Baby Beardie - open mouth???

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WolfMama

Hatchling Member
Okay, I’m really worried now. I’m hoping this is not an emergency and our beardie is okay!

Out of the blue he keeps opening his mouth! I panicked thinking he was choking. But then he closed his mouth. But then he opened it again… We looked it up and found that some beardies do this to regulate their heat when basking (and he was in his basking spot at the time). He hasn’t moved from his basking spot. This began at approx 6 PM (it is now 9:27 PM). I watched him, and he seemed to stop, but he’s now doing it again. So, I’m not sure if he stopped or just figured “good, now you’ll stop staring at me. “ (of course I’m kidding. Then again? …)

Here’s what happened prior, and the conditions of his viv…

He’s 4” long (from what I’m finding out, he’s not much bigger then a hatchling). We adopted him on Saturday from a pet store. I’d been visiting him for 2 weeks prior and he’d not grown. Thanks to onlymediocre here we’ve made a couple of important changes (UVB bulb and night heat lamp).

He is in a 20 gallon tank, bedded on reptile eco carpet. He has a large branch, an house, and a mini-house (which I used to keep some water in as he seemed to like going in it on occasion, but took out the other day).

He has a reptisun 10.0 UVB bulb that runs the length of his viv. A 100 W powersun UVB lamp (also a red infrared heat lamp, but we’ve stopped using that).

The night before last the humidity went up to 45%. We had a small amount of water in his viv, and I took that out. The next morning it was 50%, and last night 60%. It’s been raining here. I decided to turn on the A/C (we don’t need it, but it would help to take out the humidity. A dehumidifier would be too hot for our home at this time of year). Now, as it turns out, we only had the digital thermometer at the resting end of the tank (was in the middle, but got moved temporarily and hadn’t changed it back that day). After turning on the A/C, the humidity went down to 45 degrees. Temp was approx. 85 degrees.

When he started to open his mouth, I moved the thermometer to his basking are to make sure the temp was okay. Temp was approx. 105 degrees to 115 degrees (depending on how close to light), and humidity is only 20% at that end.

(Yes, we just bought dial thermometer and hydrometer to stick on the back today.)

Diet: He’s been eating gut loaded crickets from the pet shop. They are small crickets. I introduced dandelion greens and collard greens. He began eating them on Monday after many tries (he never had greens at the pet shop.). I hand feed those to him.

Yesterday I introduced phoenix worms to him as a mid-day feeding (crickets in AM and PM, greens and a couple of hours later, phoenix worms). Yesterday was his best eating. He ate 6 crickets in the AM and 6 in the PM. He did not want his greens yesterday, but a couple of hours later he ate 9 phoenix worms (they are very small. I rinse the bedding off of them in water).

Yesterday we had a scare. When I fed him the Phoenix worms, after the 9th one he kept opening his mouth and sticking his tongue out. I got nervous then, and my son realized he had a hair hanging from his mouth, so he picked him up and gently pulled it out of his mouth. He, apparently, begun to swallow a large piece of it :O He was fine after that.

I have long hair, so it was my fault :( I don’t know how that happened. I pull it back now, before I feed him.

This morning he ate 7 crickets. He did not want any of his greens this afternoon. He ate 3 phoenix worms. After he ate the three phoenix worms, I misted him (hadn’t given him a bath). I was told they enjoy that, and he is usually okay with it, and sometimes lick the water, but he didn’t seem to care for it this time.

About 15 minutes after I misted him (which is also approx. the same amount of time since he’d eaten the phoenix worms) is when the mouth opening started! Now he was in his basking spot.

Now, he was doing it moments before I fed him this evening. He did eat 5 crickets then went back to his basking spot.

Also, this afternoon, before the phoenix worms and open mouth incident began, he seemed to be developing stress marks, and I’ve no idea why. When I took him out to pet him, they lessened.

Just before feeding him tonight, when he was opening his mouth, the stress marks were darker. After eating, they are lighter.

His eyes and nose appear to be clear. I don’t see a discharge. He’s not as active as he normally is. He’s been basking most of the day. Since he began the open mouth, he’s been in the same spot. He came down to eat and catch the crickets. Cute, actually… he’s become accustomed to our moving his stuff about to catch the left over crickets when he is done. He just sat on his log while we slid it back and forth to catch the crickets, as if watching a show. LOL.

Is the open mouth normal? I have a pic of him with his mouth open, if that will help.

Thanks!

Oh, I did do one other thing… I turned his large log around, as I thought he may want to climb close to the heat source. So, I just turned it back in case that was bothering him. It’s a large log that twists and he can lie down under the light or at various points around it. He was *not* on the high point when he began the open mouth.

Okay, freaking out, again. Was just about to hit send and mention that I’ve not noticed him doing the open mouth for approx. an hour (that’s not to say he wasn’t, but every time I looked over he wasn’t.). He just started to do it, again :(
 

WolfMama

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
Here are a couple of images.

