Honestly, reptiles are not good pets...

[AHBD]

Not at all, just a point of interest among many that can be commented on here, especiallly for owners who feel that the Reptisun 10.0 is now obsolete and they need to run out and buy a new bulb, whereas just a year or 2 ago most people were using the 10.0 t8. No argument, but this just shows that we may not know exactly how much uvb is truly needed for a dragon to be healthy.

Keeping them alive and healthy is the point, and many of us did so back then. If they weren't healthy they would have been producing sickly babies + the mother dragons would not have survived .

 

[traildrifterphalanx]

This is honestly a very insightful topic and a lot of great points have been brought up, just wanted to add as well.

I love my reptiles, and I honestly love how much effort it takes from me. As someone else had mentioned, they are more of a "hobby" pet to me, not that I don't love them dearly, they are truly what makes me happiest right now. My entire routine at home is caring for the dragons.

I get up in the morning, I feed them, go to work.
I run home on my 30min lunch to use the 6 minutes I have not traveling to feed them and clean up any poop.
I get home from work not long after to clean up again, feed them, and at that point remove items from the enclosures to wash thoroughly that I could not clean properly on lunch.

Once they're fed and cleaned, I am always talking to them, handling them, taking them outside, etc until lights out, and then I hold and snuggle one of them up until my bedtime. They are an enormous part of my life, and when we had a tornado warning yesterday right before the end of my work shift and we all had to hide in the basement, all I could think of was wanting to run home and making sure they're ok. I was so concerned for them I wanted to cry.

I will always recommend bearded dragons, but I do understand the time and commitment is not for everyone and not everyone should have one. They are not a stick in a glass tank and feed sometimes pet. They are a complete commitment to your time, money, resources, etc. I personally would not have it any other way, but I am very introverted and I love spending all my time on them, they are my family. I am not a school kid, college student, busy parent, etc. My schedule is generally open, aside from work, and the time not working is their time.

Thing is, as AHBD mentioned, this applies to any pet. Of course not every pet is as time consuming, and not every pet is such a financial drain, but all pets require time and commitment, and I honestly feel we live in a pretty disposable society. Free cats are all over craigslist, many due to "lack of time" or because the cute kitten grew up. Apartment won't let me bring my dog, my dad is allergic, etc. The reasons are endless and honestly in most cases excuses for losing interest. People don't care to research before an impulse buy, or before their child demands that pet. I understand some situations to rehome a pet are totally necessary and I am not shaming those people, but people need to think long term when they bring another living creature into their home.

Long story short, reptiles are amazing pets! But you must have the time, money, patience, and commitment to care for them. They are not like a cat where you pour food and water, clean waste, and walk away. If you can't commit to everything that pet needs, then don't get it, regardless of how cute it is. It's hard to not be selfish when you want something, but if you can't meet the demands, don't let the pet suffer for it.

 

[smackey2]

I have to agree. A bearded dragon isn't for everyone, but if a person wanted a pet and couldn't have anything with fur, had the time, and money, I would honestly recommend one.

My house is a busy place and quite full; two kids, both boys, 7 and 3, almost 8 and 4; two dogs; our beardie; and obviously my husband.

Up until the beginning of March, I worked full time in a nursing home, 12 hours shift. The hubby also worked full time. Our oldest was in school, but the youngest had to be at his grandparents while we were at work. We would run home on our lunch breaks to make sure the dogs were taken outside and had everything they needed. It was a busy schedule and at times overwhelming and demanding.

Now, I am a stay at home mom and have a lot of time here at the house. Our dogs are spoiled and loved just like our children, but I wanted another pet to add to the family. For the longest time I had a love bird who didn't have a mate, so she went everywhere with me and spent a lot of time with me. I missed that. Don't get me wrong, my children and dogs are time consuming, but now that my babies are growing up and becoming more independent, I am not needed nearly as much unless it is for snacks, meal times, things like that.

