Dewey's Sick With a Poor Prognosis

Dewey has had to go to the vets several times for wheezing. With meds it's always cleared up, but would return months later. This year he went in Jan/Feb and was put on Ciprofloxacin (sp?) and it cleared up until last month when it started again. I brought him back and he was put on it again. It helped, but he's still wheezing and sounding congested. I brought him to the best tonight and the news was not good.

The vet did an X-Ray and said that he has a lot of fluid in his lungs and not a lot of lung function. He said there could be many causes... bacteria (though he doubts is since he just came off the Ciprofloxacin), a virus (he also doubts that since nothing's changed here recently and since it's a recurring thing), then he said it could be heart disease or even cancer. He said cancer's usually seen in older beardies (Dewey's only 3) so he's not sure it would be that and he also said if it was there's really nothing that we could do. He couldn't tell what his heart looks like because there's so much fluid in his lungs. He suggested to start that we try him on a diuretic for 7 days to see if there's any change. So I have to give him .05ml furosemide twice daily as well as keeping him hydrated. He apologized at the end of the appointment and told me that unfortunately the prognosis for Dewey is poor to fair at best. I've been crying ever since.

I don't even know where to go from here. He sounds horrible. He fights like heck to take his meds, but I am getting it in him. I just wish I could fix him.

I do have a question though. He won't drink out of a bowl. I either have to force it down or see if he'll drink from his bath water. If I have to force it, how much water should I give him?

I'll keep you posted on his progress.

EDIT: Something just occured to me. A few weeks ago after I bathed Dewey I fed him. I usually don't feed him after a bath because it's normally so late, but I had just gotten his favorite worms so I wanted to treat him. When he went to grab one a pool full of water fell out of his mouth. He did "drink" while he was in the water, but apparently he did not swallow. Is it possible that he's done that before and that causes this? Meaning, since I don't really feed him after a bath he'd basically fall asleep without swallowing the water. Could it trickle down and into his lungs? If this is the case would the diuretic clear his lungs out? I hope this is what's happening and this diuretic will fix it. At least I would now know how to prevent it from happening again. Should I call the vet and explain this to him? This episode happened after he was already started on his meds last month.

2nd EDIT: I gave Dewey his first does of the furosemide and a little bit of water. He fell asleep nuzzled against my neck so I just moved him and tucked him into bed. I put him on one of his logs which has a little bit of an incline. I have his head facing down. I've been reading that can help drain his lungs of fluids. Please correct me if I shouldn't be doing that.

Oh geez, I don't know about the water, I just wanted to let you know I am keeping Dewey in my thoughts and prayers!

Have you tried increasing the temps of his viv? Sometimes higher temps would force them to gape which would in turn help them dry out their lungs.
I'm surprised that the Cipro didn't clear his lungs of the fluids.

As I had already said in my PM, I truly hope Dewey would prove the vet wrong.
{{ hugs }}

No, I haven't turned his temps up yet. I thought this would be a simple fix with meds or I would've researched and posted sooner. I'm absolutely shocked that he got the diagnosis he got.

I will change the bulbs to get more heat in there tomorrow. I don't have a night heating light, should I get one to keep it warmer at night too? It's normally in the mid 70's in his viv at night. Is there a certain night lamp you would recommend?

I never use a night heat source, as their viv temps never get lower than ~72°F. But if you feel the 70s are too cool, you could simply use a ceramic heat emitter (CHE) (probably should use the 60 watt so it won't get too hot) and not have to worry about a light bothering him at night.

I agree, you should keep his nite time temps up to about 80..with a ceramic heat emmiter..this will help him out. I truly hope Dewey gets better. Will keep you both in my prayers,,
Kelly

Thanks, I'm going to get a ceramic heater tonight to use. He seemed to have slept great on the log with his head pointed down. I'm not sure of the angle he should be at though. I want to say he's at about a 30° where I put him. Should I make it a bit steeper?

I gave him his meds this morning and put him in the bath tub. He didn't drink any, but he did go potty almost immediately. I gave him 1ml of water through a syringe before I headed out for work. I spoke to the vet tech and was told to give him 2-3ml of a water every 3-4 hours so when I go home for lunch I'll give him some more and will also be bringing him outside to get some real sun if the clouds haven't already taken over.

I really hope he pulls through this. To look at him, you'd never know he was sick. He's alert and bright eyed for the most part. It's just his wheezing and you can hear the rattling noise as he breaths. Poor Dewey. He's not even 3 years old yet and he's this sick!

Alright, so Dewey seems to be getting better. Here's what I've been doing for him so far.

- Giving him .05ml Furosemide twice daily (since Thursday night so he just go this 4th dose).
- Giving him 2ml of water through a syringe every 4 hours.
- Running a dehumidifier right next to his viv 24/7 (humidity has been sitting steady at 30% since yesterday).
- Thursday night I positioned him on an incline so his head was facing down, but last night he refused to stay like that so I let him be as he wanted to be.
- Using a black light bulb at night (they were out of CHE's so I grabbed the light bulb). I point Dewey facing the opposite direction and put him under an overhang so the light isn't hitting his eyes. His viv was at 85 all night last night.

