Is she trying to brumate?

[PhoenixtheDragon]

Hello! I have a 6.5 month old bearded dragon who seems like she'd sleep all day if I'd let her. I'm still new to the reptile world so I just want to check if I should be concerned or not.

Around a month ago I switched from reptile carpet to tile. Around the same time she started trying to dig everywhere and would usually stop once she was snuggled in her hide. Her usual daytime activities before included lots of pigging out on crickets, baths, and basking until her lights went out (and then I'd get the "hey where'd my sun go?" look). Then she would sleep on her basking spot until the lights come on again. Now she sleeps inside her hide snuggled in her blanket, but she will put herself to bed sometime between 3 pm and 6 pm and stay there until I take her out in the morning. I've tried waiting for her to come out on her own, but I'm pretty sure she wouldn't. I've given her up to 4 hours after lights on to come out, but I usually have to leave the house and don't want to go out all day without feeding her. And I feed crickets so I can't really leave them there for her to find. She's typically awake in the mornings so I'll take her out and put her on her basking spot and she'll stay there for an hour or so. Then I'll feed her and probably 75% of the time she eats her usual amount, plus some greens. The rest of the time she'll only nibble or show no interest at all. Then she'll spend the day lounging around various parts of her home usually on the warm side in partial shade, until she puts herself to bed. Sometimes I don't even get a chance to feed her a second time because she goes to bed so early. If I take her out, she's pretty active and will climb whatever she has to climb in order to look out the window, or run all around the bed, or climb up someone's head, or run across my keyboard...

I read the brumation article and saw that sometimes females brumate in the spring in preparation for mating season, and that sometimes dragons go by Australian seasons even in North America (where I am from)... But I've also read that dragons don't brumate until they are over a year old and go by seasons where they live... So I'm not sure what to think. Should I just let her sleep all day if she wants? Should I keep waking her up in the mornings? Could it be something else? Other than being more lazy, everything else seems to be normal.

She is 6.5 months old, 17 inches long in a 36*18*18* enclosure. Reptisun 10.0 tube mounted inside, new as of May 2014, which she get within 8 inches of. Basking temperature is 104-111, warm side 87-95, cool side 77-83, all depending on how warm it is inside the house and all measured with a temp gun. It is a white light. She lives on a paper towel/tile combo. She eats crickets, Phoenix worms occasionally, bok choi, collard greens if I can find them, arugula once in a while, butternut squash and sometimes green peppers, apples or carrots. Lights are on for 14 hours. No night time lights and my house stays around 73 at night. She gets baths 4 times a week and poops around 4 times a week, usually in the bath.

 

[diamc]

Hi, I have to say that she does sound lazier than a 6 1/2 month old should be. What are the tiles like, are they slate tiles or perhaps too slippery for her to maneuver around on? They aren't the type with adhesive on the back, are they? Would it be possible to post a picture of her full tank?

Good that you replaced the Repti-Sun tube recently. It sounds like it's at a good distance. Is the UVB mounted on the back wall so that the rays shines in her eyes or is it over her body while she is basking under the lights? How often are you dusting her food with calcium & vitamins?

If she's a big girl, the basking temp may be too warm for her, she may prefer 102 or so as the 110 degrees is actually for a baby. What distance are you holding the temp gun when you're checking the temps?

She probably isn't pooping anymore than 4 times a wk because she isn't basking under the lights long enough to help with proper digestion. Also, if you bathe her more frequently, she may poop more often.

Something else to consider is getting a fecal checked for parasites so you can rule that out.

 

[PhoenixtheDragon]

The uvb is on the back near the top. She faces away from it when she basks. Its been there since almost the beginning and her basking spot was higher and it didn't bother her. And she is lower than the uvb light now. So unless its something that has started bothering her over time, its been the same. I actually lowered the basking spot because I thought she might not like so much heat now that she's not tiny. I've thought about hanging it from the top but I worry about the heat lamp melting or otherwise destroying the uvb bulb and fixture.

I dust with calcium 5 times a week and vitamins twice, one feeding per day on each.

The tiles are ceramic and not smooth. They are a bit textured so she can get around and file her nails. I don't think there's any adhesive on them, if there is its not obvious. The backs are just look like white ceramic that is rough with a sort of waffle iron pattern?

When I checked temperatures today basking spot was at 102.5. I hold it approximately 2 inches away.

I'm not home at the moment so I can't post a photo but I can try later tonight.

I'm also wondering if she's older than the pet store told me (family owned reptile specialty store, not pet smart). The babies they have in now are 2 months old and the same size as when I took Phoenix home at 2 weeks old... I feel like she's big for her age, unless she is just going to be a big dragon... But she's my first, so really, I don't know.

 

[diamc]

It sure seems like you've tried just about everything you could. Only other things I can think of right now is replacing the UVB bulb if it has been in use for 5 months or so and also getting a fecal checked for parasites.

 

[PhoenixtheDragon]

The only other thing I can think of is because its summer she might not be sleeping quite as well, so needing to nap more during the day. The sun comes up by 5:30 am and doesn't go down until around 9:30 pm and we have lots of windows with white blinds so even if we shut them its bright. I got her a new hide to sleep in because of this, complete with a little blanket and paper towels for her to snuggle with, which she does.

