Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from Vet?

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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby kingofnobbys » Wed Jun 27, 2018 6:28 am

May help him to get hold of some CalciVet ( a liquid calcium solution designed for birds but is also great for calcium deficient reptile , they like the taste (is sweet tasting) and is given orally by measured syringe based on the body weight of the reptile each day). http://vetafarm.com.au/product/calcivet/


I also recommend changing over to paper toweling while he's being treated for GIT parasites , and replace the paper bedding daily or everytime he poos - this will help reduce the change of his reinfecting himself when he has contact with spores/eggs in the poo.

Also recommend nudging up his temperatures a wee bit , nothing over 40 degC though , this will help boost his metabolism and immune system.

Also consider getting him onto some VetaFarm Reptile Crittacare (a liquid food) ,this will help build him back up and aid his recovery. http://vetafarm.com.au/product/crittacare-reptile/

If he's now on antiparasitic med , I expect an antibiotic is part of the treatment , so worth getting some http://vetafarm.com.au/product/synbiotic-avian/
Keep us posted.
CBDs: Puff (M)(RIP 10Dec2015 @ 3.2 yrs old (aneurism)),Rex (F)(RIP 16Mar2017 @ 4.6 yrs old,Toothless (M)(sudden unexplained death RIP 26Nov2017) @ 2.1 yrs old.Peppa (F) (born 15Nov2015).
EBTSs : George & Mildred (born july 2010).
EWSs : Lucky (M)(wild juvenile), cat attack rescue, fatal SI RIP 21Jul2010.Wriggles (F)(rescued injured),thought she was a big lizard, 7-8 yrs old, died in her sleep, RIP 2Feb2016). Fluffy (F) rescued 14Nov2017 about 4 yrs old . .
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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby Drache613 » Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:32 pm

Hello,

It sounds like he is starting to do better now, that's great! Just focus on that first, then maybe
you can get him tested for adeno also. That would answer more questions as well.
A new video would be helpful, too.
Shedding is a good sign also & has the tendency to affect their appetites, too.
Hopefully his coordination will improve more over time. Keep us posted on him.

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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby xHagiaSophia » Tue Jul 03, 2018 2:26 pm

Sorry it took me so long to get a video. Here Arbiter is 15 days into the liquid calcium the vet has him on. He still moves weird of course but does seem to be doing better.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zjlcGT7EFOg
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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby xHagiaSophia » Tue Jul 03, 2018 2:27 pm

Here is the second one. I recorded it as I came into the room so you guys can see how he gets hyper excited when he see us. He can not control his limbs when this happens. This seems to be much better as well however. It was something that would happen everytime he moved. Now it only happens when we come into the room usually. I worry about the adv and if this is a sign of it or just a result of the MBD. As far as him staring up kinda in this one, that worried me too, but he only does it when we come into the room and he is basking so close to the glass. It is as if he sits there to watch for people coming in and out. If he is out of his tank or in any other part of it however he does not stare up...so hopefully this is not stargazing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRa-Sn8 ... e=youtu.be
Last edited by xHagiaSophia on Tue Jul 03, 2018 3:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby xHagiaSophia » Tue Jul 03, 2018 2:34 pm

This final one is from 5 days ago. He climbs a little in it. We are trying to not allow him to climb very much though, just in case since his bones are so soft right now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VDSANZK ... e=youtu.be
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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby CooperDragon » Tue Jul 03, 2018 2:55 pm

He's really getting around pretty well and looks like he's got some fire in him. Hopefully those bones will strengthen up soon and will be able to keep up with him on his adventures =)
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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby kyleena29 » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:15 pm

Hello, I just wanted to add a bit more advice. I'm not sure if anyone mentioned this but taking him outside for real sunshine would also greatly benefit him more than a bulb. If you could take him out for at least 30 min a day or more (weather permitting of course) it would help him out a lot.
I am happy to hear his is doing better and that you are doing all you can to help him out. He sounds so adorable that he gets excited to see you. One of my beardies has ADV. Thankfully he is not having issues so far, he is almost 2.5yrs old. I would not worry about it too much right now. From the sounds of it yours is not having seizures. ADV can have different effects to the body, such as how they absorb calcium or other nutrients, or their immune system, or it may not really have any effect on them at all. My little guy quit eatting for a while which is what led me to get him tested. There is not a whole lot you can do about it but support the immune system with supplements like bee pollen. Hopefully a cure can be found. There are many beardies with ADV and owners don't know they have it. Keep in mind that some test results can be negative so you will want to test every few months a few times to be sure. It can be difficult to say what led to the MBD. It could of been the coil bulb or absorption issues, parasites robbing him of nutrients, who knows. But all the advice given to you so far is great and I would just try to get him some real sunshine as well.
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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby Drache613 » Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:21 pm

Hello,

He does have spunk doesn't he? At least he is trying to get around & looks like he is doing
better. I agree, outdoor sun would be terrific, daily, if possible.
I hope he continues to improve for you. Definitely keep us updated on him.

