Appetite down, yet energetic

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peachie

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Sorry this is a little long, but it's my first posting/first beardie, so I want to be thorough.

I rescued Zisa, a 4 year old male, in late January. For the most part, I hadn't had trouble getting him to eat his veggies, though sometimes I would have to hand feed them to get him interested. But for the last month and a half or so, he lost all interest in veggies. Last week, and the week before, the only veggie he would eat was butternut squash, and I had to hand feed it to him. He wouldn't eat them on his own. He was still eating his worms (I feed him supers, which I know are not the optimum feeder worm. I'm going to try hornworms or phoenix worms once this batch is gone.) But this week he'll only eat a worm or two a day, then he's done. Before he would gobble up as many as I'd throw in there without hesitation.

He had a period of time where he was suffering from improper lighting, and was quite lethargic. I had the reptisun 10.00 compact uvb bulb, but now we have a flourescent tube. It's the reptiglo 10.0, and I'm aware of the disparity about that brand due to a bad batch in the past, and I would not have personally picked up that kind, it was my partner who bought it. But he seems to be doing much better with this light so far. He perked up right after we installed it. We've also been taking him outside more. Usually once a day while it's been warm and sunny, and he runs around and explores. He always poops when we take him outside too, which is convenient. He has all this energy but no appetite at all, and it's quite concerning to me, because my vet told us he was underweight. We've been doing some research and are wondering if mating season hormonal changes might be a possible culprit. He's been pretty squirrely last few days especially, and he was head bobbing a lot outside today, something he ALMOST NEVER does. Any thoughts?

Also worth mentioning that he's been going through a long problem shed, but has been a relatively good sport about it, and it's almost completely done. He was eating fine through most of it, and never got aggressive. The vet gave us some good tips on how to move it along. Just a patch on his head remains as of now.

Set up overview
50 gal tank, 4X1 ft. I'm going to try building him something bigger soon.
Lights: reptiglo 10.0 uvb fluorescent tube, only 38 inches long, we have it situated in the middle of the viv.
We just had to replace our basking light and are trying a 35 watt halogen flood light. We'd tried higher wattages but they made the surface temp of the basking spot much too hot, even when we raised it as high as it could go. 35 watt seems fine for now since it's been hot out, but we'll definitely change when the weather gets cooler.
Temps around 80-105 from the cool end to the warm end, the surface temp of the basking spot is currently 110-115
He has a rock underneath the basking spot that doubles as a hide, some branches he climbs to get closer to his uvb light, also situated to act as a hide.
Substrate is slate tile.

Usual diet, before the appetite problem started
Daily veggies: Collard greens, dandelion greens, butternut squash
Veggies a few times a week: kale, carrot, broccoli, cucumber
Protein: Superworms. Used to be 3 times a week, but vet recommended daily worms to get his weight up.
Vitamins: We were using a calcium supplement, but our vet gave us t-rex juvenile iguana food to use instead, saying that it was a more balanced alternative. We either grind the pellets, or mist them in his veggie bowl to soften them. Have not had any problems with these so far.
Treats, once or twice a week: Strawberry, apple, grape, raspberry, mango, watermelon.

Zisa's my first beardie, and I rescued him from a home that didn't care for him particularly well. Other beardie owners I know have said it could take time before he's used to proper care, and might cause these dietary issues. I'd just love to get some additional input from the forum on my situation.
 

diamc

BD.org Sicko
Staff member
Moderator
Hi, welcome to the forum. Zisa sounds like a very lucky guy. :p

Would it be possible to post a picture of him in his tank so we can see his setup?

What type of thermometer are you using, digital strip, round gauge (dial), temperature gun or digital thermometer with long wire & probe end? If the basking surface temp is 110 to 115, that is too high for a 4 yr old. Babies need a basking temp of 110 (but no higher) and an adults basking temp should be about 98 to 104 or so. You would need to find the basking temp he prefers in that range. Where does he spend most of his time while he's in his tank?

Good that he enjoys being outside. Make sure to replace the Repti-Glo 10.0 tube after 5 to 6 months of use as that's when they decline. When it is time for replacement, you should consider getting the Repti-Sun 10.0 tube instead as those are a better bulb and can be kept at a distance within 6 to 8" for proper UVB exposure. For now, make sure the Repti-Glo is about 10" from your beardie while in his basking spot so the UVB needs to be right alongside a bright white basking bulb. If closer than 10", your beardie could develop eye issues.

How often are you bathing him? If he hasn't had a bath in the last few days, I highly recommend that you give him a nice long bath to make sure he is well hydrated as the higher temps the tanks are, the quicker they can get somewhat dehydrated.