The UV bulb is only about 8 weeks old and hasn't been moved at all so I don't think that should be an issue.

I'll get a fecal done and I may as well do a general check up, because why not I suppose, even though other than the napping thing, she seems normal. Even though she's been lazy and occasionally not eating as much she's still grown an inch in the last 6 weeks. I won't be able to get to a vet until next week though, since I've got a long work week ahead of me. In the mean time, should I still be moving her in the mornings? Should I take away the hide for the day time? Or should I let her do her thing and she can come out if she feels like it, and go from there?

 

[diamc]

Perhaps the brightness had been waking her up early. Does the hide cause her to spend more time sleeping in it or does she seem to be awake longer now? Maybe cutting the light schedule back a little would help her out too so if the lights are on a 14 hr schedule now, cut them back to 12 or even 10 hrs and see how it goes.

Good that it's a new UV bulb, just wanted to mention that.

Great that she continues to eat well and sure sounds like she is growing well. I would continue to take her out in the mornings so she at least gets some time under the lights. Hard to say about the hide, I think I would observe her while I was home to see how she looked & acted without the hide available during the day. I would be hesitant to take it out and worry about while I was working, wondering if it was stressing her out too much.

Good idea getting a general check up, sure can't hurt. Keep us updated on her.

 

[PhoenixtheDragon]

She tends to spend lots of time in the hide, but awake and alert with her head up. She actually looks pretty content when she's doing that. Sometimes she's sleeping but that's not until after 6 pm usually. Maybe I'll try taking it out when I have a day off. And switch to 12 hours on/off. Right now its 14/10. I upped it because she was hiding so much so I wanted more opportunity to have her with lights.

Set up


Oh hi!


All snuggled up...


Morning beard stretches...


Bonus pic from when she was 3 months old...
"I'm feeling fat and sassy!"

 

[PhoenixtheDragon]

I took her for a check up this morning, the vet says everything looks OK. She think Phoenix might be staying in her cave or under her basking log because she feels safe there. Its their instinct to protect themselves from overhead predators. She recommended that I take out the cave during the day and take her out in the sun as much as I can this summer.

The fecal test also came back positive for capulera? I can't remember what its called exactly. I have Panacur to treat that.

The vet also suspects that she is older than what the pet store said she was given how big she is now and how big she was when I got her (5.5 inches, 2 weeks old). And that 40 crickets per day is a lot and I could cut down to feeding crickets once per day. I think if I feed crickets in the evening she will still eat 30+. At least she has in the past when I couldn't get to feeding until the afternoon.

So overall I suppose things look pretty good. I'll do another fecal test once the treatment is finished.

 

[diamc]

She is such a pretty girl. Sure looks nice & healthy except for her hiding.

Good that the vet said everything looked ok. I'll bet she hasn't been feeling 100% because of the parasites. That would explain a lot. I'll bet once she is treated that you'll see a difference in her. Make sure to use a probiotic while she is under treatment and for at least 2 wks afterward. Also, since antibiotics are very drying, be sure to give frequent baths & offer water with a medicine dropper to see if she will lick it off.

Did the vet think she was closer to a year? They can continue to grow until about 2 yrs old so if it was me, I would continue with the 2 feedings and let her decide when she was ready to cut back to just one daily feeding of crickets.

Bet she will enjoy the sunshine.

Thanks for the update and be sure to let us know how she is doing.

 

[PhoenixtheDragon]

Where does one find a probiotic for bearded dragons? Is there somewhere online to order it? And should I wait until I get the probiotic to start the treatment for the parasites? Or can I start it right away?

Is there anything special I need to do in terms of cleaning her vivarium?

She sometimes only wants one feeding of crickets per day already, but not that often. I think that the vet wanted her to be more inclined to eat more veggies so I might just change to veggies first, then two feedings of crickets.

 

[diamc]

My beardies always LOVED Benebac gel for birds/reptiles and would willingly lick it off their nose. You should be able to get it from a pet store, probably in the BIRD section or you can get it here: http://www.amazon.com/Bene-Bac%C2%AE-Bird-Reptile-4-Pack-tubes/dp/B00061MROU/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1403830639&sr=8-3&keywords=benebac+gel+for+birds or here: http://www.bug-de-lite.com/Products%20Page.html Or you could pick up some fruit flavored SOY yogurt and put that on her nose. I actually would recommend starting the probiotic the same day you start the Panacur to prevent stomach issues.

Would be a good idea to thoroughly clean the viv and to perhaps use something on the bottom that is easy to replace for now like paper towels.

Certainly would be fine to feed the veggies first.

 

[PhoenixtheDragon]

I had no luck with finding benebac in stores so I ordered online. In the meantime I bought soy yogurt so I could start the medication sooner rather than later... How much soy yogurt should I give her?

 

[diamc]

That's too bad that you couldn't find the Benebac in a store near you. Were you able to find fruit flavored soy yogurt? You can give her as much of it as she'll take, hopefully she'll like it right off her nose. You can offer even 3 times a day actually.

 

[PhoenixtheDragon]

Yes, its mango flavored soy and organic to boot. She doesn't seem to mind it. She still doesn't get the whole water on the nose thing, but she never has.

 

[diamc]

Bet she'll like the mango and even better that it's organic. Did she lick the yogurt off her nose even though she won't take water that way?