I had a Leopard Gecko for quite a few years, up until we moved back in October. Wiley, my gecko, was stolen out of the old apartment while we were unloading stuff at the new house. He was going to be coming over in the next load, but when my husband went back, he, his tank, and all of his accessories were gone. I was devastated as Wiley was a birthday present from the hubby to me. Plus, my boys really enjoyed him, especially my oldest.

After A LOT of talking, the hubby decided he wouldn't mind having another pet, but not a noisy one. My lovebird, Peachy, was a talkative girl and loved to make noise. If she wasn't center of attention, she made sure you knew she was there.

Our oldest, suggested a reptile. He and I both originally wanted a snake, but the hubby is scared to death of them, so that was a no go. Then he wanted an Iguana. I wouldn't have minded, but I honestly didn't want a reptile that would get bigger than our dogs. Haha. So, bearded dragon it was.

I made all kinds of mistakes with Spike's lights and what not. But of course, at first I bought the 'starter kit' from petco. I thought I was doing everything right up until Spike refused to come out from any of her hides. Luckily, I found this forum and a lot of people on here helped me figure out what was wrong and that basically all of her lights needed to be replaced and upgraded. Talk about spending a lot more money than I thought I was going to have to. It really wouldn't have been so bad, if I had known that the petco employees only tell you crap to get you to buy something that isn't adequate for a bearded dragon, just to have you come back so they can sell you even more junk that obviously isn't right.

Spike is roughly 4 months old. Between the set backs with her lights and what not, plus her consumption of bugs daily, she was/is quite an expensive pet. That isn't including taking her to the vet when we first got her to make sure she was healthy. Now that my roaches are breeding, the bugs aren't really a problem.

If it wasn't for having her, I would have NEVER imagined how much money I would need to spend to make sure she has everything she needs to grow and be strong, happy, and healthy.

I thought having a bearded dragon would be a lot easier than it is, but in all honestly, it isn't. Spike requires a lot of my time, not that I am complaining, especially considering now I couldn't imagine not having her. I would NOT consider a bearded dragon to be a 'beginner pet'. My oldest is almost 8, and has a good bit of responsibility around the house, but Spike is not one of them. To me, she is a lot different than our dogs, but the pet store definitely didn't bother to explain that to us. Obviously.

If I were still working full time, there is no way she would have half of the care she has with me being home. Keeping her, honestly wouldn't have been possible before now.

Pet stores need to start being up front with people and educating them on what the animal REALLY needs instead of selling them this crap that is more harmful to them than good and that will more than likely need to be replaced; about how much time they actually require; the amount of money that can go into a babies feeders; and which feeders SHOULDN'T be fed to babies, like mealworms. (This is what was suggested to me.)

If I had known then what I know now, I don't know if I would have agreed to get a bearded dragon. Then, I had NO idea what I was really getting myself into. However, I am glad I stuck with it and was able to correct everything I needed to, with the help of this site and those on it, as I am very much smitten with our little one and wouldn't have it any other way; Spike is a very rewarding pet and, in my opinion, she has me trained quite well.

 

[nathb1]

I have to agree. A bearded dragon isn't for everyone, but if a person wanted a pet and couldn't have anything with fur, had the time, and money, I would honestly recommend one.

My house is a busy place and quite full; two kids, both boys, 7 and 3, almost 8 and 4; two dogs; our beardie; and obviously my husband.

Up until the beginning of March, I worked full time in a nursing home, 12 hours shift. The hubby also worked full time. Our oldest was in school, but the youngest had to be at his grandparents while we were at work. We would run home on our lunch breaks to make sure the dogs were taken outside and had everything they needed. It was a busy schedule and at times overwhelming and demanding.

Now, I am a stay at home mom and have a lot of time here at the house. Our dogs are spoiled and loved just like our children, but I wanted another pet to add to the family. For the longest time I had a love bird who didn't have a mate, so she went everywhere with me and spent a lot of time with me. I missed that. Don't get me wrong, my children and dogs are time consuming, but now that my babies are growing up and becoming more independent, I am not needed nearly as much unless it is for snacks, meal times, things like that.

