age and size..is this normal??

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honeypie

Member
hello, my beardie Orbison is about two years old( I'm not really sure because when i bought her she was about 5 inches and they said she was maybe six months old...which i doubt) and she is about 15 inches from head to tail. I'm wondering if this is normal for her age? she hasn't seemed to grow longer but wider for quite some time. People always call her fat(which she kindof is) but one day i took her with me to get worms and someone asked if she was always that wide or if she was just mad. It kinda made me feel like i'm not taking care of her well enough. Do all beardies grow to about the same size or are each of them different? Is she extremely small for her age and should i be concerned at all? Her diet has changed because she got an injury from crickets and now won't eat them at all. She gets veggies and different worms.
 

KairaandTaz08

Juvie Member
Hi there,

This does vary greatly from beardie to beardie. Does she have a tail nip at all? This happens a lot when they are babies, siblings think it's food or they are crowded and get a bit aggressive. Kaira has a slight tail nip and at 5 yrs old I think she's under 18" long (been awhile since I checked, but they are typically full-grown at 18 months or so, at least in length-but like humans, they can gain weight and become rounder after this).
It also sounds like your girl may have had some stunted growth early in life, before you got her. That could explain why she may appear a bit petite.
And your sure she's female? If there's been a sudden change in her belly, she may be gravid (even with no male, they can lay infertile eggs-Kaira just had surgery related to this).
Do you have any pics of her? I'm a bit confused on what the size issues may be...are you worried she's too fat and not long enough? Pictures would help either way to just get a good look at her. :)
No, all beardies grow to different sizes and some are smaller/fatter/longer/shorter, etc. And they can all still be healthy, but a picture would help to be more sure of that.
She is "smaller" than what I'm used to, but not by much and considering her size when you got her, I think she's done well if she really was 6 months and 5". There are even some "miniature" beardies, that for whatever reason, are simply smaller than the "norm", but I think if she is "smaller" than average it is most likely due to her care before you got her.
I don't think you need to feel bad, you are checking and asking questions--all the right things IMO.

If you are really worried though, or just want to, I'd be happy to look over the basics (post the questions about set-up/food/etc.). I'm not claiming to know everything or be an expert by any means, but I do know the basics pretty well and have some personal experience.

Hope that helps some to start with :)
Abi
 

honeypie

Member
Original Poster
hello,
im not sure if she has a tailnip but her tail curls up at the end a little
IMG_0001_zps48fa7a5e.jpg


when I bought her(from a pet store) she was the runt, the smallest in the pack. The skinniest too. Here's some pictures from the first day I got her
SAM_0350_zpscf3540df.jpg
SAM_0346_zpsf1d32c9c.jpg
beardie_zpsae28559a.jpg


You know im not positive that she is actually a she. Ive had a pet store employee tell me she was female and my vet has her down as female but when i lift her tail and follow instructions on how to sex I see two long lumps with an hourglass shape in the middle and not one lump in the center... I don't know if these pictures will help at all but...
IMG_0006_zps0a449b65.jpg
IMG_0004_zps74f2b96e.jpg


yes im worried that she is too fat and not long enough. My vet has told me she's a little overweight but nothing to worry about just to give her more exercise. here she is now
IMG_0003_zps925c0ac0.jpg
IMG_0002_zps9306986b.jpg


I have talked to so many people about lighting and basics that it's hard to figure out who's actually right. I have posted two other questions on this sight without any help,so I would be so grateful if you would go over basics with me

I will say her diet went through a pretty big change a while back. If you look at the last pictures in the middle of her back she has a scar from some crickets that bit her. Now she won't touch a cricket. She gets fed worms and veggies, which I am told could be the reason she's overweight.
 

zandi202

BD.org Addict
1. How old is your dragon?