You're feeding good daily veggies. Even though you're feeding the iguana food, you should still dust his supers 3 times a wk because the UVB and calcium work together to synthesize the right amount of calcium in their bodies and one won't work without the other.
 

peachie

Member
Original Poster
I'm having a rough time getting a good picture. The lighting inside my house is not working with my phone very well today. It's a lot brighter than it looks in the viv. And disregard the temp strip. We aren't using that. It was just on there when we got it.
http://i.imgur.com/GLsZhKJ.jpg

We're using the digital probe thermometer and we have it situated on the cool side. We also have a digital humidity reader from exoterra. It usually sits around 35%. We also have the temp gun that we use to measure the basking temp. I raised the lamp a bit and it brought the surface temp of the basking spot down to 105.

One thing I'm aware of, and a little frustrated about lacking is a solid top. The previous owner never used a top and we got almost everything we have from that owner. Since we plan to build him a better enclosure asap, we've been using plywood in the mean time. That method is slightly in flux since we've changed our original lighting arrangement, leaving some gaps that used to not be there. We've been covering those gaps with towels. They seem to be doing the job well enough, but I know having a solid top/overall better viv, is preferable, and I'm working towards that goal.

Zisa spends most of his time either at the basking spot or just next to it in the morning, then moves over to the middle of the viv later in the day, (it's been pretty hot this week so he's been sitting in the middle quite often.) sitting on top of his log under the light (the distance is about 10 inches) then moves underneath the branches when he gets tired in the evening. He rarely goes all the way to the very end of the cool side. He seems to like that more central area or slightly to the left of it.

I could start dusting his worms again. Our vet didn't want us to use both the calcium and the iguana food simultaneously out of concern for overdose risk. But since he's not eating his veggie-pellet mix, he does need to get those vitamins somehow, so I'll dust the worms from now on. He was more interested in his worms today than he was yesterday. We used to be able to get him to eat the veggies by making him the "worm salad" and that only worked for a while. Now he just stares at the worms and doesn't try to eat them until they crawl out of the veggie bowl. (the little butt!!!)

I gave him a bath about 3 days ago. Sometimes I just mist him a bit when I take him out. We're about to leave for the weekend so I'll give him a good long soak before we do. (I have a friend coming over to feed him and keep an eye on his temps each day we're gone.)

I was able to get him to eat 3 pieces of butternut squash today and 2 pieces of collards. And he ate about 4 supers on his own before he decided he was done. One thing about Zisa that makes it even harder to get him to eat is that whether we have to hand feed him, or if he eats on his own, when he misses his target too many times he sometimes gets frustrated about it and loses interest. Even though he's hungry. I don't really know why he's so sensitive about it. I do my best to encourage him to keep trying when this happens, and sometimes he tries again, but sometimes he just gives up and walks away. It's really strange.
 

peachie

Member
Original Poster
Here is my vet's page on food and supplements. http://www.swanimalhospital.net/_files/animalInfo.php He's the only exotic pet vet in my city, and he's the guy that all the other vets I've talked to, and even our local zoo, recommends. He also gave us a pretty thorough sheet with information about food, containing the nutrition balance, mainly phosphorus and calcium levels, for different foods. He stands by the pellets, and it could be because he's required to sell them more than anything. And I was skeptical. He told us that all his info came from a fairly recent study about reptile nutrition. I've researched this best I could, and looked up his reputation and haven't found any complaints or problems with his dietary advice so far. I've read about using the pellets on other forums, and it seems that it's a fine option as long as the vitamin balance in the mix ok. The t-rex juvenile iguana formula is what my vet gave me at Zisa's first check up, and told me that as long as he's eating it regularly, it should be enough of what he needs.

I just gave Zisa a few calcium dusted worms regardless, since he has not been eating anything regularly, and will continue to do so 3 times a week, at least for now, and maybe consistently. And I'll probably have to give my vet a call soon too, to address supplement concerns and ask some questions. I've gotten info from him that's a little different than a lot of the info I find online, and if it weren't for his seemingly spotless rep, and him being the only reptile vet around, I would be more skeptical than I'm allowing myself to be.
 

peachie

Member
Original Poster
SO
I had started feeding him blended food with an eye dropper, but stupidly used glass, and he bit the end right off and swallowed it. So I took him to the vet immediately, and there wasn't much they could do for him, but they said the piece was probably small enough to pass through without hurting him. I have to keep a close eye on him for a few days and make sure everything's ok. They gave me a better syringe. But it was a good opportunity to try and figure out what's causing this lack of appetite in the first place, and he got another check up. They don't see anything wrong with him. He is completely healthy, aside from being underweight, and having a tiny piece of glass in his stomach since this morning. I was instructed to keep up with the syringe feeding for a while, but start experimenting with all new foods asap. He might just be bored with the food we've been giving him.

What kind of foods do your beardies go absolutely nuts for?
It used to be the squash and superworms for Zisa, but I guess those days are over.
 
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