I had a Leopard Gecko for quite a few years, up until we moved back in October. Wiley, my gecko, was stolen out of the old apartment while we were unloading stuff at the new house. He was going to be coming over in the next load, but when my husband went back, he, his tank, and all of his accessories were gone. I was devastated as Wiley was a birthday present from the hubby to me. Plus, my boys really enjoyed him, especially my oldest.

After A LOT of talking, the hubby decided he wouldn't mind having another pet, but not a noisy one. My lovebird, Peachy, was a talkative girl and loved to make noise. If she wasn't center of attention, she made sure you knew she was there.

Our oldest, suggested a reptile. He and I both originally wanted a snake, but the hubby is scared to death of them, so that was a no go. Then he wanted an Iguana. I wouldn't have minded, but I honestly didn't want a reptile that would get bigger than our dogs. Haha. So, bearded dragon it was.

I made all kinds of mistakes with Spike's lights and what not. But of course, at first I bought the 'starter kit' from petco. I thought I was doing everything right up until Spike refused to come out from any of her hides. Luckily, I found this forum and a lot of people on here helped me figure out what was wrong and that basically all of her lights needed to be replaced and upgraded. Talk about spending a lot more money than I thought I was going to have to. It really wouldn't have been so bad, if I had known that the petco employees only tell you crap to get you to buy something that isn't adequate for a bearded dragon, just to have you come back so they can sell you even more junk that obviously isn't right.

Spike is roughly 4 months old. Between the set backs with her lights and what not, plus her consumption of bugs daily, she was/is quite an expensive pet. That isn't including taking her to the vet when we first got her to make sure she was healthy. Now that my roaches are breeding, the bugs aren't really a problem.

If it wasn't for having her, I would have NEVER imagined how much money I would need to spend to make sure she has everything she needs to grow and be strong, happy, and healthy.

I thought having a bearded dragon would be a lot easier than it is, but in all honestly, it isn't. Spike requires a lot of my time, not that I am complaining, especially considering now I couldn't imagine not having her. I would NOT consider a bearded dragon to be a 'beginner pet'. My oldest is almost 8, and has a good bit of responsibility around the house, but Spike is not one of them. To me, she is a lot different than our dogs, but the pet store definitely didn't bother to explain that to us. Obviously.

If I were still working full time, there is no way she would have half of the care she has with me being home. Keeping her, honestly wouldn't have been possible before now.

Pet stores need to start being up front with people and educating them on what the animal REALLY needs instead of selling them this crap that is more harmful to them than good and that will more than likely need to be replaced; about how much time they actually require; the amount of money that can go into a babies feeders; and which feeders SHOULDN'T be fed to babies, like mealworms. (This is what was suggested to me.)

If I had known then what I know now, I don't know if I would have agreed to get a bearded dragon. Then, I had NO idea what I was really getting myself into. However, I am glad I stuck with it and was able to correct everything I needed to, with the help of this site and those on it, as I am very much smitten with our little one and wouldn't have it any other way; Spike is a very rewarding pet and, in my opinion, she has me trained quite well.

I hear you we have three kids, two cats and 1 dog . he does get busy. But when Spike will hit 1 year old or so they tend to be less work. Dixie (male) is 1 right now doesnt eat bugs everyday , doesnt want them. He eats some greens that I handfeed him but nothing like when he was a baby, feeding 2-3 times a days , cleaning up poo etc... and it is rewarding

 

[EllenD]

You can really make the same arguments for most any animals you find at a pet store though.

Regarding life span: Most pet store pets die young. I would put money on it without flinching. 1-5 years is accurate only for small rodents, really. Just thinking of the animals my local chain store sells...Budgies and finches have a 5-8 year life span even up to 12 years, similar to dragons. Cockatiels 10-20 years. Conures 20-30 years. Rabbits 8-12 years. Comet goldfish 5-14 years. Plecostumus "algae eaters" 10-15 years. Chinchillas 10 years. Guinea pigs 4-8 years. Ferrets 6-10 years. Hermit crabs 20-30 years. Mice 1-2 years (prone to tumors). Rats 2-3 years (prone to tumors). Most fish are sold as babies and die before ever reaching adulthood.