2. How long have you had your dragon?

3. How long is your dragon?

4. What is the sex of your dragon?

5. What size enclosure do you have your dragon in?

6. What type substrate do you have on the bottom of your tank?

7. Do you use UVB lights?

8. If so, Is it a coil, compact, fluorescent tube, or Mercury Vapor bulb?

9. What is the brand name and number of your bulb? Wattage (if MVB)?

10. How old is your UVB bulb?

11. How close can your dragon get to the UVB?

12. Do you use a separate basking bulb? What kind and what is the wattage? Is it a white or colored bulb?

13. What are the basking temps?

14. What is the cool side temp?

15. Do you take the temps with a stick on thermometer, a digital thermometer with a wire and a probe end or a temp gun?

16. Where exactly are you taking your basking temps?

17. Do you use a heat rock or heat pad?

18. What do you feed your dragon? Please be specific.

19. How often do you feed and what time do you feed (morning, afternoon, night)?

20. Do you gutload (feed) your crickets, worms, etc?

21. Do you use vitamin or calcium supplements? What brand(s)? How many days a week do you use each of them?

22. Is your dragon having regular bowel movements (poops)?

23. Do you bath your dragon? How often?

24. Do you mist your dragon or offer water other than in the bath?

25. Have you gotten a vet check and fecal done?

26. Does your dragon share an enclosure with another dragon?
 

honeypie

Member
Original Poster
1. im guessing she's about 2 years old. i bought her a year and 8 months ago. I asked them how old they thought she was and they said 6 months...but im not sure. she was about 5 inches when i bought her.
2. a year and 8 months
3. she is 15 inches from head to tail
4. ive had her sexed as female but im not sure...there are pictures above but i need to go to my vet and have him look
5. right now i have her in a 40 gallon tank..not for long though because we are building her a new one this summer measuring 48 x 24
6. i have slate tile in the bottom of her tank
7. i have an all in one UVA UVB light on her... it's the exo terra solar glow right now
8. mercury vapor
9.i believe its either 100 or 125 i didn't buy it so i would have to look to make sure
10. im thinking about a year old. probably time to replace...
11. she's about 10 inches from the light
12. no i only use one bulb
13. its not hot enough in there i know because its about 91.8...i haven't had the money for a digital thermometer but just recently got one
14. about 80
15. digital thermometer
16.i have her thermom on the back wall of her cage right behind her tree basking spot
17. no heat rock or pad
18. she eats superworms and vegetables..sometimes wax worms for treats. with veggies she eats mustard greens or collards, sometimes bok choy
19. i try to feed twice a day but she doesn't have a schedule..she just eats when she wants but usually in the afternoon she will eat. im going to be putting her on a tighter schedule (which im making up right now) so she gets everything she needs.
20. no
21. no i do not which has been a huge mistake
22. no she doesn't. she has started getting more baths and that seems to help her though...hopefully she'll get on a more regular schedule.
23. she used to maybe get one a week but now i have her on a three a week schedule
24. yes..she wont drink from a bowl
25. she hasn't had a fecal done in a couple of months because the last time i took her she had a parasite. she needs a check up
26. nope she's all by her lonesome
 

zandi202

BD.org Addict
1. 6" is usually 1.5 months old-ish. Meaning she is probably 1 year and 9.5months old roughly

3. 15" is very small, minimum is usually 17"-18"

7. You should switch UVB to a PowerSun. It is similar to what you have but better.

10. They should be replaced every six months more or less.

13. Temp should be minimum of 95 for proper digestion and most prefer a temp of 100-105.

20-21. She should be getting her live feeders dusted. Since she is older I would recommend the repashy since it is calc and vit in one since she doesn't eat live feeders every day like she would as a baby.

22. Adults don't poo as often. If you're worried, you can feed her some pumpkin from a can so long as it has no spices. It helps regulate poo.

23-24. I would stop misting because that can raise the humidity in the tank and cause URI which she might have. Baths every other/every two days will take care of any hydration problems. Also bathe every day when they're shedding because that dehydrates them very easily.

25. I might get a vet check up in general and see what their opinion is.

Hope this helps.
P.S. She looks like a she to me :)
 

Gail

BD.org Addict
Don't worry about her length. Genetics have a lot to do with how big a dragon gets and she might just come from a smaller line. She looks really good, nice and plump. If you are worried about her weight, cut down on live feeders and stop the waxies altogether.
Getting her on supplements is important. Personally I like separate calcium and vitamins, its too easy to overdoes on vitamins while trying to get the proper amount of calcium. For a adult, you give calcium 3 x a week and vit 2 x a week. Just a pinch on greens or dust her feeders.
Looks like a girl to me.
 

honeypie

Member
Original Poster
thank you to everyone who responded!

