Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

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Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

Postby ChristGilley » Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:04 am

lright, guys, I'm wondering if there's something I'm doing wrong. Rhaeny is more than active. Constantly wondering her enclosure, eats like crazy and loves exploring my bed when we have bonding time. But I'm wondering if I'm giving her too much supplement or she's getting too much exposure to UVB. Although she's VERY active, she constantly looks tired. She looks alert, but at times, her eyes look like she's tired. Her bathroom habits have been consistent every day, she has a ReptiSun T5 10.0 that is about 10 inches from her favorite spot in the enclosure and it is not filtered through the mesh. Her hot side sits around 110 and her enclosure temp goes down to about 70 at night. I've been dusting all of her meals (which I know isn't the recommended so I'm cutting it back) but I think the issue is I sometimes leave her UVB on for over 12 hours. As I said, she is very active but she just looks tired sometimes and her walk is a little weird looking. Not like unsteady or anything, but just like she's constantly stepping on something. It could just be the textured mat, and I might take it out and opt for tile or another form of mat that is the problem. Any thought are welcome! I've done a lot of changing to this set up in the past so I believe her enclosure and supplements are fine, save the mat, and I'm more concerned with the dosage of UVB and supplements she's getting. Thanks!
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Re: Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

Postby claudiusx » Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:31 am

How far is the uvb from the rest of the tank? EG. Bulb to floor?

You can over supplement and you can over expose to uvb. IMO 10 inches is too close for a t5.

This doesn't necessarily mean any of this is related to the behavior you're seeing.

-Brandon
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Re: Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

Postby ChristGilley » Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:39 am

claudiusx wrote:How far is the uvb from the rest of the tank? EG. Bulb to floor?

You can over supplement and you can over expose to uvb. IMO 10 inches is too close for a t5.

This doesn't necessarily mean any of this is related to the behavior you're seeing.

-Brandon

Bulb to floor is probably another 2-3 inches. I think I may have been over dusting as well as not having a set schedule on her lights. She is still a very healthy and active dragon. She hasn't shed at all and I've had her just over 2 weeks, so maybe she's getting ready to go in shed? I'm scheduling a normal checkup appointment with my vet anyway so I can raise these concerns then as well
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Re: Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

Postby claudiusx » Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:13 am

So only 12 inches away throughout the rest of the tank is really a lot of uv exposure. There's no place where your dragon can escape the harmful rays. 12 inches is what I'd aim for at the basking spot, with 15-20 throughout the rest of the tank so that the dragon can be exposed to shade level uv and no UV if desired.

That's why I really don't like this notion floating around of the stronger bulbs always being better. The stronger bulbs are only better if they work well with your tank setup. If they don't then the t8s are better bulbs.

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Re: Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

Postby ChristGilley » Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:17 am

claudiusx wrote:So only 12 inches away throughout the rest of the tank is really a lot of uv exposure. There's no place where your dragon can escape the harmful rays. 12 inches is what I'd aim for at the basking spot, with 15-20 throughout the rest of the tank so that the dragon can be exposed to shade level uv and no UV if desired.

That's why I really don't like this notion floating around of the stronger bulbs always being better. The stronger bulbs are only better if they work well with your tank setup. If they don't then the t8s are better bulbs.

-Brandon

The problem with the T8 was that I had to hang it inside the enclosure for the optimum UV exposure. I think raising it will be a tad easier for me but I can look and do some comparisons. I had done research on the different distances for each bulb and 14 inches was the max I had seen, but I will definitely look to raise another couple of inches so she's not getting irradiated by UV. Thanks for the input!
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Re: Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

Postby claudiusx » Mon Jun 17, 2019 12:06 pm

That's the issue though is no one knows what the optimal exposure is. Graphs and charts you see online are just peoples best guesses or comparisons to uvi levels in their native habitat. No scientific testing has been done to determine just how much artificial exposure is needed for adequate d3 synthesis.
For decades we kept t8s on top of screens and didn't have issues with malabsorption of calcium or MBD.

Im rambling at this point. My point is use your own judgement. if you think your dragon is getting over exposed, remedy it. If you think your dragon is underexposed, remedy it.

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Re: Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

Postby ChristGilley » Mon Jun 17, 2019 12:09 pm

claudiusx wrote:That's the issue though is no one knows what the optimal exposure is. Graphs and charts you see online are just peoples best guesses or comparisons to uvi levels in their native habitat. No scientific testing has been done to determine just how much artificial exposure is needed for adequate d3 synthesis.
For decades we kept t8s on top of screens and didn't have issues with malabsorption of calcium or MBD.

Im rambling at this point. My point is use your own judgement. if you think your dragon is getting over exposed, remedy it. If you think your dragon is underexposed, remedy it.

-Brandon

Ramble away, it's useful information. I will try raising it a few more inches and see how she reacts. She is very active and way more awake looking today but I will still find a way to secure it a few inches higher and go from there. It's good to know that I'm not over supplementing her food. I only do one small pinch of the 2 different kinds of powders and mix it together.I also need to get some covering for sides and back of the enclosure as she does glass surf when she's bored
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Re: Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

Postby claudiusx » Mon Jun 17, 2019 12:13 pm

That's probably the best you can do at this point. Make 1 change and see how it effects your dragon after a few days or a week. If their is a change for the better, great! If not, you can always move the uv bulb back without any harm being done but you'll at least know what works for you and your dragon. :)

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Re: Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

Postby ChristGilley » Mon Jun 17, 2019 12:24 pm

claudiusx wrote:That's probably the best you can do at this point. Make 1 change and see how it effects your dragon after a few days or a week. If their is a change for the better, great! If not, you can always move the uv bulb back without any harm being done but you'll at least know what works for you and your dragon. :)

-Brandon

I really appreciate your information and input. I will give that a try and see what comes.Even with looking kinda tired, she is still one of the most active and healthy dragons I've had. Didn't realize how much of a difference getting one from a breeder would make
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Re: Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

Postby ChristGilley » Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:36 pm

The great mystery of Rhaeny has been solved! I got home from work today and she came running out to eat and I noticed that her color was much brighter and that she had been in the process of getting to shed off her tail when I got home. She was going into shed and has almost completed her first shed with me :) just that pesky tail shed to go!
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Re: Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

Postby Drache613 » Wed Jun 19, 2019 6:05 pm

Hello,

Shedding almost always makes them extra tired & grouchy. LOL A lot of them tend to slow
down on eating, too.
I agree, the T5 should be 12 or so inches from her, but you can keep it mounted underneath
of the screen too, alongside of your basking light.
A lot of the health issues these days are also from inbreeding, too. They are so inbred, that
they have absorption issues no matter what people do.

Tracie
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Re: Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

Postby ChristGilley » Wed Jun 19, 2019 6:15 pm

Drache613 wrote:Hello,

Shedding almost always makes them extra tired & grouchy. LOL A lot of them tend to slow
down on eating, too.
I agree, the T5 should be 12 or so inches from her, but you can keep it mounted underneath
of the screen too, alongside of your basking light.
A lot of the health issues these days are also from inbreeding, too. They are so inbred, that
they have absorption issues no matter what people do.

Tracie

I have another thread just introducing her, she came from a good breeder and is very healthy and happy. I think it was just the shedding starting that made her so tired looking. She's much more awake looking now that she's almost done, ate 30 roaches in one go!
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Re: Quick Supplement and Lighting Question

Postby Drache613 » Thu Jun 20, 2019 10:35 am

Hello,

Terrific, I am so happy she is doing well now! Shedding always seems to disrupt their lives
in some way or another. LOL.
I guess her hunger strike is about over with then.

Tracie
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