Best feeders: Pros And Cons?

[lilblack94gt]

I have been giving feeders a lot of thought lately since I now have 2 male beardies with healthy appetites. I normally feed crix and superworms that I bought at a local pet store. (The pet stores around here suck. You can't buy dubia, hornworms, phoenix worms, butter worms, etc.) I also give them fresh salad every day.

As far as the salad goes, I was thinking about supplementing my salads by planting a garden in a 20 gal long tank with dandelion and such. But as far as feeders go, what do you guys recommend? I know a lot of people feed dubia. I really don't think I could do that. bugs squick me out and roaches...... they make my skin crawl.

What are the pros and cons to all the feeder insects out there? I want to provide a nutritionally balanced diet to them. But I also want some ideas on the care and raising of feeder insects. Whatever I decide to pick, I will most likely try to start breeding my own since buying and having feeders shipped is so darn expensive. My boys have a very healthy appetite. They can each eat anywhere from 25 to 50 super worms at a time. The same goes for large crix.

 

[Kaiser]

I've only really had experience feeding my bearded dragon crickets, superworms, and black soldier fly larvae (aka. ReptiWorms, Phoenix Worms), so I can't really give all that much to this topic. But hey, a little bit helps, yeah?

It's good that you're looking into feeding your bearded dragons a variety of different live feeders. That's definitely the best way to go about things. I'm guessing you're probably familiar with crickets and superworms, so I'll just comment on the black soldier fly larvae.

Personally, I order my black soldier fly larvae from ReptiWorms at http://reptiworms.com/. They're very nutritious (see the following for a lab analysis of the black soldier fly larvae at ReptiWorms http://www.reptiworms.com/info.php?articles&articles_id=6&sid=lcfkk03nd3pmb6gtekau86egg4, and see the following for a comparison of black soldier fly larvae at Phoenix Worms compared to other live feeders http://www.phoenixworm.com/servlet/the-template/comparison/Page), can be used as a staple, and have an excellent calcium to phosphorous ratio, which means that they generally do not require any additional calcium supplementation.

Black soldier fly larvae are also very easy to care for. I just keep them in the container they come in. They can live for months without being fed (I've had some live up to three months) and retain their nutrients. They can survive for two to three weeks at room temperature, and for months at about 50-60 degrees Fahrenheit (unfortunately, you can't refrigerate them, as most refrigerators are colder than this). No necessarily lighting or heating. If anything, you may want to moisten the material they come packaged in every now and then, but they do fine without for the most part.

The larvae are also quiet, clean, are not quick (although they do wiggle around enough to catch your bearded dragon's attention) and do not escape. I used crickets for a couple of weeks when I first got my bearded dragon when he was just a month old. I couldn't stand the noise, smell, and the fact that they could easily escape if not watched/handled with care, so I did my research, and switched to black soldier fly larvae (and occasionally superworms), which he has happily been eating for the past year and a half or so. One of the best decisions I've made, ha ha.

I suppose one of the cons is that they're not readily available at your typical pet stores (however, I know that some pet stores are willing to stock them if you ask them about it and/or if you contact ReptiWorms or Phoenix Worms about it). They're also relatively expensive, and don't get very big (meaning it will require you to feed quite a large number of them). You can grow them by feeding them, however. Though at some point, they will turn into flies if fed (and given the proper heat), which could be a neutral/con point, as they are still perfectly fine for your bearded dragon to eat (and may provide them with a good chase); however, they do fly around and make a soft buzzing noise. But the flies cannot harm your bearded dragon, as they do not have mouths, and they're about as clean as whatever they grew up in.

Can't say much about breeding them, but I know it can be done. It sounds relatively difficult though, since it does require making/having a compost and allowing the larvae to mature into flies.

Otherwise, hope you get more information about other feeders, and good luck!

 

[lilblack94gt]

Thanks! I had read a little about black soldier flies. And breeding them sounds expensive and not easy in my area. I will have to look into more prices on them. They are on my list of possible feeders just for the fact that they are rich in calcium. My oldest beardie, refuses to eat anyhing that has been dusted. So currently, I fight with him to get him to open his mouth for liquid calcium and vitamins.

 

[Kaiser]

No problem. If you do decide to try them out, I would personally recommend ordering from http://reptiworms.com/. You can also use the code "bearded20" (without the quotation marks) at checkout to take off 20% of the cost.

And yes, breeding them seems to be relatively difficult. Probably not the best feeder to breed when compared to others. But yes, they've got a great calcium to phosphorous ratio, so that would definitely help out with the calcium-dusting problem, as they wouldn't need to be dusted with calcium (vitamins would still need to be supplemented, though).

Sorry to hear about the trouble your oldest bearded dragon is giving you. Hopefully he learns to take to them. What kind of calcium and vitamin powders are you using? Not sure if a different brand would help, but maybe?

 

[lilblack94gt]

I have tried a coupke different brands with the same results. He used to love them dusted, but now won't touch them. It is the Herpivite brand with D3 for both the calcium and vitamins. I have been tossing around the idea of injecting the supplements into feeders. I thought that hornworms or butter worms would be good for that since they are nice and fat. Might make it easier to inject.

 

[Kaiser]

That's good that you tried different kinds. It's too bad they all came up with the same result. Sorry I can't help much there. But yes, I have heard of using injected hornworms or butter worms to administer medication. Should probably work the same way with liquid supplementation.

And just a note about the hornworms, though I'm sure you've already done a fair share of research: be careful with hornworms, as they do have a pretty powerful bite. I've heard some people clip off the mandibles before feeding. Haven't had any experience with hornworms, but I'm just relaying what I've read, ha ha. If it's any help.

 

[lilblack94gt]

Thanks! I hadn't heard that. From all the pictures I have seen of them, they just look like a giant tomato worm. Guess looks are deceiving. I think I may avoid them lol. I can't handle superworms, I prolly couldn't do a giant caterpillar with pinchers on the front lol :lol:

 

[Kaiser]

Oh, they are tomato worms. Apparently they have mandibles that can bite, but I'm not sure if it's a significant bite or not. Probably just as powerful as an adult cricket or a super worm; not enough to draw blood, but they can whip around and give you a nip that could scare you or your bearded dragon, especially if it's whipping around near the bearded dragon's face. Again, just from what I've read about them. I've also heard that in most cases the bearded dragon will successfully kill it in the first bite, so they should be safe if they're up to par with their chewing, ha ha.

 

[miloandrufusdragons]

Crickets
Pros, healthy, low fat.
Cons, smell, not filling, jumpy

Superworms
Pros, filling, healthy, cheap
Cons, somewhat high in fat,