Is this Brumation?

[Nagy412]

Hello my beardie (Shorty) has been sleeping now for over a week he will wake up and show his head out of his hide but will not come out. Before i get into details this is only a guess because i bought him as a baby and dont know exactly how old he is i got him in august and he was only about 3inchs long so im guessing hes in sub-adult stage 7 to 8 months old i dont know if this is too early for him to go into brumation and this is also my first beardie but let me get back to shorty prior to him doing this i changed his substrate to playsand which i was told is safe at his age when he first was in the sand i seen him digging burrowing things he never did before but the following weeks he started eating less and becoming less active til he just sarted sleeping for weeks and waking only for a little when he does wake i give him water/nutritional mix calcium and electrolytes so he wont dehydrate and he drinks that but he will not eat he went into a full sleep around the mid of january and he woke up about 5 days ago and i was able to feed him a pinkie and give him a drink but hes back sleeping again hes on the cool side of the tank also so im not sure if hes sick or in brumation i would think him not eating for as long as he has he would lose alot of weight but has lost very little if any so if any one has experience in this can you please let me know if he is in brumation and when can i expect him to come out and if theres anything i should be doing while this is occuring when i did research on these guys brumation never came up once and thats why im concerned also he has had only a few bile movements since this usually when i bathe him is when he goes this is during brumation because i would bathe him when he would awake............. Please Help!!!!!!

 

[TheDragonKeepers]

I wouldn't recommend pinkies, and I definitely wouldn't recommend sand. Sorry :S
Keep up with the baths, get a fecal test done by your vet.
Is he losing weight?

 

[NightFury]

he is too young for pinkies, I wouldnt recommend them at all in any stage of his life honestly.(just too risky) Get him off the sand, he could possibly ate some of it and it could cause him an impaction. I would recommend tile or reptile carpet but you can use newspaper or paper towels. What is your setup?

UVB light type
UVA Light Type
Size of the Tank
All the Foods you feed him
Temps in the tank
any calcium and vitamin supplements being used, if any (he needs those if not)
Does he have a basking log that can get him almost directly under the heat source?

 

[Nagy412]

10.0 uvb/uva compact floresent. 40 gallon breeder. Basking temp varies 98-105 average temp in tank is around 80-90 on the warm and about 75-80 on cool I feed him superworms small mealies but his staple food source was crickets dusted once daily with bearded dragon mix from rhapsody I offer him greens everyday but he Will only eat a leave or two wasn't loving greens squash he likes no grapes kinda picky eater with the greens but this happened slowly and now he is completely dormant at this time I don't have a vet closest one that deals with reptiles is over 60 miles away I don't have that option for































stool samples and such so should I change back to the reptile carpet then asap there's so many proletarian that contridict eachothee one says its perfectly healthy the other says its very harmful please tell me if there's anything I can do to prove that he's sick and not just in brimation because he is by a window and I heard that the light can play a role in him going into brimation because it is winter so this would be the correct time please I need to know if my beardie is sick or is in a natural state

 

[NightFury]

He is still a bit young to be going into brumation. I would stop feeding meal worms since they can add onto the problem, yes switch back to the reptile carpet. Some people may argue that sand is ok but it imposes too much of a risk and will be better off without it. I would feed him phoenix (repti worms) instead if you want to feed him worms, continue with crickets. Is the UVB a Tube or Coil? Also is it in the tank or is it outside of it? (like ontop of your screen?)Though he doesnt seem to pay much attention to the greens I would still serve them to him anyway, he is getting to the age where it will be the main part of his diet. Continue with the squash like you are doing. I would recommend the Supplements from Rep-cal brand, the Calcium with D3 and Herptivite for the multivitamin supplementing. Not sure what is in that reptile mix you say you use. Also do you use the thermometer with a probe or the round ones that stick to the walls in your tank?

