Stomach/Rib Muscle Spasms

[Karlymcole]

Has anyone ever had a dragon have muscle spasms around the belly or rib area? My male 2 year old dragon has been having them since Sunday. He woke up like that. Blood work was taken (waiting on results) as well as an x ray (radiologist will read it tomorrow) but the vet didn’t see anything alarming in the x ray results. No tumors or fluid build up. I have stumped 3 vets so far! When he has the spasms It causes him to barely be able to walk, yet minutes later he can walk normal. He also spasms when I touch him, but not when he is in the tub. He popped friday, sunday and today with no issues. Im at a loss here. Ive already spent 800.00 and seem to be no closer to any answers. I cant even google as no one seems to have had this happen before. I have a video if needed of the spasms I can email. He also does not have mbd and these are not tremors from low calcium. Im so confused and so worried! I have ONE more vet who only specializes in exotics if his blood comes back normal. We also did a fecal and that was Negative. He is currently on a dewormer just in case, an antibiotic, and an anti inflammatory/pain reliever. He also had a calcium shot today. Im honestly hoping something shows in his bloodwork just so I can have an idea and a chance to possibly fix this! If everything is normal, im back to 0.

 

[CooperDragon]

It can be tough to see an issue and not have an answer or treatment for it. Do you see any other signs of a problem? How is his behavior and appetite etc? Do the spasms look like a full on seizure? Or are they isolated to a small area around the ribs? Sometimes I see small muscle twitches along my dragon's jawline or arms but they aren't too frequent and I just chalk that up to being similar to spasms we get sometimes. If you can post a video of it, that may be helpful. You can upload video to a host like vimeo or youtube and post a link here.

It might be good to review overall diet in case this is caused by a nutritional deficit of some sort. If the spasms are very intrusive like a seizure, it might be worth having an atadenovirus test done.

Moved by moderator from General Discussion to Health.

 

[AHBD]

It can just be normal harmless muscle spasms like Cooper said, I've seen it in my own dragons. Please do post a video for reference though.

 

[Karlymcole]

So, he had an X-ray done as well as a blood test. X-ray looked pretty normal and we are waiting for a final call from the radiologist. His blood also all came back normal. The spasms are on and off all day, to the point now where if he has one while walking, he has to stop and stay still, or walk while having one and you can tell he is unbalanced. I uploaded the videos to my YouTube channel so you can further see. I have them unlisted, but with the links you should be able to see them. It has been going on for 4 days now and he just isn't himself. He is still eating his super worms and roaches, he isn't chasing them though like he used to as his balance is off when he has this spasm. He eats greens (different types depending what the store has) that I offer to him everyday. His calcium levels were good and he even got a calcium shot. I am at a loss. I have seen a few videos posted here that were similar, but unfortunately, no one ever came back to update what the cause was if they found out. We are set to go to one more exotic vet on friday who ONLY deals with exotic animals. If he has no idea, then I am stumped. I can not tell if he is in pain or not. He has been pooping normal, eating normal, he just isn't as active. He has a tank on the floor that has a side opening, ( I work form home so I can watch him) he used to come out and run around my house, but ever Since sunday he has not. He went to bed Saturday normal and woke up like this. MBD was ruled out and the X ray showed no signs of it. He does not do this when he is sleeping. I also felt like he looks/feels bloated. The vet agreed he felt "Full" but nothing on the x ray showed any fluid in his stomach.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQgKEfNDfu4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4bFKnqIdXw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdSFwJg_Ks4
His spine is not always in that position. It just happened to go like that as he had this spasm. He also has the spasms on both sides.

I am trying everything. I do not know if he is in pain, but I wouldn't let him suffer if he was. I have already spent 1K on him to still have no answers. I am willing to do whatever I have to to just have some type of explination.

 

[AHBD]

Yeah those are pretty prominent but I don't think they are distressing or painful. If it was , his beard would be black. What size and how many roaches does he eat at a time ?

 

[Karlymcole]

They are small Dubia roaches. He only maybe eats 2 or 3 at a time and then wants worms. I usually give him about 6/8 super worms every other day. He doesn't really care for the roaches. I only get them to try and offer something different than just a horn worm as a treat and super worms. He hasn't gone completely black at all. The only time is when I give him meds and he is having a fit. I am just at a loss as to what it could be. I am starting to think maybe neurological at this point since everything else is perfect. The vet said he is "healthy" which makes this so confusing. If this exotic only vet has no idea, I guess I need to just let him be with it and if I see he is in pain, start making decisions then. Thank you all for the responses too! I have been trying to find answers everywhere.