Diet: Many pet stores don't sell food that's great for any exotic. I had to order mouse food from eBay when I had them. (And honestly the mice were way more upkeep than the lizard). Birds too, many "diets" sold in stores are not great.

Welfare and quality of life: really it doesn't matter how long they live pets aren't cheep to keep in a really quality way. Rodents live relatively short lives but the amount of cleaning to keep them from stinking is more than any of my reptiles have been. They are also very smart and require lots of enrichment and interaction, often with others of their species, to be happy. Even the space requiremts for rodents are bigger than the garbage they sell at the pet store. Same goes for many birds - few birds are given the appropriate nutrition, UV lighting and enrichment to keep them happy.

Just a comment on lifespans in relation to "reptiles having it the worst"...As a lifelong parrot breeder/owner, people have no idea how long birds live, as evident by this post and the original poster's comments... Budgies (American Parakeets) do not live an average of 5 years in captivity, not even 12, and cockatiels not 20, conures not 20-30...I had a budgie that lived for 22 years and one for 18. The average lifespan of a budgie in captivity is longer than in the wild, it's 15-20+ years, cockatiels 25-30+ years, conures (depending on species, there are many) 30+, and many larger birds 40-100+ years old.

So is it OK that a budgie is considered a "beginner bird" and anyone can walk into a pet store and buy one for $20, not knowing they may live for over 20 years? A cockatiel for $70 and live over 30 years? A green cheek conure, sun conure, Senegal parrot, Indian Ringneck all for 40+ years easily? Think about it. I cringed when I read "a budgie lives on average for 5-8 years...And this is unfortunately what most people think. And why? Because people go to freaking Walmart and buy a cheap 20lb. bag of parakeet seed for $10 that is full of nothing but millet and sunflower seeds, and the birds all die young of fatty liver disease. Or you can spend $30 a week on high-quality pellets and add fresh veggies and fruits and you parakeet will easily live for 15-20+ years...Z

How is this any different than the situation with reptiles? It's not. At Petco a normal bearded dragon costs $59.99 just for the lizard, a budgie costs $22-$25. An adequately sized cage for a budgie at Petco is $70-$100, or you can buy the cheap, tiny, plastic cage for $39.99. I could go on and on. How many Petco and PetSmart "bird specialists" advise budgie buyers to not feed them an all-seed diet, that seeds should be treats? Seed diets to captive birds are the equivalent of feeding a bearded dragon nothing but wax worms! It's absolutely no different with birds, maybe even worse because people just assume that they can buy their kid a parakeet and a cheap, tiny plastic cage, and spend $10 a month on a huge bag of seed mix and they're good...Oh, wait, you mean they need a Certified Avian Vet? Wait, they should live 15-20+ years, not 5+ years? Rot ROH Scoob!

 

[JessPets]

You can really make the same arguments for most any animals you find at a pet store though.

Regarding life span: Most pet store pets die young. I would put money on it without flinching. 1-5 years is accurate only for small rodents, really. Just thinking of the animals my local chain store sells...Budgies and finches have a 5-8 year life span even up to 12 years, similar to dragons. Cockatiels 10-20 years. Conures 20-30 years. Rabbits 8-12 years. Comet goldfish 5-14 years. Plecostumus "algae eaters" 10-15 years. Chinchillas 10 years. Guinea pigs 4-8 years. Ferrets 6-10 years. Hermit crabs 20-30 years. Mice 1-2 years (prone to tumors). Rats 2-3 years (prone to tumors). Most fish are sold as babies and die before ever reaching adulthood.

Diet: Many pet stores don't sell food that's great for any exotic. I had to order mouse food from eBay when I had them. (And honestly the mice were way more upkeep than the lizard). Birds too, many "diets" sold in stores are not great.