 

[Nagy412]

I have digital thermometers and alo a laser one so i can see the temps in different parts of the enclosure the type of UVB is Repti-Sun 10.0 its the kind that is compact the twirlie kind as u put it i believe it say it provides both UVB and UVA wavelengths and it was around 50$ if i remember correctly. i am going to switch back to the carpet within the next few days but can you reccomend any other substrate thats not slate or tile but a loose kind that is safe? The kind of supplement i use is called Repashy superfoods bearded dragon calcium plus i bought at petco and i used it once daily when he was feeding daily i also have reptvite reptile vitamins with D3 and without it said to use once weekly but i may have not done it once weekly but the other bearded dragon stuff with calcium i gave him once daily with his crickets (shake and bake way). i dont know if this would hurt anything but i have a red heat light on in the tank 24hrs to help keep the temp close to 80 in the night somtimes a little warmer like 83 or so ohh sorry if im going from one sublect to another and back again but i remember you asking if the UVB is in the tank and yes i have it clamped on the side and its actually inside the enclosure not blocked by anything no glass or screen there is a basking spot where i have an ordinary 55watt halogen bulb that underneath gets around 98-105 give or take a few degrees. I think that is answering all your questions to better help you tell me if he is sick or in brumation because just last night he woke up had a very little bile movement was wondering his tank a little i had him out and he was aware and eyes were wide and seemed alert i gave him a bath but one problem i did see when he was pooping(sorry) he seem to be having a little trouble like he could be impacted so thats why i gave him a bath thinking the warm water would make him go but it didnt which it usually does thats all i have to do is put him in the warm water and he goes but not lastnight so impaction is on my mind now but he just did not seem sick once he woke up just a little lazy after disappearin in his log for 2 weeks and right now thats where he at in his log sleeping... Please try and help i have no vets i can take him too and i have no choices right now......if you email me i can send u pic of the enclosure because im not able to post it on here i dont know why [email protected] how do u post images when i hit the img all it does is write that at the end of my post maybe a lil help here too lol....

 

[NightFury]

I would switch the coil UVB bulb to a reptisun 10.0 tube UVB bulb as soon as possible. The coil bulbs have been known to cause health issues in beardies, in particular the eyes. I would turn it off for now until you can replace it. You would have to buy a new fixture for the tube light but you can usually find them for cheap at Wal-mart and you can mount it inside your tank with command hooks or industrial stength velcro. Your halogen will work perfectly for the UVA, its all you need for that. It is good that you have the digital thermometers and not the pin ones. There really arent good loose substrates for bearded dragons, flat non loose surfaces are the best so that they cant accidentally ingest it. I have books that say sterile soil or recycled paper bedding is safe for them even if they ingest it but at this point I question my books since they have told me some wrong things in the past which is why I recommend a solid substrate. I would always use a calcium supplement that contains D3 in it since your bearded dragon is kept indoors, that could add onto the issue of having the coil bulb since those dont always produce the right amounts of UVB which helps him make D3 to break down the calcium. When you use a multivitamin supplement make sure it is one that has Beta Carotene and no Vitamin A at all! beardies can get Vitamin A toxicity very easily. At his age you can calcium supplement with D3 3-4 times a week and the Vitamin one with Beta Carotene once a week. You only need the Halogen on in the day time, if you want a night time light then get a ceramic heat emitter, they are the best and emit no light whatsoever. Bearded dragons can see color so the red bulb would only distract him and keep him from sleep so I would also turn that off. As long as his temps dont drop below 60 at night he should be fine. Your temps also seem fine, since you said he seemed more alert when he was out of the tank could very well indicate that replacing the UVB may be what he needed. I would try this first and we can move on from there. As long as he poops fairly regularly then he will most likely be fine but if you are still worried then the next time you bathe him in the warm water gently massage his tummy and sides, this can help get things moving in his digestive track that may have had a bit of trouble moving through. if you have any more questions just let me know and ill answer them for you! sorry on the late reply I was out all day today! How is he now? any unusual behavior? Active at all? If you can I would love to also see a photo of him! You can use photobucket.com to post images of him, once you upload them to the photobucket site and view your album there will be a link under the picture that says IMG code when you highlight it with your mouse, simply click it and it will copy that link. Once you do that you can right click anywhere in the text box on your replies and it will post the image in the forum after you submit. Hope he gets well

 

[agordon89]

it seams like your tank set up is ok except for the playsand. using some sands imo is ok like calci-sand i use crushed walnut shells and have not had a problem with 3 beardies.

as for his feedings, don't use superworms unless you rip the heads off. or they are freeze dried. superworms can be swallowed whole by dragons and can bite the inside of their stomachs and throats. if you want to try pinkies just make sure that they are not longer than his head is wide. and use frozen ones. my beardies love frozen pinkies. but if they are too big then they end up throwing up. ( warning the poo from a pinkie feed dragon is smelly)

as for the sleeping all the time, my dragons go through phases where they do that for about a week at a time and then they are back to normal. i understand that 60 mi is a very long drive but you might just have to do it. its not normal for him to be that lethargic.