10-4-20123-46-30AM_0371_zps1da11f60.jpg

10-4-20123-46-23AM_0370_zps8077bd85.jpg
 

WolfMama

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
More going on :(

Usually our baby beardie goes right to sleep after lights out. He goes to his little spot and passes out till lights on in the AM. Tonight, when his light went off at 10:30 PM, he ran and was begging at the side of the tank by the lamp as if pleading to turn it back on. I did, and he went back to his branch. I waited 1/2 hour and turned it off. The temp dropped in minutes from 105 in basking area to 89.2. Again, he began to beg at the side of his tank. So, we just turned on the night basking light (, and he happily went back up on his log. He does NOT want his light out! I'm thinking he really wants the heat.

I haven't noticed his mouth open up since we began this lights on, lights off.
 

Spikeshuman

Juvie Member
The dial thermometer isn't the best way to take the temp. In fact.. if its 115 on a dial thermometer.. I would actually think that his surface temp could be too hot, because its measuring the over all air temp and not the spot where your dragon is sitting. When Spikes basking spot is at 105.. the dial thermometer actually reads 91. I keep a probe right on her basking spot so I know the exact temp where she is sitting. The humidity is hard to control well in a 20g, especially if you live in a humid area.. or if its raining a lot.

Mouth gaping itself is not a bad thing.. but you might want to look into your set up and get a temp gun or a probe thermometer.
 

WolfMama

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
Hi. I have a digital with a sensor. In my post, I mentioned that we then got the dial thermometers as additional. But, the temps I posted were with the sensor. When I said it was fluctuating between 105 - 115 (max) degrees, that temp was taken with the digital, not the dial. Prior to moving it, I tested the cooler end, and it was 85 degrees (and I tested the humidty both with the digistal sensor. The temps I posted were with the digital sensor). Then I put the new dial there, and it registered the same 85 degrees. So, as far as the cooling end, it seems to be accurate. I also put a dial in the midway.

I just heard about the temp gun. I'll look into that.

I don't know what suddenly started the mouth gaping. It sure scared me. He finally went to sleep - but I'm not doing what I just did again. I feel TERRIBLE! He started to look around again and seemed to want his light back on. I turned out the night light (as I did stop using it and only turned it on this time because he realy wanted a light on). He ran to his sleeping corner and started begging at that end. So, we turned off all the lights in the room and left it for an hour. Came back, and the poor lil' guy is sleeping standing up still in his begging position on the glass :( There has to be a better way! Next time I'll rock him to sleep. LOL (almost did that tonight. LOL. He started to go to sleep in my hand, in his viv, but then hopped off).

The pics don't seem to have come through. What did I do wrong? Thought they might help.


Spikeshuman":1t5y77h9 said:
The dial thermometer isn't the best way to take the temp. In fact.. if its 115 on a dial thermometer.. I would actually think that his surface temp could be too hot, because its measuring the over all air temp and not the spot where your dragon is sitting. When Spikes basking spot is at 105.. the dial thermometer actually reads 91. I keep a probe right on her basking spot so I know the exact temp where she is sitting. The humidity is hard to control well in a 20g, especially if you live in a humid area.. or if its raining a lot.

Mouth gaping itself is not a bad thing.. but you might want to look into your set up and get a temp gun or a probe thermometer.
 

Spikeshuman

Juvie Member
I think rocking him to sleep sounds like a great idea. So many people on this forum put their beardies to bed in their arms. I wish I could.. but when I take Spike out.. she thinks play time. Even if she was nearly asleep in her viv.. when I take her out and get a snuggly blanket for her.. she perks up and starts crawling all over me. If you can get him to sleep in something nice and soft.. then place him into his viv.. it just might stop that glass dancing when you turn off his lights.

As for the gaping.. unless there is a problem with his temps.. or he seems stressed in some way.. I wouldn't worry too much about it. I miss Spikes gaping. I am not sure why.. but she has stopped doing it. Her temps have not changed.. she just stopped.
 

vampy

Juvie Member
Gaping when basking = normal


P1000796 by vampyyy, on Flickr

My bf's female will sometimes sit under her light gaping for ages. I call her lazy for not being bothered to move out of the heat.

Sleeping in ridiculous positions is also totally normal
 

Onlymediocre

Juvie Member
Id say the gaping is pretty normal too :) I wouldnt be too alarmed by it. Mine do it, Beardies are lazy and theyll gape instead of moving to a little bit of a cooler spot. Dont feel bad that he fell asleep standing up, beardies sleep wierd, check out this post where theres beardies sleeping in all sorts of odd positions, it had me and the hubby laughing >> viewtopic.php?f=30&t=141955&start=330&hilit=beardies+sleeping+every+which+way If theres darkness theyll go to sleep, taking him out and rocking him to sleep is a good idea tho. I take mine out, one at a time, and wrap them in a washcloth and they fall asleep, then Ill place the washcloth on their hammocks. Im think it hlps wih the bonding too.
 

WolfMama

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
I think I’m going to develop stress marks, soon :p

TYVM, Spikeshuman, Vampy, and Onlymediocre!!! I very much appreciate the replies! I want to reply fully to them, but first, there is a new problem.