Today I called a local reptile shop since my vet was closed to get their opinion on if I should bring Dewey outside today. It's definitely warm enough, but the humidity is on the high side (I think it was around 52%). After explaining his situation they said that the benefit of the real sun would most outweigh the humidity. They suggested that I bring him outside for an hour unless it made him worst. Well, I gave him an hour and 15 minutes and he really seemed to enjoy it. He gaped a lot, but didn't wheeze once and he even wanted to walk around (harnessed of course). So we walked the yard at his pace. At one point he actually jumped up onto a wooden ledge and went to the bathroom. I have never seen him really pee before, but he definitely peed today! It must be the diuretic kicking in. He let go of a lot of liquid.

His breathing is getting better. I didn't notice any real rattling or wheezing while he was outside. However, when I put him back in his viv he did wheeze a few times. He still has his appetite for worms. I'm trying not to over do it, but don't want to starve him either so I gave him a couple.

I'm feeling more optomistic at this point. I think he's still got a ways to go, but he does seem to be improving.

Great update!

The incline would help with draining his lungs of fluids, so if he wants to rest like that, let him.
The higher temps will continue to aid in his recovery, so keep the night temps at 80'ish until he lets you know that he no longer like it.

Hello Mandy,

So Dewey did alright outside? I hope the humidity didn't bother him.
The basking temperatures of 112 are ok, but borderline. Just watch them to be sure they don't get any higher than that. You don't want to completely overheat him while he is on a diuretic, either.

I hope he is feeling better soon!

Tracie

Thanks guys. I'm so relieved that he had such a good day. He really did amazing today considering how bad off he was. He only wheezed a few times shortly after I brought him inside. Aside from that he was quiet. No clicking, rattling, sneezing, nothing... just silently basking!

I've been wanting to cuddle with him so badly, but know he needs his heat lights so I only held him for about 20 minutes tonight after his lights went out. Once he was asleep I put him back in his viv on the incline and he's still out like a light so hopefully he'll stay there overnight.

I'll keep you updated on his progress.

So happy to hear Dewey is doing better!! Hopefully he will continue to improve and be right as rain in no time!
Kelly

Thought I'd post a quick update on Dewey. He seems to be having ups and downs. Since we've had him on the diuretic, he seems to have more energy, but you can still hear the fluid build up in his lungs from time to time. It's mostly first thing in the morning although I did hear it a little bit last night too.

Tracie and I have been going back and forth on getting a nebulizer to try on him, but after talking to my vet we opted to go a different route for now. The vet is still leaning more towards it being a heart issue and not pneumonia. So, Dewey finishes this round of the diuretic on Thursday and then on Saturday morning he'll be going in for a recheck. During the recheck we'll be getting another X-Ray done and possibly an ultrasound to check his heart.

Hopefully, we'll have more answers on what's going on Saturday. It's going to be a long nerve racking week until then.

Mandy, I'm sure you had explained this already, but I can't seem to remember or find where it was mentioned.
Why does the vet still think that it's a heart issue? If Dewey's lungs are still filled with fluids, and the x-ray didn't show anything other than issues with the lungs, what did she see that indicated a heart problem??

The X-Ray that my vet took of Dewey only showed his lungs which were full of fluids. He could not see his heart. The X-Ray that he took was looking straight down onto Dewey. He said he could attempt to get another X-Ray where Dewey would be on his side with his front legs positioned in front of him so he could see a side view and could also try an ultrasound. He said that he's seen several reptiles with fluid in their lungs clear up nicely with just using a diuretic for 7 days, at least until a recheck could be done. He's aware that cost is a factor and suggested we start with the diuretic ($37 vs $300-$400 for x-ray/ultrasound). I'm kicking myself in the butt now for not just getting them done, but I'm still paying off my dog's vet bills from his ER fiasco last year and my other dog just had close to $700 worth of dental work done last week so money is an issue right now. I will be charging Dewey's next appt. What's a little more debt right?

Possible reasons for the fluid that he gave me were that it could be a bacterial infection which he doubted because the ciprofloxacin didn't work. It could be a virus which he also doubted because I've been his only owner and nothing new has changed in our environment nor has he gone out anywhere other than our yard. He said it could be a fungus, but doubted that (I can't remember his reason). Then he said it could possibly be cancer which he doubted because it's more rare and that he normally sees that in older beardies. The last scenario he said it could be was heart disease. At this point I was kind of in shock so I don't really remember much of what was said after that.

This vet is probably the most recommended for "exotic" animals in NH so I'm trusting his guidance and judgement. I've been a client of his since 2000 when I had ferrets and he's always been great. I really wanted to get Dewey in sooner for recheck, but due to my work schedule and the vets schedule Sat morning was the only time we could connect.