Welfare and quality of life: really it doesn't matter how long they live pets aren't cheep to keep in a really quality way. Rodents live relatively short lives but the amount of cleaning to keep them from stinking is more than any of my reptiles have been. They are also very smart and require lots of enrichment and interaction, often with others of their species, to be happy. Even the space requiremts for rodents are bigger than the garbage they sell at the pet store. Same goes for many birds - few birds are given the appropriate nutrition, UV lighting and enrichment to keep them happy.

Just a comment on lifespans in relation to "reptiles having it the worst"...As a lifelong parrot breeder/owner, people have no idea how long birds live, as evident by this post and the original poster's comments... Budgies (American Parakeets) do not live an average of 5 years in captivity, not even 12, and cockatiels not 20, conures not 20-30...I had a budgie that lived for 22 years and one for 18. The average lifespan of a budgie in captivity is longer than in the wild, it's 15-20+ years, cockatiels 25-30+ years, conures (depending on species, there are many) 30+, and many larger birds 40-100+ years old.

So is it OK that a budgie is considered a "beginner bird" and anyone can walk into a pet store and buy one for $20, not knowing they may live for over 20 years? A cockatiel for $70 and live over 30 years? A green cheek conure, sun conure, Senegal parrot, Indian Ringneck all for 40+ years easily? Think about it. I cringed when I read "a budgie lives on average for 5-8 years...And this is unfortunately what most people think. And why? Because people go to freaking Walmart and buy a cheap 20lb. bag of parakeet seed for $10 that is full of nothing but millet and sunflower seeds, and the birds all die young of fatty liver disease. Or you can spend $30 a week on high-quality pellets and add fresh veggies and fruits and you parakeet will easily live for 15-20+ years...Z

How is this any different than the situation with reptiles? It's not. At Petco a normal bearded dragon costs $59.99 just for the lizard, a budgie costs $22-$25. An adequately sized cage for a budgie at Petco is $70-$100, or you can buy the cheap, tiny, plastic cage for $39.99. I could go on and on. How many Petco and PetSmart "bird specialists" advise budgie buyers to not feed them an all-seed diet, that seeds should be treats? Seed diets to captive birds are the equivalent of feeding a bearded dragon nothing but wax worms! It's absolutely no different with birds, maybe even worse because people just assume that they can buy their kid a parakeet and a cheap, tiny plastic cage, and spend $10 a month on a huge bag of seed mix and they're good...Oh, wait, you mean they need a Certified Avian Vet? Wait, they should live 15-20+ years, not 5+ years? Rot ROH Scoob!

That is true, though it really is this way with almost ALL 'exotic' pets. Anphibians, reptiles, birds, invertebrates, sugar glider, hedgehogs, etc - they all need VERY specific care that 99% of people cannot provide. I wish petstores wouldn't be allowed to sell animals at all, it simply isn't fair to the animal!!

 

[charmander16]

I didn't intend to get into an argument about which exotic pets are the hardest to care for.

But when I said that reptiles have it the worst, I meant in terms is disparity between people's expectations and the care that's really needed.

Reptiles are difficult because they mostly require live food and they have specific habitat requirements that are much different from people, i.e. needed specific temps and lights that most other pets don't need.

I'd say that birds are also quite difficult to care for, and yet many kinds can live a long time, but at least they don't need live food or specifically controlled environments.

But, that's not the point, yeah, all of thee exotic pets begin sold at chain stories are a problem.

 

[JessPets]

Very good point!

 

[ryanaeon]

Actually I disagree I think they are really good pets especially Beardies for busy people.
Start up and research costs are high, but once you got the vivarium set up perfectly it becomes rather simple. Change lights, buy varied foods. I have a chihuahua and a poodle and they can be very emotionally exhausting. Dogs can smell, have bugs, you have to take them on walks, they don't leave you alone. You have to trim their hair, trim their nails, give them shower etc. They demand attention 24/7.
A beardie becomes much easier to take care of after the beginning learning curve. An adult doesn't even eat everyday, mine only eats one meal every two days.