He did the gaping this am (odd as his temps were not yet 100 degrees when he did it, but he had recently woken up so maybe it was just adapting to the increase? But after reading the comforting replies, I decided to try to relax about it and just keep a close eye – when something new developed :(

I’m really worried. He’s not eating today AT ALL. Offered him crickets this am, he didn’t touch one of them. I waited and hour and offered him collard greens, not a bite. Waited another hour then offered him another cricket – nothing. Gave him phoenix worms – nothing.

He did defecate this morning. I gave him a bath for the first time. He was not amused. :p

I scrubbed down the sink with anti-bacterial soap and rinsed well The sink water was just warm to the touch of the wrist. Put a towel down, and filled ¼” . Used the water conditioner. Put him in. Dropped some with a dropper on his nose (he didn’t lick any off). After about 5 minutes, he came out. He started to doze in there at one point (scared me) – I didn’t expect that.

I rubbed his belly a little while he was in the sink (just to be on the safe side).

I buritoed (term we use when we wrap guinea pigs that way :) ) in a towel and he closed his eyes and went fast asleep.

He’s basking now. I’ve just finished cleaning and disinfecting everything after his bath.

I think I’ll buy some sort of flat container to bathe him in. The tub is way too big right now, and the sink slopes.

What can I do to get him to eat? :( Why might he have stopped eating?

I’m glad you all agree to rocking him to sleep :) I was afraid someone would think I was crazy (well, I’m sure someone does and was nice enough not to reply – LOL! But, I’m glad for the like-minded support :)

Spkeshuman, you’ve given me an idea. I'll reserve the blanket for resting. Maybe he will then associate it with sleeping? Hopefully that will help.

I’ll have to post the pics of when he fell asleep standing up against his rock. That we were amazed at, and I checked to see if it was normal here, and found some threads on it. I was glad it was. I think I mentioned in another thread that he sloped at 10 degree increments (sound asleep) until he was on the ground. It was cute and funny, and surprising, all at the same time. We’re like… how can that be comfortable? LOL.

But when he fell asleep against the glass, I felt SO bad, as that was because he didn’t want his light out :(

LOL, Vampy. Yeah, you'd think they'd move to a cooler spot? The pic is cute. Looks like they are a choir. LOL.

Oh, thank you for the link on how to post pics, OnlyMediocre. I was able to fix the problem. I’d put the address from the address bar in the img tag, that was where I went wrong.

Will definitely check out the sleeping positions link. Sounds very cute :) Thanks for sharing :) I’ll share the pic of him sleeping on his toes.

I’m just so worried right now, again, that he’s not eating :(
 

Spikeshuman

Juvie Member
About a week or two after I got Spike.. she stopped eating for 2 days. I was terrified.. then she shed her skin over the next two days or so.. and slowly started eating again.. few crickets here.. and a few there.. and after the shed she was back to 30+ crickets at a feeding. She still goes days where she eats next to nothing.. and I hate it. I wouldn't worry until its more than two days. I am not sure why they eat less when they are about to shed.. but they do. Someone once told me that their old skin is tight and its uncomfortable so they get all irritated and grumpy and that's why they don't eat. Keep an eye on it for sure.. and keep trying to feed at meal times. Hopefully he will eat something. If his appetite doesn't come back in a day or so .. then I would start getting concerned and worry about impaction or some other digestion issue. Has he pooped today? If he was eating fine yesterday .. he should poop today. If he doesn't do that then maybe hes got an issue.. and try another nice warm bath and rub his tummy a bit.
 

WolfMama

Hatchling Member
Original Poster
Thanks for replying Spikeshuman!

Okay, hopefully that's it, then.

He did leave a present this morning. :) So, that was good. After his bath, about 2 hours later, he defecated, again. That's the first time he's had two bowel movements in one day. So, i guess that's good.

He finally ate 2 crickets (not a lot, but at least something). I'll let you know how he eats this evening (feeding him in about an hour from now).
 

diamc

BD.org Sicko
Staff member
Moderator
Your beardie is adorable, awesome coloring!

Gaping can indeed be normal but I did want to mention to make sure that the sensor is actually resting on (touching) the basking log or rock, then be sure to wait at least 45 min to an hr for the temp to stop rising before getting the final reading.

Babies can get dehydrated very quickly so be sure to give him baths at least 3 to 4 times a wk.

Sorry if any of this was already mentioned.
 

Spikeshuman

Juvie Member
I just had a thought about the sleeping issues. I know most people here advise against a night time light.. and they are right.. Spike wont sleep if she can see at all. She will just sit there all angry and wait for the light to go out. BUT.. she also needs warmth when she sleeps. She likes it to be at least 80 where she sleeps. You can use one of two things.. ceramic heat emitters will give your baby heat without any light.. OR.. you can use a black bulb like I do. The 50w one puts out heat.. with no light. I think it is a zoomed bulb. I tried one with a higher wattage to make it a little warmer.. and the higher wattage puts out too much light and she wouldn't sleep.
 
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