 

[AHBD]

I know it's stressful to you but don't be too upset, this might just be a phase that passes. Waiting is difficult but just be patient. Please update anytime !

 

[Karlymcole]

We have one more vet on Friday. Fingers crossed he has some explanation lol. I will update then

 

[AHBD]

O.K, I'll look forward to hearing what the new vet says !

 

[Karlymcole]

Im definitely going to ask for an Atadenovirus test to be done when he goes friday. Would neurological symptoms just come on overnight though? I wouldn’t say they are a seizure, but they are definitely more than a small spasm.

 

[Drache613]

Hello,

That is very odd & I'm sure it is very annoying for him!
Which UVB lighting do you use? How often do you use calcium & other supplements?
Do you have a copy of the blood test results or have you gotten them done yet?
I couldn't tell just in the videos if he could walk or climb very well. Does this affect his
movement at all?

Tracie

 

[Karlymcole]

I was told the blood results over the phone. The vet said everything was normal. Im going to a strictly just exotic vet tomorrow who will also look over the blood. I will see if I can get a copy!!! We also did x rays which I was told looked normal. Just waiting for the final report from the radiologist. I still feel as if he has fluid, but the vet said according to the x ray he doesn’t see any.

He has a 75 gallon tank and I have a tube reptisun 10.0 t5 light on the top of his tank. I believe it is a 32 inch light fixture and the size of the uvb is 24”. I change it every 6 months.

He gets calcium 2/3 times a week. I have a powder calcium with d3. I also have a spray calcium without d3. And a beta carotene vitamin that I spray once a week on his greens. The bloodwork according to the vet said the calcium levels were right in the middle as they should be. He also got a calcium shot.

He can walk and climb, but since he is having this side spasm its “off” if that makes sense. When he isnt spasming, he can walk normally. He is also more tired than normal. He just wants to be lazy and stay in the tank which he wasn’t like before sunday.

I have a tank on the floor and I work from home. I would leave the one side open (its a slide opening) and he would come out and run around my house and go back himself! He has not done that since sunday when this started.

He is still eating. He gets superworms 5/8 depending on his mood every other day. And he gets greens every day that he may or may not eat. I also offer dubia roaches to change it up, but he isn’t that much of a fan. Only difference is he wont chase them anymore. I have to just put the worms in front of him as the spasms make it hard sometimes for him to walk. His head does not spasm nor his legs. Only his abdominal area. Also no tail spasms.

He pooped for me friday before the spasms, sunday, and Tuesday in the tub. He has no difficulty with that.

The vca hospital I went to recommended me to an exotic only vet which we have an appointment tomorrow

Im wondering if atadenovirus could just pop up overnight ? Thats the only thing i see with neurological issues.

Im just hoping he isn’t in any pain. Im hoping for some type of reasons to why. I really dont want to be put into a situation where I have to pick if he lives or I put him to sleep with absolutely no explanation on the cause.

Here are two more videos from today of these spasms. Some are more intense than these. The spasms have not slowed up or gotten worse since Sunday. They remain the same on and off all day.

https://youtu.be/wP1ayt53Hac

https://youtu.be/YnvMV-Sh4xU

 

[Karlymcole]

Here is the picture of his bloodwork. Trying to get his x ray images.

https://ibb.co/RQ2DJg0

 

[Karlymcole]

Hello,

That is very odd & I'm sure it is very annoying for him!
Which UVB lighting do you use? How often do you use calcium & other supplements?
Do you have a copy of the blood test results or have you gotten them done yet?
I couldn't tell just in the videos if he could walk or climb very well. Does this affect his
movement at all?

Tracie

Here is a link for the blood work! Waiting on the x ray.

https://ibb.co/RQ2DJg0

 

[Karlymcole]

Hello,

That is very odd & I'm sure it is very annoying for him!
Which UVB lighting do you use? How often do you use calcium & other supplements?
Do you have a copy of the blood test results or have you gotten them done yet?
I couldn't tell just in the videos if he could walk or climb very well. Does this affect his
movement at all?

Tracie

Here are his x rays. https://ibb.co/2sKB2GV
https://ibb.co/h2Pdf1D
https://ibb.co/gF2bb0v

Im still thinking fluid…. But idk what im honestly looking at here. Also, on his spine, I see something at the top. Still waiting for the report from a radiologist but in person the vet said he did not see anything out of the ordinary, but when I look up bearded dragon x-rays I do not see that thing on the spine like I do here.