 

[JessPets]

Actually I disagree I think they are really good pets especially Beardies for busy people.
Start up and research costs are high, but once you got the vivarium set up perfectly it becomes rather simple. Change lights, buy varied foods. I have a chihuahua and a poodle and they can be very emotionally exhausting. Dogs can smell, have bugs, you have to take them on walks, they don't leave you alone. You have to trim their hair, trim their nails, give them shower etc. They demand attention 24/7.
A beardie becomes much easier to take care of after the beginning learning curve. An adult doesn't even eat everyday, mine only eats one meal every two days.

No really. Costs are ALWYAS high. While a dog might eat through $15-$20 of food per month, a beardie will eat $30-40 plus. Beardies need attention multiple times a day, between feeding, holding, cleaning, checking temps, etc - not for busy people.

And beardies DO need to be fed EVERYDAY, they just don't need live food everyday! You should be feeding him live food a few times a week, and fresh salad everyday. If you're doing everything right, it shouldn't be easy and non-time consuming!

 

[Ollie2]

Actually I disagree I think they are really good pets especially Beardies for busy people.
Start up and research costs are high, but once you got the vivarium set up perfectly it becomes rather simple. Change lights, buy varied foods.
A beardie becomes much easier to take care of after the beginning learning curve. An adult doesn't even eat everyday, mine only eats one meal every two days.

What about outside time and letting him run around, cuddling, taking him into the sun every day for half an hour (weather permitting)? Plus feeding 2x a day (my adult bearded dragon definitely eats 2x a day). Cleaning and washing her stuff. It takes a huge chunk out of my day.

 

[JessPets]

Actually I disagree I think they are really good pets especially Beardies for busy people.
Start up and research costs are high, but once you got the vivarium set up perfectly it becomes rather simple. Change lights, buy varied foods.
A beardie becomes much easier to take care of after the beginning learning curve. An adult doesn't even eat everyday, mine only eats one meal every two days.

What about outside time and letting him run around, cuddling, taking him into the sun every day for half an hour (weather permitting)? Plus feeding 2x a day (my adult bearded dragon definitely eats 2x a day). Cleaning and washing her stuff. It takes a huge chunk out of my day.

No kidding. If you're busy a lot, you probably shouldn't own any pet, lol!

 

[AHBD]

Sub adults + adults don't need fed twice a day. A bowl of salad in the a.m. + bugs every 2-3 days is perfectly fine. And they don't need lots of outside time, most people who care for their dragon give them some time out to free roam in safe places in the house or in an outdoor pen, but that doesn't necessarily take lots of time. Every day may vary as to how much outside time they have and that's fine for a beardie.

 

[Gormagon]

No really. Costs are ALWYAS high. While a dog might eat through $15-$20 of food per month, a beardie will eat $30-40 plus. Beardies need attention multiple times a day, between feeding, holding, cleaning, checking temps, etc - not for busy people.

And beardies DO need to be fed EVERYDAY, they just don't need live food everyday! You should be feeding him live food a few times a week, and fresh salad everyday. If you're doing everything right, it shouldn't be easy and non-time consuming!

What kind of little dog do you have, mine costs me 70.00 a month, lol! Labs don't eat cheap :shock:

 

[JessPets]

No really. Costs are ALWYAS high. While a dog might eat through $15-$20 of food per month, a beardie will eat $30-40 plus. Beardies need attention multiple times a day, between feeding, holding, cleaning, checking temps, etc - not for busy people.

And beardies DO need to be fed EVERYDAY, they just don't need live food everyday! You should be feeding him live food a few times a week, and fresh salad everyday. If you're doing everything right, it shouldn't be easy and non-time consuming!

What kind of little dog do you have, mine costs me 70.00 a month, lol! Labs don't eat cheap :shock:

Woah! We buy the big bags from Costco, roughly 40lbs for $30 or so!