the time..

[Synthetyk]

Ok, I read the topics and information about brumation. However I have had my beardie for 1 and a half years and shes acting this way for TO long.

My beardie has been sleeping in her hide forever now, since probably the middle of winter if not longer. I will take her out every Thursday and soak her,and then offer roaches. She will sit in the water for awhile, and then hop out. She ignores the roaches, as well as greens I toss in her dish. She may bask for the remainder of the day, and the next morning she is in her hide half asleep/or awake but sleepy looking.

I've noticed when I take her out of the hide to soak, she is active and aware. Has no problem running around and what not. Haven't noticed any weight loss to be honest. But she has not eaten ANYTHING the whole time she has been acting like this.

Her usual diet is collard greens, and blaptica dubia roaches which I have setup a colony for my cresteds.

Last time I ran into a issue with her acting the same way, except it was more serious and she wouldn't move or anything and could barely hold herself up it was pinworms. I treated her via vet meds and she made a come back with her appetite and activity level. However, since then I have gotten accepted into the police academy and don't have much time to spend at home. My wife takes care of my reptile stock I currently have. But due to an episode with one of my cresteds she doesn't really get to involved other then soaking and offering food.

When I am able to go back home this weekend I was going to try and setup a vet appointment. Is there anything I can do in the mean time? Do bearded dragons get parasites easily? It seems so, considering this will be her second time and I have had numerous cresteds never exhibit this type of behavior. She lives in a 40 breeder, with the tip of the basking spot reading 110 degrees. She also just got a new Repti-Sun 10.0 tube this month, I replace them every 6 months on the dot. I keep reading info about this ReptiAid, however my wife has never seen it at our local pet shops.

Any help/info?

 

[Tigg]

Sounds like a vet visit will be your best option since you don't have very much time to monitor her, and try different forms of alternative medicine.

Before your visit this weekend, try to collect a fresh stool sample for testing. (must be within 24-36 hours of test) you will also want to opt to have some blood work done. With the results from these 2 tests, an experienced herp vet will be able to tell you EXACTLY what is going on with her, get her the correct medication, and feeling better in no time.

Beardies are no more susceptible to parasites than any other reptile. The 2 main culprits for parasite infestation would be through feeders, and an already infested enclosure. Parasites can enter their body through ingestion, as well as through the vent. this is why it is important to maintain a clean enclosure.

Stool should be cleaned daily or as soon as it's seen. weekly quick wipe downs with a bleach/water solution in high traffic areas and places she frequently defecates. The enclosure should be fully cleaned and disinfected every month. Is it possible your bearies enclosure wasn't disinfected since the last infestation?

You will also want to make sure you wash your hands after handling each of your reptiles, not only for the parasites but to prevent the cross contamination off other conditions as well.

What substrate are you using? Sand and other particulate substrates are hard to clean and easily become a breeding ground for parasites and other bacteria.

Sounds like you lighting and temps are ok.

Good luck with your vet visit, if you have time let us know how it goes.

 

[Synthetyk]

I forgot to mention the substrate sorry, shes been on paper towels since day 1 when I got her.

Also, she only pooped just before she started hiding in the winter. Since she hasn't eaten anything, she hasn't pooped. How am I supposed to collect a fecal ?

 

[Tigg]

Have you tried bathing her? This may induce a bowel movement, maybe not. You can also collect a stool sample from the water although it's not the best option, it may be your only option.

Can you gently massage (Or get your wife to) her belly to feel for any hard lumps in her stomach? I am wondering about the possibility of impaction?

It IS possible that it's brumation. Especially considering you are claiming she has not lost any weight recently... If this is the case it's still a good idea to have a fecal test preformed before reducing her light cycle. You also want to make sure there is no food or stool left in her stomach to "rot" while she is sleeping, which will be easy since she hasn't been eating lol (wow, weird time of year for brumation, but EVERY beardie is different)

Have you recently started turning your A/C on in the house? or been leaving the door/windows open?

I still think a vet visit is a good idea, especially if you are not really tight with $. It will bring peace of mind as well as be a good preventitive check up for her.

Is she showing any signs of illness, pain, or distress? Blackbearding for no reason? any trouble keeping her head up? excessivly "cranky" or "antisocial" aside from wanting to sleep?

If your vet decides it is brumation, I don't think it will last very long considering the time of year, once it really starts to warm up she will be out in no time.

 

[Synthetyk]

Yeah I bathe her every thursday as I mentioned in the post, well my wife does. There aren't any lumps or marbles in her stomach as most posts say could be stuck eggs. We have started to open doors and windows everyonce in awhile when its nice and cool outside. And we only ran the air conditioner for 2 days and then shut it off, as the temps went back down. And again, I haven't noticed any blacking of the beard, no struggling to hold head up or walking etc.. I just bathed her last week and set her in a laundry basket outside while I read a book on the porch. And she was walking around in the basket, and standing up enjoying the sunlight. I then plop her in her cage, and she'll bask for the remainder of the day then go back into hiding.

How long should this brumation last if it is this?

 

[Tigg]

IF IT IS brumation, it can last anywhere from a couple of days to 6 months. It depends on a lot of factors, mainly how deep you let her go into brumation. It will depend a lot on the temps in the enclosure, how quiet and dark her enclosure is kept. How often you disturb her.

There is a great article here:
http://www.beardeddragon.org/articles/brumation/

That will explain everything you need to do during brumation.

Again I would still urge you to visit your herp specialist this weekend to rule everything out first.

 

[Synthetyk]

I've read that article before, it just concerns me its been so long.

If it is parasites, are there any steps to keep them from coming back? I keep reading posts were people mention its there beardies 3rd or 4th time to vet for parasite meds..

 

[Tigg]

Reinfection is usually caused by poor husbandry conditions, Some parasites such as Cociddia are harder to kill and some people either use the wrong cleaners, or just don't clean thoroughly enough.

If you find that your beardie does have worms or parasites... Your paper towel substrate is already ideal. You will want to replace it daily, and do weekly cleanings of the enclosure with a 1 part bleach to 10 parts water solution. this will kill any living organisms hidden in the enclosure and for the most part prevent reification.

 

[spyder79]

Reinfection is often caused by not properly cleaning the tank. as said above you should fully dissenfect the tank 1 time a month with general cleanings each week and always remove fecal as soon as noticed.

as to the other question about reptaid here is the link for it.
http://www.chameleonsnorthwest.com/reptaid4.htm
now this will help boost activity and appetite but is not a replacement for vet meds.

also another way to aid pulling her out of brumation if that is what is going on would be pull out the hide raise the basking temps a bit and lengthen her daylight time to as much as 14 hours of daylight. this should pull her out if it is indeed brumation.

also an easy way to get a fecal would be to force feed some olive oil or some apple slices (the oil will work best acts as a laxative)

Good luck with your baby

Brian
Cryptic Dragons