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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby xHagiaSophia » Wed Jul 04, 2018 4:57 am

He does have some fire and some spunk and he is so sweet. On taking him outside everyday my husband said to ask if he will need his tube UVB as well. Because he read on the internet that if taken outside for 30 to 60 minutes a day that is their daily UVB requirements. Seems like they would still need the tube, but he says that is what he read the other day when he was reading about building Arbiter an outdoor box..So better to ask and be sure. Also, any suggestions as well on how to take him outside? Like I said my husband was looking at building him a box with the same hardware cloth we have on top of the tank right now. I have seen others use mesh laundry baskets, which may not be safe, and then others I have seen use nothing but a leash, but with his MBD I would be afraid of putting him on a leash, that it may injure him somehow. Also we live in GA so it is usually 80-90 percent humidity here outside. That wont have an effect on him from being out in it only 30 minutes a day will it?
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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby CooperDragon » Wed Jul 04, 2018 9:10 am

Some sunshine will be good for him. Just hold him on your lap outside for a while. It's a great supplement but he will still need a good UVB tube in his tank. Not his whole tank though. Just enough to spread UVB over the basking area. He should have areas with lower temps and little to no UVB available as well because he won't want to be basking constantly.
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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby Drache613 » Thu Jul 05, 2018 1:25 pm

Hello,

Yes, since he is having bone issues now, he definitely needs indoor UVB exposure as well
even if you do get him outside in the sun.
They normally don't bask all day long, so he can choose where to bask & get what he needs.
The humidity wont hurt him, since it wont be for all day long. The hardware cloth is great
because he can receive direct sunlight right through that.
Let us know how Arbiter is doing!

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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby xHagiaSophia » Fri Jul 20, 2018 4:46 pm

Updating on Arbiter...We went back to the vet today...He has been on liquid calcium for 30 days..He was also in the middle of a massive shed which she helped him with. Anyway, she said she would have expected a little more progress in his mobility than she saw. But his bones look good and much stronger now...He has not fractures or anything still either...no humps or lumps as well. She thinks what is wrong is neurological and thinks it is something similar to Cerebral palsy in humans. She says she has been reading and researching and from other vets as well across the country there is something going on from specific breeders, she does not know who in particular, that are selling dragons that have something similar to CP. She said some dragons are doing well with it, some are not and Arbiter appears to be on that has it but is doing well with it. So it is neurologically genetic...But as long as he has not had seizures which she says is sometimes common, he is fine. She also said he is nice and fat...maybe too fat...but his mobility is a little poor still and his legs have little resistance when tugged so that says to her it is this other thing. It is not ADV she said. He also had a few pinworms which she says is ok and no coccidia. She said his quality of life looks to be good though he will just be a bit handicap, which is ok...We have a son who has CP. And she said for us to do little exercises with his legs....and continue the calcium for another 30 days and she will check him again...if all is well then he will only need to come back once a year....Anyway, have any of you heard anything of dragons having a form of CP?
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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby Drache613 » Fri Jul 20, 2018 4:56 pm

Hello,

Well, since his quality of life is good, all you need to do is continue what you are doing &
just keep him happy. His health overall sounds like it's fine. Sometimes if they do suffer
from early metabolic bone disease it can cause some minimum neurological damage that
is irreversible. It is unfortunate when this happens. However, if he can still get around,
eat, go to the bathroom, etc, there's no reason he can't live a good life with you!
I would go for water therapy to try & strengthen his legs up some if possible. Just keep
trying to get him stronger. I would personally keep him on liquid calcium as a maintenance
past the 30 days. Just 3 times per week would be fine, as long as his calcium levels are up
& where they need to be.
That's good to hear his pinworm levels weren't bad but that he doesn't have coccidia! I am
sure that he will improve some more, but it is very slow for them.

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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby xHagiaSophia » Wed Jul 25, 2018 4:04 pm

We will do that and I will update again in 30 days when he sees the Vet again. She said that would be it then yearly visits. As far as eating on his own he does well. With the bugs he does spasm and struggle after chasing the first few but he still gets them, he just needs us to help direct them his direction so he does not have to run as much. And we are also going to start the water therapy, with us right there watching him of course. I will let you know how he does soon.
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Re: Juvenile Bearded Dragon with Poor Prognosis given from V

Postby xHagiaSophia » Wed Jul 25, 2018 4:09 pm

[Click image to enlarge]



Here he is, enjoying the best of both worlds lol...laying in the water and eating his salad...We are using a food dish for his water cause we do not want him to flip over and the water dishes are so deep...these are more shallow plus it gives him room to go potty cause like most Dragons I have read about, he likes to go in the water..we take it out of course though rather than leaving it in with him all the time...Anyway, just wanted to show you how he is doing, how big he is getting and that he does pretty good eating too.
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