I know I need to switch her light soon but have been reading about both the powersun and the solar glow being harmful. Should I skip both and find an alternative? I looked at the lighting for newbies post on here and there are three lights on the cage.. which I thought was a bit excessive. do you really need that many lights? i've been using one for a while. what do you all have or what have you had?

I'm glad to hear about her length.. it's always worried me a little. Im not so worried about her weight because my vet has stated in the past that she looked good. Thanks for the advice on calcium and vit as well... im going to start that right away. ive read that what type of calcium you need depends on what kind of lighting you have.. does anyone know if this is true?
 

KairaandTaz08

Juvie Member
Hi, I'll respond to that last one first, real quick. I don't know much about the solar glo or powersun.
If you choose to try the tube type (only UVB/UVA rays, not heat) ReptiSun 10.0 linear tube bulbs are recommended (not a coil, it's a fluorescent tube-like bulb that's good). Also Acardia...something??? Someone else have the other recommended one?
The tubes should be the length of the enclosure- 4ft cage, 48" bulb, 3ft cage, 36" bulb, etc. And she should be able to get between 6 to 8" of the UVB. Then adjust a bright white bulb for basking/heat source.
You can buy them online at several reptile supply stores. If you choose ReptiSun 10.0 then reptilesupply.com petmountain.com and a few other places have them.

If you choose to continue with an MVB, you may not need Calcium with D3, there's some proof (or was when I tried the MVB a couple years back but gave up because of the constant inconsistency) that MVB bulbs do the Vitamin D3 thing alone (wow, really scientifically worded there :roll: , sorry).
I recommend RepCal brands, and separate as Gail suggested, I don't know about the combos.
If you use an MVB (the powersun/solar glos, I believe) then get calcium without D3 (unless someone knows more about these specific MVBs and D3) and I'd recommend the RepCal brand Herptivite as a multivitamin.
If you decide to go with the linear/tube UVB's (ReptiSun 10.0 and the other brand I can't remember) than you'll want the calcium dust with D3 (I use RepCal's Calcium w/ D3-pink label) and the same RepCal multivitamin-Herptivite (blue label).

Hope that helped that part. I also agree about the waxies and what Gail said about her length. :D

Abi
 

honeypie

Member
Original Poster
I am thinking im going to switch to a reptisun tube because obviously I need a new light but am not sure I want to continue with a bulb that is being said to have problems. I haven't read anything about issues with a reptisun or arcadia so I think that might be a better option. Right now my light is on a custom lighting stand that my dad made for me and I am wondering if I use two different lights do both of them have to be inside the cage(the UVB and basking)? if they don't we could cut the stand down and still use it. I guess it will depend on the new cage we want to build. So there should be a light going all the way across the cage? what about the cool side.. shouldn't it be a little darker? she doesn't have a hide right now except under her tree.. would she ever want to get away from the UVB? I know that's an odd question but im learning haha :)

oh..im reading the lighting for newbies thread here and she is saying to use a regular house light for basking... do you know if they really work? also should the UVB light be above the cage or in the cage? she is also saying to buy an under the counter light fixture and attach it to the inside with some 3M command hooks.

im so glad about her length. Now I will just tell people that nothing is wrong with her and she grows at her own speed and YES! she is always that wide :lol:
 

foolsgold

Hatchling Member
I can vouch for the Arcadia bulbs. Got mine from lightyourreptiles. com and Todd is awesome. Great guy, fast shipping and I think a tank could have rolled over my package and the bulbs would have come through all right :lol:
I have two dragons and when I switched from a reptisun10 to the arcadia my runt/genetic defect dragon that I was having to force feed started eating on his own. Now that it's warmer I take both of them out for sunning time in the back yard.
 

KairaandTaz08

Juvie Member
Hi there,

I'm sorry I disappeared for awhile there (lots going on with Kaira and stuff).

How's the new enclosure going? Did you get anymore answers about the other questions you had?

Regular household bulbs do work in smaller tanks. I use a combination for heat depending on the time of year. I have a 75 gallon for Kaira (hopefully she'll get moved into the 125 gallon when she heals more from the surgery she had last month) and halogen flood lights are what I use as the main basking bulb (between a 50watt and 75watt is usually enough for the 75 gallon this time of year). I also have a smaller fixture that I have on and off, with a 40watt bright white/normal household bulb, depending on the chill in Kaira's room (it's her and the bugs/supplies for her and them now lol) that I will place in between the cool side and warmer/basking spot side if needed to raise general temps in her enclosure.

Most do say the UVB (of a tube, like the ReptiSun 10.0 or Arcadia) should not have a screen between them and the beardie (I can't do this at the moment and the tops of the larger tanks I have do not have as small of holes in the lids, so it's been *enough* for Kaira for years, but technically, I should have it open or the UVB in the tank itself). I'm not sure on the distance for the Arcadia, but if you use ReptiSun10.0, you'll want her to be able to get between 6 to 8" of the bulb.
I don't recommend the heat/basking bulbs in the cage, but some do. Just be sure she can't get close enough to jump on it...Kaira can jump surprisingly high so I don't trust her not to accidently hurt herself.
As for the length of the UVB (not odd at all, very good one to ask after using an MVB)...recently I just read another article on here (by Tracie- Drache613- who I highly recommend if you ever have complex health questions-her guidance has saved Kaira's life) on UVB lighting/lighting in general. The tube UVB lighting is recommend to be 3/4 length of the cage or at least 3/4 length of the cage (can't remember which way it was said). Though, I do have a UVB run the whole length of Kaira's tank, and haven't been told this is bad. So, 3/4 the length is good.
I'm not sure if she'll want a spot away from the UVB this time of year....Kaira's not the best comparison, but she's typically basking (even before the surgery/health issues) the majority of the day and only goes to the cool side a few times. Perhaps if you're girl burmates, she'd want that, but that's typically during the colder months.
Under counter light fixtures are great...my tank is too large, but I did use them before (as babies in smaller tanks).

Not sure if I explained my set-up before or not, but I have a 4ft fluorescent fixture I got at home depot or something that fits 2 tube bulbs. Kaira's in the 75gallon, as I said, and it is 4ft long, so she has one 48"/4ft long ReptiSun 10.0 bulb in that fixture and then a normal 48"/4ft long fluorescent tube bulb in the other spot on the double fixture. On the basking side I have a stand, and a 10" brooder light fixture (I think, I've had several types over the years) right over her basking spot, with the double fixture right beside it.

Does that help a little more with the lighting/UVB?

The Arcadia is supposed to be good, I only have experience with the ReptiSun 10.0 and 1 type of MVB (that I gave up on years ago, because there always seems to be a problem with them).

Did you reduce the waxies any? I do think that will be healthier long term, but she's fine :D

Abi
 

honeypie

Member
Original Poster
hi there! Don't worry crazy around here too. My boyfriend had a death in the family and had to go to NC and he came home to no water because there's a water leak in the bathroom!

The new cage hasn't been started yet because we have no room for it at the moment. There are 7 people living here and 3 are moving out soon so we'll have to start later. But I am overly excited about building it and have a million ideas and have also been scouring this site for ideas as well haha :)

I bought a flood light for her tank but will probably have to upgrade when we make her larger cage. She isn't a jumper so im not worried about that but her basking light will be above her cage not in it. im going to use my old stand for it.

I recently ordered her reptisun uvb in 36" and for now it will go all the way across her cage but wont in her new one. I also bought an under cabinet fixture on amazon because couldn't find one for under 50 at home depot or Wal-Mart!(got it for $18 on amazon!!)

You have no idea how much help you've been and how grateful I am!

and really she doesn't get many waxies at all but im not going to give them to her anymore. I may try some roaches soon to see if she will eat something other than worms but I want to start ordering different worms because I don't know of another supply shop besides petsmart or petco in town. So we'll see! Thanks for all the help!

-Cheyenne
 
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